Posts by Scully

26

Can an atheist date jw?

by concernCitizen in

hey everyone!.

first of all, i'm not a jw, in fact i'm an atheist, or if you really want to be technical about it i'm probably something like an agnostic atheist or something.. but, my girlfriend is a jw, she seems very rational about it though, it seems to me that she believes in a lot of it but not exactly all, for instance she does understands and believes in the scientific age of the earth and evolution.. when we started dating almost a year ago she made it clear she as religious person.

i never saw that as a problem, it's not like i'm trying to convert her or she's trying to convert me.

Scully

An atheist can date whomever they like who is agreeable to dating an atheist. JWs, not so much.

12

Today's Text - Sacrifice To God!

by Divergent in

jw
friends

sunday, august 14. if she cannot afford a sheep, she must then take two turtledoves or two young pigeons.—lev.

12:8.. according to the mosaic law, the israelites were to offer specific sacrifices.

(lev.

Scully

If she cannot afford a sheep, she must then take two turtledoves or two young pigeons

This just occurred to me: How many JWs find that going to conventions or going Door-to-Door™ or Meetings™ take away from opportunities to build a better life/future for themselves? How many would love to get a better education so they can provide for their families more easily? How many have no retirement savings?

With this scripture in mind, it seems to be acceptable (to Jehovah™, at least) to give Him™ an item of lower value in presenting your sacrifice if you "cannot afford a sheep". This means you have a choice in how much of an offering you give. The ability to "afford" something is subjective. It means that you can have priorities other than whatever you intend to Sacrifice™ to Jehovah™.

Do you need to work extra shifts so you can save for your vacation or education? Does it mean you have to skip a few Meetings™ to do so?

Do you want to put away some money from each pay to save for your retirement? Does it mean there is less to put in the Contribution Box™?

The WTS wants you to think that you shouldn't have priorities other than Preaching™ Door-to-Door™, going to Meetings™ and Conventions™, and putting your hard earned cash in the Contribution Box™. But it's all a choice. You can do/give what you can "afford", once all your other priorities are met.

7

Do a person need a college education to be a good JW

by Santa in

yea i know it's not required or anything, but a lot of the people in the congregation are clearly in need of help that the elders can not give them and none of the other members seem to want to help.

so is it wrong for a person to want to get advanced social and medical training skills to help those in need?.

Scully

In JW-land, an education is considered to be a complete waste of time, as is helping people (other than JWs, naturally) with practical matters like health care and social services. This is because (a) Armageddon™ is Just Around The Corner™, (b) your skills will have no value in The New System™ as Armageddon Survivors™ will have no social service or health care issues, and (c) your time would be much better spent Pioneering™ and helping people become JWs so they can Live Forever In Paradise On Earth™.

What they don't tell you is that education is the key that will unlock so many doors for you. Your job opportunities multiply. Your mind will expand as you learn about diverse populations and cultures. You will learn to use your critical thinking ability. All of these things are real threats to your continued allegiance to the JWs.

32

Tips on how to raise money

by Holden Caufield in

i need some ideas to raise money for my study research trip for west africa in cape coast ghana..

Scully

Try a student loan, then.

I used it to finance my college education, and it took a long ass time to pay it off, but it is paid in full.

84

Why are the atheists on this site so hateful?

by HopeEverLasting in

jw
friends

all us creationists try to do is offer true evidence that the one and only god is out there watching and looking down on us.

we present that certain scientists know the truth about god and that he is everything that we see from trees, life, weather, the air we breath, and even the most simple molecules.

but of course you atheists reject it because it is your nature to not be humble and see god because you want to rule your own life.

Scully

HopeEverLasting writes:

Giles Gray, you are hateful. You saying I deserve the hate because of what I believe in. You are exactly the type to spew all that hatred. Talk to my hand.

You see, to someone who disagrees with your position, this attitude that you-disagree-with-my-beliefs-therefore-you-are-hateful is so counterproductive to honest dialogue.

How a discussion (that's what this board is for: discussion) works is like this:

Person who starts a thread [OP]: "I think (insert topic here), and here's why: (insert statements/assertions here)"

Person 1 who replies: "Well, I disagree with you, and here's why: (insert counterpoint/evidence here)"

Person 2 who replies: "Those are very interesting ideas, OP. Could you please clarify what you said [insert quotation]? and please explain how it relates to the counterpoint/evidence Person 1 posted."

OP: This is the part where, when your opinion / beliefs are challenged, you support your previous statements with actual evidence. You don't get to go on the defensive and call people "hateful" or "stupid" or whatever, simply because they disagree with you, or ask you to provide support for your claims. When you stoop to the level of ad hominem attacks (ie, name calling - attacking the individual rather than the ideas / evidence they present) you weaken your position in the discussion.

Frankly, as an atheist, I take exception to your out-of-the-gate accusation that "atheists are hateful on this site". I haven't said one hateful thing to you, ever, yet you lump me in with people you claim are hateful to you or creationists, when actual "hate" is not even close to what is actually happening. What is actually happening is that people are trying to show you an alternate position to one that you hold to be true. That's not hateful, it's not even unkind.

Let me put it another way: Suppose you know someone who is teaching their children something that is patently false, for instance that there are fairies living in their garden, that can't be seen because they only come out at night to cover the plants and spider webs with dewdrops, when the children are sleeping. It seems like a harmless enough make believe story for children to believe in, but what if this child grows up and still holds to the belief that everyone's back garden has fairies living there? What if it was your workmate? Would you feel at all compelled by kindness and wanting to spare them embarrassment to try to relieve them of their false belief? Would you show them scientific evidence of how dew ends up on the plants?

Let's say you try this. Let's say it doesn't go well. Your workmate feels their beliefs have been unjustly attacked by someone who "hates" garden variety fairies. Would that reaction seem absurd to you?

Anyway, I'm not here to try to dissuade you from what you believe. Please do me and the other atheists the courtesy of refraining from trying to shove your beliefs down our throats. Most of us (the atheists of JWD) are ex-JWs and feel that we've had enough preaching in our lifetimes. You are very welcome to discuss creationist points of view with other creationists here and on other forums, but please note that other people (other creationists included) are equally welcome to hold your feet to the fire and challenge the truth of your claims.

Thank you, and good night.

Moderator Scully

103

JW and the Sabbath

by Andromeda in

hello brothers and sisters and truth seekers,.

i am an active jehovah's witness.

i don't believe in 1914 and i'm tototally against their way of dealing with abuse cases.

Scully

Thanks, Andromeda - I was under the impression that you wanted to keep the discussion on-topic, so I'll just try to clarify what I said earlier.

You are clearly aware that the average JW, unlike yourself, has a very limited depth of biblical understanding, due in large part to the WT having discouraged deep bible study in favour of its own sad-excuse-for-biblical-scholarship publications.

My point is this: if you were to have your average JW look at Romans 14:5, they would be confounded, because on face value it places the onus on the *individual* as to the observance of one day over another. Your deeper understanding is way over their heads, and would be irrelevant to them.

When you know your "frenemy" and the thought processes they employ, you can confound them using their own logic.

fwiw, I am an atheist and have been for almost 20 years. But when I talk to my JW relatives, my ability to use their own "sword" against them has been very useful.

103

JW and the Sabbath

by Andromeda in

hello brothers and sisters and truth seekers,.

i am an active jehovah's witness.

i don't believe in 1914 and i'm tototally against their way of dealing with abuse cases.

Scully

Andromeda:

"that verse is strictly about food"

Verse 5 clearly is about the observance of any given day and the importance it holds to the one choosing to observe it:

One man judges one day as above another; another judges one day the same as all others; let each one be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day observes it to Jehovah.

51

Why are anniversaries allowed but not birthdays?

by hyperpen in

the scripture quotes aside, i was always told that we don't celebrate birthdays because that is a celebration of the self, which has no place in jehovah's organization.

then why celebrate anniversaries?

anniversary celebrations are about the joining of two selves, isn't that twice as selfish?.

Scully

If JWs want to be party poopers and not celebrate their own birthdays, that's fine with me.

As long as "each one is fully convinced in his own mind" (Romans 14:5) they can observe or not observe whatever day they wish. THAT is in the Bible™. Their Bible™. The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures™.

One man judges one day as above another; another judges one day the same as all others; let each one be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 The one who observes the day observes it to Jehovah. Also, the one who eats, eats to Jehovah, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat does not eat to Jehovah, and yet gives thanks to God.

If they wish to argue over scripture, this is one that just doesn't rate worthy of arguing over.

If everyone gets to celebrate their birthday - not in a form of worshipful reverence, but in appreciation for someone having touched their lives in a positive way - how does it elevate one person above another, if literally *everyone* has a birthday??

Frankly, if God™ is so insecure about being worshipped when people have a party for someone's birthday, or wish someone "Happy Birthday", or send a card with birthday wishes, he doesn't deserve to be worshipped. Period.

103

JW and the Sabbath

by Andromeda in

hello brothers and sisters and truth seekers,.

i am an active jehovah's witness.

i don't believe in 1914 and i'm tototally against their way of dealing with abuse cases.

Scully

The best scripture you can use to your advantage is Romans 14:5, 6:

One man judges one day as above another; another judges one day the same as all others; let each one be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day observes it to Jehovah. Also, the one who eats, eats to Jehovah, for he gives thanks to God; and the one who does not eat does not eat to Jehovah, and yet gives thanks to God.

My position would be that as long as you don't try to sway your fellow JWs to your point of view or try to impose your point of view on others, you should be safe from repercussions. How you decide to observe the Sabbath is none of their business, really, just as it's none of their business which grocery store you decide to shop at or what kind of car you drive and what brand of fuel you put in the tank.

The various factions of Judaism can't even agree on how strictly the Sabbath should be observed, and I would venture to guess that they have had thousands of years to figure this one out, but for some reason, they haven't. Just be chill, do what you like in the privacy of your home and family, and don't try to force your beliefs on others. If you do this, you will have peace in your life.

69

There is a new letter to elders about Child Abuse

by ttdtt in

anyone see that there is a long letter on how to handle child abuse?.

Scully

may now qualify for minor privileges, such as carrying or adjusting microphones, operating audio/video equipment, or assisting with accounts, literature, magazines, or territories

My issue is not with such so-called "minor privileges". Why the hell are these monsters permitted to participate in Field Ministry™? If they put a blanket ban on Door-to-Door™ for child molesters, it would keep the Congregation™ from "sharing in the sins of others", by permitting a molester access to children, their parents and their homes. Sure, they claim that a known molester should be "supervised" by an Elder™ when they participate in Field Service™, but how do they know that the molester is not scoping out vulnerable families while going Door-to-Door™? How do they know that the molester - once they establish contact with a vulnerable family while going Door-to-Door™ - won't attempt to return ALONE at a later time? Why the hell are they aiding and abetting molesters in locating targets by insisting that they participate in Field Ministry™?