Posts by krejames

23

Curious About My Disfellowshipping.

by vajeni82 in

i recently read an interesting thread (is there a 'third' way to leave?

) that talked about fading instead of being df'd or da'd.

i myself had planned to fade, but was df'd instead.

krejames

It's definitely worth asking for your records. Not sure if you're in the UK but if you are, you need to make a Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act 1998. They then have to provide you with a copy of all of your personal information that they held at the time they received your request. If they destroy any after receiving your request it is a criminal offence. They can charge you £10.

(Don't get mixed up with the Freedom of Information Act - that Act only applies to public authorities and doesn't include the right of access to your own personal information - it's just a means to request access to any records held by a public authority or government department relating to its activities).

29

Does the Bible actually condemn Homosexuality for Chrisitans anywhere ?

by Phizzy in

i ask the question because i read a very persuasive article on-line that showed that the apostle paul was not referring to mere homosexual practice in his words in his letters, but to temple prostitution etc, so he was condemning idolatry, not being homosexual per se.. the basic usage of the word that some translations render as "homosexual" and the n.w.t, falling in to the etymology trap, renders "men who lie with men" means temple prostitute.

the account of sodom and gomorrah has been shown on here to be concerned with lack of hospitality being the sin, mistreatment of strangers etc, still a no- no in desert communities.

the whole story may well be a folk story or myth anyway, but it is interesting to see that the sexual acts themselves are not the main thrust (sorry) of yahweh's anger.. the law (leviticus?

krejames

Hi everyone

Lars, I kind of get where you're coming from. But I think heterosexuals (non JWs) are as promiscuous as homosexuals these days. Well in the UK they are anyway. Where I live they'll meet in a bar or club every thurs/friday/sat night and try and get off with someone. Admittedly they don't have the saunas, they don't play with each other in a public lavatory - but they'll go to a club or Kavos or Malia to achieve the same thing.

I have a theory that the reason us gays go through a stage of being obsessed with sex might be because we have grown up trying to suppress our true selves. We become very efficient at leading double lives - because we have to - and we secretly seek out the people that are like us to connect with in any way we can - usually sexually - and then we go back to our "other" life. But generally, in places where it is acceptable to be gay, the dream is still to find someone to "settle down with" and be faithful to.

In homophobic societies there will obviously still be the big pressure to get married to someone of the opposite sex and probably a life of seeking satisfaction in the sexual underworld continues. That's where I think the problem is.

When I went through my "gay crisis", and came out of the truth mentally, I went crazy and, for a good few months, was obsessed with connecting with other gay people and I engaged in very risky behaviour. That was well over two years ago. But since then I have been with my current partner and we have been 100% faithful to each other. To be honest we're what many people would consider a mundane couple lol.

But back on topic...for me I think the Bible certainly doesn't encourage homosexual relationships. There are no gay role models. Any hint of a mention seems to be negative. I would like to think that if a loving God inspired the Bible, He wouldn't have allowed the ambiguity (or perhaps correctly interpreted condemnation) to be used to put so many people through so much emotional pain.

57

Did YOU Go A Bit Wild or Crazy When You Left The "Truth"?

by minimus in

jw
friends

just curious..

krejames

I always had a wild streak and went a bit crazy before I left - no drugs, just lots of clubbing and erm "loose" conduct. Once I was mentally out I settled down and feel quite calm these days....in fact I'm quite happy to think that deep down I'm quite a boring person lol

41

Are you DF'd? Share the weirdness, I'll start.....

by Pickler in

so i started a reply on the topic of "what's your status?

" and it made me think about my df hearing (sorry i can't remember the exact term for what happened).. so i was fading, living in a different country, working & making rare appearances at my kingdom hall.

i was flat sharing with a sister though.

krejames

I also wasn't disfellowshipped and I'm mortified at the detail I went into in the five JCs I had. To be fair, they didn't actually ask for all the detail I gave but for some reason I thought I was obliged to divulge it all. Having said, that I do remember one of the elders asking me on one occasion whether I and the other person involved had climaxed! I mean what difference does that make?! lol

152

How Long has it Been since you Last Attended Meetings and What Caused...

by flipper in

jw
friends

..... you to stop attending ?

injustices ?

disagree with the teachings ?

krejames

Hi Flipper

I'm a born-in still fading. I began to doubt a lot of the Hebrew Scriptures and then it all began to fall apart. I realised I couldn't love the God described in the Bible. Then I checked out the Earthquake stats and other facts on JW Facts and they held up. Then, like others have said, I began to evaluate JWs as I would any other religion. I stopped going out on F/S, I think the last time must have been summer last year (might be longer - seems ages ago). I still turn up at most meetings, tho usually late and I leave straight away - it's just a token gesture because I have family in.

I would say mentally I'm about 90% free but I'm still not totally free from Armageddon paranoia - world events seem to be panning out exactly as I was always taught they would and I'm still not sure how to process this information - so I guess I do have a fairly bleak outlook on the future even though I feel much happier now (I know this sounds contradictory). I still get fairly regular visits from the elders who try very hard to encourage me to go back out on the F/S.

20

My friend's conversation with a JW about me! Lol!

by TimothyT in

one of my old friends from work, who i used to have lots of spiritual conversations with, messaged me on facebook before and told me how he had a call from the jws this morning.

here is our conversation from facebook when he told me what happened:.

my friend: any way funny thing today, some jehovos came to me door and we were having a chat and i told them i didnt agree with their religion saying i was biased because i had a friend who used to be one and was kicked out for being gay and how could they preach like love etc and be so discriminative and then said they would know you mentioned your name and he did know you, and has even been on holiday with you in the past.

krejames

Nice one Tim - the truth hurts . Great reaction from your friend.

Terry - the idea that gay people must have been molested as children is very widespread in JW-land, I've heard it so much. It was also one of the first questions I was asked by an elder I "came out" to. When I said no, he was almost convincing me that I must have been molested.

40

What are the best questions to ask an elder?

by DarkFireWolf in

jw
friends

so my parents cannot answer my question and are pretty much pushing me to go to the elders for an answer so i'd like to know what the best questions to ask an elder are.my first question is going to be the mediator one..and if he tells me it's the 144,000 or the anointed, i'll ask him to show me where it says that in the bible.what are some other tough questions for an elder to answer?assuming we can get past the mediator one of course.i'm going to hold off on asking about new light or 607... also, has anyone ever asked about how satan can cause wwi in july if he wasn't expelled from heaven until christ became king in october?i haven't gotten much of an answer to that either..

krejames

Kurtbethel I think the response to that would be that the Candace Conti case did not involve a religious leader sexually abusing children, but a rank and file member of the congregation (Tho obviously there are wider issues about how the situation was/is allowed to happen).

40

What are the best questions to ask an elder?

by DarkFireWolf in

jw
friends

so my parents cannot answer my question and are pretty much pushing me to go to the elders for an answer so i'd like to know what the best questions to ask an elder are.my first question is going to be the mediator one..and if he tells me it's the 144,000 or the anointed, i'll ask him to show me where it says that in the bible.what are some other tough questions for an elder to answer?assuming we can get past the mediator one of course.i'm going to hold off on asking about new light or 607... also, has anyone ever asked about how satan can cause wwi in july if he wasn't expelled from heaven until christ became king in october?i haven't gotten much of an answer to that either..

krejames

"..... the Watchtower uses Jehovah because of its supposed familiarity ... since when is the Organization more concerned with what is popular over what is correct?" <-- I think they will just respond that Jehovah is consistent in latin countries as it's the latinised form of Yahweh just like Jesus is the latinised form of Yeshua and that in the western world we use the other latinised Biblical names. I would only bring this one up if you personally have a problem with that and feel it's a "deal breaker" as far as your faith is concerned. There are other threads that look into the question of whether Jehovah/Yahweh is actually God's name which might provide some stronger secular questionings on the use of Jehovah. Also JWFacts has some good topics on a number of subjects that might inspire some questions for you.

20

Doctrines that must change-- which ones?

by WildeLover in

considering the recent major doctrinal changes in relation to the generation and to the faithful and discreet slave which other doctrines do you think they will have to change?.

generation changea time and too many of the anointed dying.

f&dsa anointed growing in number so necessary to blow that out of the water by completely centralising power in the gb.

krejames

I don't think the JWs are in any rush to change the blood doctrine at all. They're very proud of their hospital liaison committees and the fact that there are a growing number of hospitals and surgeons that don't use blood. I think rather than drop this doctrine the JWs feel vindicated. At most I could see them doing something about the individual blood fractions being a conscience matter as I know that has caused confusion.

Same with disfellowshipping - I can't see the shunning being stopped any time soon. If anything the WT articles seem to be getting more and more extreme on this. Just recently we had a talk that said something a long the lines of, "how can you claim to be loyal to God if you carry on talking to disfellowshipped people including family members not living in the same home?"

I too wonder whether the most likely changes will be around the old favourites: the 144000, the generation and maybe even 1914. Still, with regard to the latter, we are only 99 years on from then....we might still be just about within a generation by the skin of our teeth if Armageddon comes this year or next...

I have also been wondering about the demise of Babylon the Great/"false religion". Repeatedly in articles and talks they have made clear they feel that false religion will be destroyed suddenly and unexpectedly and that it won't simply fade away. The signs are that religion is fading as society is getting more secular. So as time goes on, and assuming sudden destruction/armageddon doesn't happen (don't want to be presumptious!) I wonder whether that idea will change.

40

What are the best questions to ask an elder?

by DarkFireWolf in

jw
friends

so my parents cannot answer my question and are pretty much pushing me to go to the elders for an answer so i'd like to know what the best questions to ask an elder are.my first question is going to be the mediator one..and if he tells me it's the 144,000 or the anointed, i'll ask him to show me where it says that in the bible.what are some other tough questions for an elder to answer?assuming we can get past the mediator one of course.i'm going to hold off on asking about new light or 607... also, has anyone ever asked about how satan can cause wwi in july if he wasn't expelled from heaven until christ became king in october?i haven't gotten much of an answer to that either..

krejames

I had a visit from an elder last month. He asked me if I loved Jehovah and i guess I replied with a question, which I was genuinely interested in the answer to. I don't know if it's a question that would interest you too, but it was along these lines:

I had seen some graphic news footage of the Israeli bombing of Gaza, which included the corpses of young children together with footage of the Israelis celebrating because they felt they were doing God's will. The film disgusted me. This reminded me of what the ancient Israelites had to do to the nations they invaded - kill children, as well as adults and animals in order to "purify the land". I asked how I could love a God that demanded this. how does he love a God that demanded this genocide? I was expecting him to say how bad those nations were (they usually trot out the child sacrifice etc but this didn't apply to all of the nations as far as I'm aware so that just leaves pagan worship and immorality - something which happens in most present day nations). but he didn't really have an answer.

I also told him that my reaction to news reports of killings under Shia law. For example last year there was a report of a woman who was stoned to death by her family because she had allegedly committed adultery. Another woman was stoned to death after being raped (presumably because she did not cry out). Again, the report disgusted me (as I'm sure it did most people in the western world and probably most JWs too if they were honest). To me the death penalty seems disproportionate and extreme (this is close to home for me, as a gay witness I would undoubtedly have been stoned to death if I had lived in ancient Israel). But really none of this should disgust any Jehovah's Witnesses because that is exactly what Jehovah commanded. So JWs should endorse this. I said I found it hard to love a God who would demand this punishment. I asked him to suggest how I could get my head around this.

His answer? I need to read the bible, pray more and meditate. (later in the same visit he said I had no excuse because apparently I have a lot of Bible knowledge)

I don't know whether that helps. If you do ask your elder a question along these lines I would be genuinely interested in knowing what he says (as long as it's not pray, read the bible and meditate!).