Posts by jwundubbed

52

Boyfriend force me to study the bible or no marriage

by MuslimWoman in

my boyfriend, who is a disfellowshipped jehova's witness, asks me to study the bible for 3 months or he won't marry me (i'm a muslim woman).

he loves me and really wants to marry me but he is doing a passive blackmailing: if i don't study for 3 months, 1 time per week, in my home country, and without him, there will be no marriage... as a muslim, i believe the bible is god's word so i look at the bible from time to time and would be happy to study with him.

but the fact that he is kind of saying "study the bible or bye bye no marriage" is really hurtful.

jwundubbed

I agree with so much of the advice given here so far.

One thing that you need to know is that members of the Jehovah's Witnesses are taught to be abusive and to believe that their abusive actions are in fact loving and kind. Many times they don't even realize that they are abusers. He doesn't love you. He doesn't know what love is. None of the Jehovah's Witnesses recognize how to behave lovingly and kindly. The fact that he is giving you an ultimatum about marriage in order to control you is proof that he doesn't know what love is nor how it behaves. Leave him before he really hurts you.

Life in the US as a Jehovah's Witness is not a benefit. As a woman you will have no rights. The JWs will look at you as trash and worth nothing. If you are able to have children you will have slightly more worth than if you can't but still... women are only good for procreation and cleaning toilets. That is the best you can hope for. You will be discouraged from working a well paying job, from getting an education, and from doing anything that betters your situation. Is that the US that you want to live in?

Also... you mentioned being balanced from reading a few texts from a holy book. There are many people in the world who only read a few texts and are balanced in their views. However, there is not a single Jehovah Witness that can make that claim. It is part of their indoctrination that they take texts out of context and pervert their meanings. Most Jehovah's Witnesses have only read the entire Bible in snippets and texts taken out of context. Those that I know who have actually read the book cover to cover have had questions about why what they are taught doesn't match up with what the bible says when you read it in full. But by that time the indoctrination and brainwashing and emotional blackmail is too overwhelming to overcome.

Also, Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christians. They think they are, but they aren't. They do not believe that Christ is God, but that Christ is God's son. He is the good son. The son that does everything right. But they don't follow Christ. If they did, they would be called Jesus's Witnesses.

Run away and find a person who is balanced to fall in love with. If you want to live in the US... apply for a visa. Getting in through marriage is not a good way to get into the country and it is a terrible reason to marry someone. It puts you at risk of being abused and mistreated. You can be better than that. You could even go to college and study in the US. Many students then get jobs, and then work visas. And if you really want to... get working on the process of becoming a US citizen. But consider... you get back what you put in. And if you try to come to the US through marriage... you make yourself vulnerable to abuse and because you don't have citizenship you have less resources. If you get involved in a cult, like the Jehovah's Witnesses, you will have even less resources. Don't set yourself up for that.

Also, be forewarned. The American Dream is a fantasy. It sounds too good to be true because it is too good to be true. American life is nothing like what you think it is. It might be better than where you are now, or it might not. It might just be a different. If you came as a student you would have the chance to see what life is really like and to decide if you really want to live in the US permanently.

50

Is it a Gun Issue or a Mental Illness Issue or Both?

by minimus in

jw
friends

we have had another shooting.

many are blaming trump and the republicans and the nra.. is it because of guns that there are so many massacres or could it be that these killers are mental?.

do you think guns should be removed from our society so that these atrocities never occur again?

jwundubbed

Guns don't kill people, people kill people but people with guns kill more people and mentally unstable people with guns kill the most people. -nicolaou-

Could you cite references to where you got information that mentally unstable people with guns kill the most people? I find that hard to believe. I would guess that soldiers with guns kill more people than a mentally unstable person with a gun.

Also... do you have any numbers on how many people that are mentally unstable and own guns never kill people? I doubt it. There are many different ways of being mentally unstable. It is actually very possible to be mentally unstable, to own a gun, and to never use it on people.

Stop stigmatizing an entire group of people with your homegrown ignorance, please.

105

Another School Shooting: The Gun Violence/Mental Illness Debate Continues

by jp1692 in

in the aftermath of the valentine's day school shooting in florida, i have read quite a number of articles, blogs and posts about the event.

it is disturbing--and i think inexcusable--that many people take the opportunity to use horrible tragedies such as this to push their own particular agenda.. in particularly insensitive and tone-deaf tweet, conservative political commentator tomi lahren wrote: "can the left let the families grieve for even 24 hours before they push their anti-gun and anti-gunowner agenda?

my goodness.

jwundubbed

Of course it's about mental illness. But it is also undeniably about gun control. Because a mentally ill person had open access to guns and no one stopped him, 17 people are dead

What mental illness did the perpetrator have? I haven't been able to find a single article that can name his mental illness or if he even had one. I have heard that the person was in and out of mental health facilities... but even that doesn't mean that he was actually mentally unstable or hase a mental illness.

He definitely had a gun that was made to kill people. So there is definitely going to be a discussion about gun control.

He may or may not have had a mental illness or been mentally unstable. We don't know that yet. It is not 'of course about mental illness' when no one seems to be able to name any mental illness at all.

50

Is it a Gun Issue or a Mental Illness Issue or Both?

by minimus in

jw
friends

we have had another shooting.

many are blaming trump and the republicans and the nra.. is it because of guns that there are so many massacres or could it be that these killers are mental?.

do you think guns should be removed from our society so that these atrocities never occur again?

jwundubbed

We have had another shooting. Many are blaming Trump and the Republicans and the NRA.

I think most people are too quick to place blame. They often start the blame game before all the facts are in. When has jumping to conclusions ever solved a problem?

Is it because of guns that there are so many massacres or could it be that these killers are mental?

I know a little something about mental illness. What I don't see in any of the articles is what mental illness this latest shooter is supposed to have. Based on what I have seen of his behaviors... I doubt he had a mental illness that was strong enough to make him go on a shooting spree. I don't think mental illness had anything to do with it. I also don't think that the number of guns in the US has anything to do with it. I think it has to do with people, primarily young white men, wanting notoriety. I think this would happen a lot less if the media would stop talking about the shooters. Don't name them if they are dead or in custody. Only name them if they are yet to be apprehended and still a danger to society. And once they are caught or dead... never say one word about them. If they are caught... talk about their sentence. And then never let their name or face see the lime light again.

In other countries they ask why we have the problem that we do, while they don't have any mass violence like we do. There are other countries that have more guns per household than we do. There are other countries that have knife violence. No other country in the world has the mass violence that we do, perpetrated by minors, to the extent that we do. Instead of looking at gun control or mental illness (which are just distractions)... we should take a look at why the US is so different than the entire rest of the world in this area.

Do you think guns should be removed from our society so that these atrocities never occur again?

No. I don't think that would change anything. The people who do this will just find another way to create the most damage and they will get creative. I am all for gun control. But I don't think that means getting rid of guns. I don't think people would be as likely to committ gun crimes or other crimes if everyone around them owned, carried, and had the education to take them down as well. I am for giving people more rights to carry openly but with the requirement of stringent education. I am all for not allowing people who are mentally ill, people on probation, and people on restraining orders to have any access to legally obtained guns. I do think that it should be harder to buy a gun than just to walk into a store and put down your money.

Do you think people who are mentally unstable should never get a gun?

Yes. I think people who are mentally unstable should never ever have the right to own or use a gun. But I also think that we have to change how we see mental illness. A lot of people commit heinous crimes while being completely mentally stable. But people in general have so little understanding of what mental illness is and what it looks like and how it behaves that they name anyone who behaves in a way that they don't understand as mentally imbalanced. A mass shooting happens and people are quick to lay the blame at the mentally ill before they have any factual knowledge of a mental illness. We need to stop the stigma against mental illness because it limits our ability to recognize actual mental illness. We also need to amend the law to include 'Guilty by reason of insanity' verdicts which would mean that someone with a mental illness that can't be cured never walks free again. And we need the criminal justice system to recognize that a chemical imbalance in the brain cannot be 'rehabilitated'.

by the way... The FBI is doing a heck of a job following leads on getting these nuts out of the way, huh?

They are doing a great job of trying to convince us they aren't to blame. They 'ran checks but couldn't find the person behind the statements'. Bullshit. The FBI has the ability to do more than 'check things out'. They failed us in that. But the reality is that even if they did everything right, this still could have happened. This could have happened because legally the FBI is limited in what they can do with someone who makes statements like this. If they thought it was terror threat they could charge the person. A threat of mass shooting... there isn't much they can do. If the person does have a mental illness they can commit them to a hospital where they will stay for a minimum of 14 days in some cases. Once out, that person doesn't have anyone who makes sure they take their meds. That person is free to come and go as they please. It is actually worse for everyone if that person is mentally ill than if they are just a criminal... because criminals go to jail/prison but the mentally ill go to a hospital that focuses 'rescue, rehabilitation, and release'. This system works great for some mental illnesses but is completely inadequate for other mental illnesses. Some things just can't be cured or rehabilitated. And some offences are so great/vile/heinous that culpability shouldn't be removed under any circumstances... even mental illness.

The FBI fell down on their part in all of this, but they also don't have a lot of legal options to begin with.

Is it a Gun Issue or a Mental Illness Issue or Both?

Those are not the only two possibilities. Your question implies there are no other answers. If you don't look for any other answers then you will never find any other answers.

24

Come on, Mainstream Media!

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

it has been sickening to read the most recently leaked documents by faithleaks.

it makes me so angry because so many of us have experienced first hand the horrible policies of the watchtower on abuse.

i feel like these documents are finally the smoking gun we have all been hoping to expose the watchtower, and so far, the only mainstream news that i have seen pick it up is newsweek.. what will it take for the mainstream media pick this up and give it the attention it deserves?

jwundubbed

But the problem is how members are counted - is it purely by turning up for a service? or just saying they believe in it? - darkspilver

All statistics have this problem. All studies have this problem. How did you come by the information and what was the criteria for the information. To be honest, that is a bigger problem than I am willing to solve. My only attempt was to find any information from the source itself and from a third, unaffiliated party. Providing that information doesn't do anything... other than to show people how popular Catholicism is in reality and in the minds of the Catholic organization versus how popular the Jehovah's Witness cult is in reality and in the minds of the JW org.

No matter how you look at it... the Billions of Catholics makes them a part of the mainstream world stage and the few million JWs makes them irrelevant. If you want mainstream media to pay attention... and you don't have the numbers to be a part of the world, then you have to do something that puts the JWs in the forefront of social media. Even though the JWs have a website and a broadcast, I don't think they nor exJWs have any idea how much YouTube, Twitter, and Facebook impact the mainstream media these days.

24

Come on, Mainstream Media!

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

it has been sickening to read the most recently leaked documents by faithleaks.

it makes me so angry because so many of us have experienced first hand the horrible policies of the watchtower on abuse.

i feel like these documents are finally the smoking gun we have all been hoping to expose the watchtower, and so far, the only mainstream news that i have seen pick it up is newsweek.. what will it take for the mainstream media pick this up and give it the attention it deserves?

jwundubbed

@darkspilver,

That definitely helps. Any statistics not provided by the JW is helpful. But it doesn't tell us the accuracy of their worldwide counts. Third party research is what I was trying to find. I didn't look horribly hard. But it was much easier to find that information for the Catholics than for the JWs.

24

Come on, Mainstream Media!

by Wild_Thing in

jw
friends

it has been sickening to read the most recently leaked documents by faithleaks.

it makes me so angry because so many of us have experienced first hand the horrible policies of the watchtower on abuse.

i feel like these documents are finally the smoking gun we have all been hoping to expose the watchtower, and so far, the only mainstream news that i have seen pick it up is newsweek.. what will it take for the mainstream media pick this up and give it the attention it deserves?

jwundubbed

It isn't just that the JWs aren't as big as the Catholic church. There is a delusion that all JWs are taught and that is playing a big part in this conversation. We were all taught that the world was watching us, that the JWs were the center of the universe. The reality is that every single person I have spoken to after leaving the cult has almost no idea who the JWs are. Every time I tell someone I was a JW they ask me what that is.

No one is covering this 'big leak' because it is only a big leak to the people involved in it. To everyone else it doesn't matter any more than it would matter if a leak of the same type was made about the policies of the ONE Campaign (an international campaign with 8 million members). To them it would be huge, but we are all asking what that is.

Catholicism is the original christian religion. Every other christian religion is a spin-off of that. The JWs are spin-off of a spin-off of a spin-off. No one else cares or even knows who or what we are. If you want mainstream attention then you have to get the Jehovahs Witnesses into mainstream media in the first place. Most JWs don't have the charisma for mainstream media. If you had some people who understood mainstream media and also had charisma... A youtube channel that was entertaining and highlighted the crazy of the JWs might take off. People love watching crazy, when it is entertaining and done well. If you had some entertaining people doing a podcast that views the world from the crazy perspecive of the JWs that might also work. But the JWs and the exJWs seem to think that the world will care about a group of people who don't care about and are not part of the world. This should be a 'Duh!' moment, and instead ex-jws are dumbfounded as to why the rest of the world doesn't care about them. The rest of the world doesn't have any reason to care about the JWs.

One Campaign - International ogranization with 8 million members.

Catholic count by country - Wikipedia from Catholic citations

Catholic count by country - Pew Research Center (1910 to 2010)

Jehovahs Witness count by country - Wikipedia from JW citations

Unable to find statistics on the JW religion that don't come from the JW.

28

Why did the Governing Body come behind the curtain?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

in the movie the wizard of oz, while the whole yellow brick road gang was being addressed by the great and powerful wizard of oz, the dog toto ran off to the side, pulled back on a curtain, and showed that a normal-looking humbug of a person was operating cranks and levers.

for a short while, the normal-looking man kept yanking levers and cranking cranks, and said into the microphone (which made the great and powerful wizard speak the same words) "pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!

i am the great and powerful wiz .

jwundubbed

There is a major difference between the Wizard of Oz and the GB. It took a moment, but the WoZ understood that once the curtain was pulled back he couldn't keep the act up. The GB believe that the curtain is irrelevant. They are completely clueless!

42

Would You Go To A Memorial Service For A JW )if you were no longer attending the KH)?

by minimus in

jw
friends

some of my old jw friends are sickly and getting on in age.

so far, i’ve only gone to my mother’s memorial and have avoided the kingdom hall altogether.... your thoughts please?.

jwundubbed

Memorials and funerals aren't for the dead. They are for the living. It gives us closure. It is a necessary part in processing the death of a loved one. Not everyone needs this to be part of their process of grief but many, if not most, do.

One day my mother or my sister will die. I will go to both their funeral/memorials. I won't listen to the indoctrination that the JWs insist on foisting on the bereaved. I also won't allow members of a religious group to control me. It isn't about them any more than it is about the dead. It is about me and what I need to process the death of people close to me. It sounds selfish, and to be honest... it should be. There is no reason to be selfless and thinking of others when processing your grief. That is the opposite of helpful.

What I need is to see their dead bodies. I need proof that they are dead. Once that is done I can go and finish processing elsewhere. No religious organization gets to control my right to grieve for people I was close to. Allowing them to have that control over me is a power that I refuse to give them.

83

The Scientific Method

by cofty in

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jwundubbed

Science is like technology. It is usually the human factor that gets it wrong or keeps it from working.