Posts by Bobcat

7

Jehovah's Witnesses: A Case Study in Viral Marketing

by Wolfy in

this is an interesting article studying the growth/decline patterns of jw's.

i thought i would pass on the link as it is an interesting read.. .

http://priceonomics.com/jehovahs-witnesses-a-case-study-in-viral-marketing/.

Circuit assembly symposium: help those who have become inactive

by rosyray in

jw
friends

i just discovered that the circuit assembly my family is attending tomorrow contains a symposium entitled:.

help others to seek jehovah's righteousness: those who have become inactive.

i poked around a bit on here and didn't find any comments about this.

Bobcat

cultBgone:

My wife is still dead-set convinced that it was certain actual people who "stumbled " me when actually, I just opened my eyes.

I noticed this too. They have already been told by the Society why you are "inactive" (or whatever label is attatched). It doesn't matter what you say, unless you push the 'apostate' button. Then, suddenly, you become a far more dangerous person, unworthy of being 'helped.'

4

When did the last days start ?

by raymond frantz in

somewhere hidden well within the jw.org exists an article about the last days of the last days of the jewish system of things .when did the last days of the jewish system of things start was it at the pentecost or before that ?

is that important when we compare jesus' days our days as a way to find what will initiate them ?

i wrote a small post in relation to this any extra valid information towards this will be much appreciated.

Bobcat

RF:

These posts here and here have scriptures listed from the NT that show that NT writers viewed the "last days" ("time"/"times"/"hour") as commencing with Jesus' first advent. Hebrews 1:1, 2 is a good example (although the NWT distorts the rendering to hide this).

Hebrews 9:26 speaks of Jesus "manifest[ing] himself once for all time at the conclusion of the systems of things" (note plural "systems of things" or "ages"). From this verse it would appear that, from the NT point of view, all previous eras conclude with the "last days" which start with Jesus' first advent, and culminate when he returns. Acts 17:30, 31 seems to confirm that view (see this thread).

Bobcat

16

An Elder said: 'They're in prison for a reason'

by NAVYTOWN in

jw
friends

several years ago, i was studying the bible (jw literature) with an ms from the local congregation.

i happened to mention that i had several pen pals who were incarcerated in various prisons.

no matter what crimes they committed, i said i saw them as fellow human being who deserved to have a friend to write to.

Bobcat

Terry:

Thanks for that reply. That was a fascinating answer, seeing how it was forged from experience. (I had to read it a couple times - I'll probably read it again.)

It is amazing, given the collective experience available at the time among JWs, that no one bothered to try to prep you for your experience. I'm a little surprised that the WT hadn't come up with a booklet or material to help prepare the brothers for that possibility (aka like the child custody material they have prepared).

Bobcat

29

Bible - War in heaven - Satan cast to earth - Why?

by berrygerry in

reading the oct 1 1953 wt about gog of magog because of the posts about the changes of identity.. basic question:.

why would satan (whether gog or not) be cast to the earth?.

why not cast him to quadrant 4 of the galaxy?.

Bobcat

In connection with the OP's questions and why Satan would be cast to the earth and not some distant star cluster, see these posts here and here.

27

New explanation of Gog of Magog: Two Gogs?

by leaving_quietly in

i just finished watching the recording of the talk at the annual meeting that re-explains gog of magog.

i caught something not previously talked about, that i can recall.. gog of magog is thought to be a coalition of nations that attach god's people during the great tribulation.

this is from ezekiel 38 & 39.. gog and magog in revelation 20 represents those with the same attitude as gog of magog.. thus, the new teaching (maybe not new, but i'll have to research this) is that gog in ezekiel is not the same as gog in revelation 20. two different gogs, happening about a thousand years apart.. .

Bobcat

"Those nations in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Ma′gog" in Rev 20:8 have, at least in more recent explanations by the WT, been seen as different from "Gog [of] the land of Ma′gog, the head chieftain of Me′shech and Tu′bal" of Ezekiel 38:2.

In the Ezekiel account, "Gog" is spoken to as if an individual prince who is manuevered to gather a coalition of nations (from both the north and south of the promised land) to invade a reinhabited Israel.

In the Revelation account Satan is let loose from his prison to gather "those nations in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Ma′gog," who then "encircled the camp of the holy ones and the beloved city."

Some commentators understand a fulfillment of the Ezekiel account just before the Millenium. (The WT is among these - see Revelation Climax chapter 40, page 292, par.22), with something similar to happen after the Millenium. Some commentators understand the Ezekiel account and the Revelation account to be referring to the same thing.

Back during the WWII and previous time the Society viewed "Gog" as 'Satan's right hand man' or Satan's general. For example, the 1940 WT (p.40) says:

Satan exalts himself to the position of supremacy like unto that of the Most High, Jehovah. Gog, the chief officer of Satan, takes the place similar to that occupied by Jesus Christ, the Prince or Ruler or King of the great THEOCRATIC GOVERNMENT. he wicked angels, that have direct influence and power over the nations of the earth, are made to correspond to the angels of Christ Jesus that always serve him and are under his immediate command.--Matt. 25: 31.

[end quote]

Bobcat

40

What is the perfect product to sell to a JW?

by usualusername in

jw
friends

what is the perfect product to sell to a jw?.

cheap?.

exclusive?.

Bobcat

At the moment, JWs seem to be wanting trinkets bearing the "JW.Org" insignia. I recently was given (w/o having asked) a key chain/LED light with JW.Org on it. I guess someone thought I was lacking, like I was a homeless person who needed a handout. (The LED light is bright - so it does have some usefulness.)

Most of these things have a blue back ground with white lettering. But I recently say a round lapel pin with an autumn/leafy background and a white "JW.Org" on it.

I imagine Stoops and Madzay are probably supplying a lot of this stuff.

It is interesting observing this phenomenon taking place from an 'outside' perspective. I was never into the various JW fads that have come and gone over the years (e.g. anodized aluminum to draw helpful energy from the universe), but it is curious to watch it happening after learning TTATT.

Bobcat

16

An Elder said: 'They're in prison for a reason'

by NAVYTOWN in

jw
friends

several years ago, i was studying the bible (jw literature) with an ms from the local congregation.

i happened to mention that i had several pen pals who were incarcerated in various prisons.

no matter what crimes they committed, i said i saw them as fellow human being who deserved to have a friend to write to.

Bobcat

Before I went into prison, I called a Brother on the phone who had recently been paroled after 2 years as a conscientious objector.

I asked for any advice he might help me with.

He was quiet for second or two, and then he said, "No, just do your time and do as you're told."

Terry:

Now that you've had the experience that this other brother had, what advice would you give to someone heading to prison (someone who is one of the 'unlucky ones,' not a criminal)?

And thanks very much for your post.

Bobcat

23

NWT departure from greek meaning

by aintenoughwiskey in

the new jw library app includes the kingdom interlinear.

just by looking up the scriptures at the meeting when i went, revealed the following "departures" from the other translations:.

rev 5:10 "over the earth" vs "upon the earth".

Bobcat

In connection with Rev 20:4 ("the word of God" vs. "speaking about God"), there is an interesting thematic thread running through Revelation that might explain what is meant by "the word of God":

Rev 1:2 . . . [John] bore witness to the word God gave and to the witness Jesus Christ gave . . .

Rev 1:9 . . . because of the word of God and the testimony about Jesus . . .

Rev 6:9 . . . because of the word of God and because of the witness work that they used to have . . .

Rev 12:17 . . . who observe the commandments of God and have the work of bearing witness to Jesus.

Rev 14:12 Here is where it means endurance for the holy ones, those who observe the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Rev 19:10 . . . you and of your brothers who have the work of witnessing to Jesus. Worship God; for the bearing witness to Jesus is what inspires prophesying

Rev 20:4 . . . those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God [lit. the word of God].

Comparing these verses which use a similar formula for describing Christians, I would venture that "the word of God" is equivalent to Rev 12:17, "observe the commandments of God." The rendering, "speaking about God," would seem to take it in a different direction. (Although, to be fair, at least one other translation, the NLT, has something similar to the NWT - see here)

23

NWT departure from greek meaning

by aintenoughwiskey in

the new jw library app includes the kingdom interlinear.

just by looking up the scriptures at the meeting when i went, revealed the following "departures" from the other translations:.

rev 5:10 "over the earth" vs "upon the earth".

Bobcat

In regard to Rev 5:9, the preposition epi can have a spatial meaning (e.g. "on") or a relational meaning (e.g. "over"). The verse can be saying 'where' they are ruling, or it can be referring to their position as rulers, 'over.' In the latter case, they can rule "over" others regardless of where they are ruling from (either heaven or earth).

I would suspect that one's theology would be the determining factor.

Bobcat