leaving_quietly

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Posts by leaving_quietly

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  180

  Please post new forum feedback or questions here

  by Simon in

  1. forum
  2. tech-support

  well, the switchover happened - there were a couple of things i had to fix which meant the posting was disabled for longer than i planned but it's now enabled and some people have already posted.. if you have any questions about the new format or suggestions on how to improve it, please post them here.. if you are having trouble signing in or posting then you'll need to email me instead.. many thanks to everyone for their patience during the changeover !.

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  leaving_quietly

  Nice job.

  I noticed that when I click on my username, it shows a much few number of posts and topics than I actually had. Is this because it's still synchronizing to the cloud? (Mine currently says 11 posts in 0 topics)
  
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  13

  RNWT Bible Needs to be Revised Again!

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i'll restrain myself from commenting on jw.org's perversion of this scripture - i'll leave that to others.. however, for lurkers and active witnesses here, why not ask one of your local glorious ones to explain how these non-scriptural words found their way into the silver sword, but don't appear in the original greek, or even in the kingdom interlinear.. (2 corinthians 9:13) "through the proof that this relief ministry gives, they glorify god because you are submissive to the good news about the christ, as you publicly declared, and because you are generous in your contribution to them and to all.".

  https://www.blueletterbible.org/bible.cfm?b=2co&c=9&t=kjv#s=t_conc_1087013.

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  leaving_quietly

  If other Bbile versions don't suppoort the WTs deceptions the only choice they had was to write their own.

  Which they freely admit, though under the guise of "restoring God's name".

  "Confess" or "confession" (the word most used in other translations for homologias in this verse) is not a word WTBTS likes to use in association with Christ or God or the good news. It's a perfectly legitimate word, though in the English language, confessing has a negative connotation, as in admitting a wrong. I'll have to do a more in-depth word study, but I'm willing to bet that "confess" or variants in the RNWT only appear contextually with sin. A quick word search in the WT Library CD shows this is probably the case.
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  13

  RNWT Bible Needs to be Revised Again!

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i'll restrain myself from commenting on jw.org's perversion of this scripture - i'll leave that to others.. however, for lurkers and active witnesses here, why not ask one of your local glorious ones to explain how these non-scriptural words found their way into the silver sword, but don't appear in the original greek, or even in the kingdom interlinear.. (2 corinthians 9:13) "through the proof that this relief ministry gives, they glorify god because you are submissive to the good news about the christ, as you publicly declared, and because you are generous in your contribution to them and to all.".

  https://www.blueletterbible.org/bible.cfm?b=2co&c=9&t=kjv#s=t_conc_1087013.

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  leaving_quietly

  I want to add that, thankfully, WTBTS has not linked this verse to the field ministry. It's not an often referenced verse, either. They simply say that submitting to the good news is evidenced by generosity in giving.

  At 2 Corinthians 9:13 contributions made in behalf of needy fellow Christians are shown to be an evidence of an individual’s submissiveness to the good news, it being a Christian obligation to assist needy fellow believers. - it-2 p. 1041

  Yes, the good news of God’s kingdom becomes meaningful to people when they see the effect it has on the personalities of those embracing it, the generosity and love of neighbor that it generates. Such thoughtful service and giving to others not only causes these to feel gratitude toward the human givers but also “overflows in a flood of thanksgiving to God.” It recommends true Christianity as the finest way of life, as true worship of a kind and loving God. - w75 12/1 pp. 718-719
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  13

  RNWT Bible Needs to be Revised Again!

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i'll restrain myself from commenting on jw.org's perversion of this scripture - i'll leave that to others.. however, for lurkers and active witnesses here, why not ask one of your local glorious ones to explain how these non-scriptural words found their way into the silver sword, but don't appear in the original greek, or even in the kingdom interlinear.. (2 corinthians 9:13) "through the proof that this relief ministry gives, they glorify god because you are submissive to the good news about the christ, as you publicly declared, and because you are generous in your contribution to them and to all.".

  https://www.blueletterbible.org/bible.cfm?b=2co&c=9&t=kjv#s=t_conc_1087013.

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  leaving_quietly

  I'm not so sure this is actually an incorrect translation. Biased, yes. Incorrect? Maybe not.

  The Greek word is homologias, which means, "an agreement, confession" (Strong's 3671). The root word is homologeo (Strong's 3670) that has, as one of it's meanings, "I publicly declare". Note this from biblehub.com:

  3671 /homología ("common confession") can refer to the collective agreement of Christians about what God loves and hates – and the courage to proclaim it! See also 3670 (homologéō).

  That said, this is definitely an eisegetical translation... picking the meaning that the organization wants to as to get their biased point across.

  There is another Greek word, anaggelló (Strong's 312), that means "to announce (in detail) -- declare, rehearse, report, show, speak, tell".

  It would be interesting to see what the real differences are between these two words. I don't really know. I'll have to make a project out of it.
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  8

  Who the Great Crowd Are Baptized To

  by lambsbottom in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  great crowd jws are not baptized like the annointed are.

  the great crowd's baptism does not wash them of their sins, making them sinless, until way after armageddon (1,000 year rule).

  but the annointed are washed of their sins being 'sinless', as the recent wt study stated.

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  leaving_quietly

  BTW, all sarcasm aside, my response is the typical one JWs will give you. You have, of course, poked yet another hole in WT theology.
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  8

  Who the Great Crowd Are Baptized To

  by lambsbottom in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  great crowd jws are not baptized like the annointed are.

  the great crowd's baptism does not wash them of their sins, making them sinless, until way after armageddon (1,000 year rule).

  but the annointed are washed of their sins being 'sinless', as the recent wt study stated.

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  leaving_quietly

  Where does wt say this John baptism is only for the gc?

  They don't say this. But they DO say that baptism into Christ's baptism is only for the anointed. Thus, the inference is that the GC are NOT baptized into Christ. The only other option is John's baptism.

  Ok, so if the GC is not baptized into Christ, then they do not have the Spirit of God in them and have no life in them and will NOT be given life.

  Is this what the WT is trying to say?

  Well, no... see... erm... let me explain this to you... ??? Um...

  Only those baptized into Christ are anointed. And those are only the 144,000.

  And, just you never mind what the Bible says. The Greek scriptures were primarily written only for the anointed, so what they say doesn't actually apply to the GC. So, stop asking such silly questions!

  In the decades after the first members of the congregation of anointed Christians were chosen, Jehovah saw fit to have a permanent record made of the earthly ministry of Jesus as well as His dealings with and counsel to first-century anointed Christians. Jehovah thus added the inspired Christian Greek Scriptures to the already existing inspired Hebrew Scriptures. The Hebrew Scriptures were written in the first place for the fleshly nation of Israel during the time that they had a special relationship with God. The Christian Greek Scriptures were written primarily for “the Israel of God,” those anointed as brothers of Christ and spiritual sons of God. Of course, that in no way suggests that non-Israelites could not derive great benefit from studying the Hebrew Scriptures. Similarly, Christians who are not anointed with holy spirit derive immeasurable benefits from studying and living according to the counsel found in the Christian Greek Scriptures. w08 1/15 p. 22 par. 11
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  54

  How do you overcome this JW excuse?

  by EdenOne in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  during one of those meetings that took place before my jc, one of the elders, who was a good friend of mine back then and used to come up with a few outlandish personal views about some teachings, attempted to counter one of my arguments like this:.

  eden - "well, if the truth doesn't change, why is it that what we teach as 'truth' has changed over the years (several examples given)?

  how can we dogmatically claim at any given moment that we have 'the truth' if our teachings keep changing?".

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  leaving_quietly

  Or, "What you just said invalidates Jesus' words at John 4:24: 'God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth'."
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  54

  How do you overcome this JW excuse?

  by EdenOne in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  during one of those meetings that took place before my jc, one of the elders, who was a good friend of mine back then and used to come up with a few outlandish personal views about some teachings, attempted to counter one of my arguments like this:.

  eden - "well, if the truth doesn't change, why is it that what we teach as 'truth' has changed over the years (several examples given)?

  how can we dogmatically claim at any given moment that we have 'the truth' if our teachings keep changing?".

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  leaving_quietly

  If Jehovah allows for a teaching or procedure to persist, it's because He wants it that way

  "So, you're saying that Jehovah WANTS to perpetuate lies? That sounds like a DIFFERENT god in mentioned in the Bible."
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  7

  WT study today - Eph 1:8-10 - the administration, Stage 2

  by Hoffnung in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  in todays wt study (wt 15/jul/2012 p.27 paras 3-4), the society advances ephesians 1:10, which refers to an adminstration, that gathers the things in the heaven and on the earth.

  whereas the bible clearly identifies a double purpose of the adminstration, there is no reason to believe there are also 2 different time frames intended, however the wt explains it this way.

  we are actualliy in the adminstration stage 2, according to the wt.

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  leaving_quietly

  It's worth noting that the word "again" has been removed from the RNWT at both Eph 1:10 and Col 1:20. I'm looking for a way to refute the idea that the "things in the heavens" refers to the 144,000 and the "things on the earth" refer to the great crowd. Obviously, this isn't what Paul had in mind. After all, Christ said all authority had been given him in heaven and on earth. And in Col 1:20, the word used is "reconcile", which means "to restore friendly relations between". This has nothing to do with two groups and their destination.
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  35

  Looks like ABC New York got the okay.

  by truthseekeriam in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://appellatecases.courtinfo.ca.gov/search/case/dockets.cfm?dist=1&doc_id=2025979&doc_no=a136641.

  12/19/2014order filed.

  upon due consideration, the media request of applicant abc news to make a video recording of oral argument in the above-referenced appeal is granted.

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  leaving_quietly

  Erm... how can the applicant make a video recording without a recording device in the courtroom?