Seeker4

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Posts by Seeker4

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  36

  3,000,000 reasons JWD kicked ass

  by Simon in

  1. forum
  2. announcements

  well, we made it past the 3 million post mark ... what a huge milestone - it makes it one of the largest discussion forums on the internet!.

  a big thank you to everyone who posted on this site, shared a little bit of themselves with us or just said 'hi' along the way.. thank you for making this place rock and kick ass!.

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  Seeker4

  Congrats, and thank you, Simon.

  Wishing you the best.

  S4
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  81

  How do you feel now? EVOLUTION OR CREATION??

  by chuckyy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as jws we were no doubt staunch creationists.

  but how do you feel now??

  do you still opt for creation or do you now feel evolution offers the right answer.

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  Seeker4

  "Creationism with evolution mixed in. It all didn't happen in just 6000 yrs of man's existence. I've not quite decided how much of each figured in."

  That's kind of funny - as though it's your decision! Sorry, that's not how it works, Unfortunately, a lot of people believe it does!

  S4
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  20

  If you want a girl to melt in you arms... this song: for you?

  by dawg in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  man, i've made a career of this song...i used to pull it out (no pun intended) when all else was failing... most ladies had never heard of it.

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  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se9awr0awvq

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  Seeker4

  Yo Dawg! You datin' 15 year olds to have not heard of this classic?? You Dawg...

  Hell, this video is on PBS about once a week!

  S4
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  35

  I know that a lot of people here will not agree but........

  by Wordly Andre in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok, not to change anyones religious beliefs or anything but just because in my weird head!

  i think it would be funny to protest at the assembly, with a bunch of people wearing funny halloween costumes of all sorts.

  i know that a lot of people here are against that sort of thing, but i want to do it just because it will funny.

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  Seeker4

  Yeah, Amama, that's what I'm talking about!

  S4
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  81

  How do you feel now? EVOLUTION OR CREATION??

  by chuckyy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as jws we were no doubt staunch creationists.

  but how do you feel now??

  do you still opt for creation or do you now feel evolution offers the right answer.

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  Seeker4

  Evolution, for sure.

  Why? The overwhelming weight of evidence, and especially now with the discovery and ability to decipher DNA. Couldn't have asked for a stronger proof of evolution. The fact that evolution is the basis for essentially every science course taught at every reputable university or college on Earth might also be a factor.

  S4
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  128

  Do You Clearly Understand That "The Truth" Is Nothing But Bullcrap?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what a waste of living being "in the truth" was!

  sometimes i see persons suggesting that the witness religion isn't all so wrong.

  actually they suggest that they themselves are the issue.

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  Seeker4

  Yeah, I've come to the conclusion that the WTS meets the criteria to be considered a cult.

  Lori brought home the April 28 People magazine for me last week. It has a cover article on the Fundamentalist LDS polygamy group in Texas. There is a sidebar on page 66 titled "Is the FLDS Really a Cult?" In that, an expert goes over the earmarks of a cult. Very interesting. I'll quote the article followed by my comments:

  "It has a charismatic leader in Warren Jeffs." Well, the WTS was started and overseen by charismatic leaders - Russell, Rutherford, Knorr and Fred Franz in particular. Now a JW today would say it can't be cult because there is no 'charismatic leader' that they follow. BUT, that position has been taken over the by the Governing Body. They function exactly like a powerful group leader, with group charisma as opposed to individual charisma (for sure!). The WTS is constantly stressing the need to be faithful and obedient to the Faithful & Discreet Slave, a group made up of some 8500 living JWs. In reality, the GB and a handful of other WTS leaders at Bethel carry out every singlefunction that the WTS claims for the FDS.

  "It has a restrictive vision of the world in which only those who believe in the FLDS's version of the religion will gain access to the highest level of heaven." That's pretty much exactly the JW view - they are the only ones with the truth and the only ones who will be saved through Armageddon.

  "The followers' lives are strictly controlled, as is information from the outside society." Again, this is very, very similar to JWs, who are discouraged from researching anything about the group from any outside source, or from using outside sources in their Bible study. They are strongly encouraged to use only WTS materials in their study.

  "If they leave, they believe they have lost everything, their future salvation, not to mention their family." This is exactly what JWs are taught, and it is enforced through strict disfellowshipping and shunning. This magazine's description of what constitutes a cult fits JWs perfectly.

  S4
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  18

  How many kids never buy into the JW B/S???

  by navytownroger in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  at the conventions, there always seem to be parents gushing about how their kids are 'in the truth', pioneering, etc.

  i'm wondering how many jw kids just flat-out reject all the jw b/s right from the start.

  surely there are some kids who just say 'no way!

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  Seeker4

  There is an old JW rule of thumb that only about 1 out of every 8 kids stays a JW. There is also a PEW Poll from last year I think that had a figure as well. JWs, according to that poll, have the highest loss rate of people who were raised in the religion of any religion in the US. You can find references to that poll on here.

  S4
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  128

  Do You Clearly Understand That "The Truth" Is Nothing But Bullcrap?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what a waste of living being "in the truth" was!

  sometimes i see persons suggesting that the witness religion isn't all so wrong.

  actually they suggest that they themselves are the issue.

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  Seeker4

  I like both of you, Min and Stilla. I also understand what can move a person to ostensibly stay in the WTS while in reality believing almost exactly the opposite that the WTS teaches. To be able to do that for 5 years, like Stilla, was beyond my ability. Once I realized it was essentially bullshit, I was gone, family or no family.

  I also like that we can have a discussion like this and let the different viewpoints get to see the light of day. As we all know, including Stilla, you'd never get to have a discussion like this in a Kingdom Hall!

  I have another take on this. I think that a lot of us had personal abilities that made us effective JWs, and we'd have had those abilities whether we were JWs or not. Skill in public speaking, debate, sales or public relations are hardly JW-only skills. If we were really taught those, there'd be a hell of a lot more skilled JWs in these fields - but I remember how rare it was to hear a really good public speaker at the Hall or even at CAs.

  I had one experience where I had a major talk at the DC, and in it I interviewed Jim Howard, who was the MD at Bethel at the time, along with his wife and daughter. The CO who was the DC Chairman listened to the part and wanted some changes made. He was a real asshole by the way. Though this was just prior to the part going on, I handled the changes calmly and diplomatically, and things went off just fine.

  Afterward, Jim Howard's wife, who was a bright, educated woman that I'm surprised could possibly remain a JW, talked with me. She said how impressed she was with how I'd handled everything in the part with them, especially the jerk CO. Her comment about it? "Someone with people skills like that would be making a fortune in the business world. Companies pay huge salaries for people who can solve problems the way you did."

  My point? I think Stilla is referencing personal individual talents that the WTS arrangement brings to the fore, but that aren't anything that is a result of being a JW. The WTS has a formula for public speaking, commenting, studying, even its writing, music and artwork, that is generic and actively stifles genuine creativity. Prince and Michael Jackson have been or are genuine musical talents of gigantic stature, and the Williams Sisters are the same in sports, and the black actor whose name escapes me at the moment (Terence??) - BUT they only did that by going contrary to what we all - JW and ex-JW know - are the basic tenets of JWism.

  And to say that one of the JW pluses is that it taught you there was no hell, while it also taught you that the Bible is the unerring word of God and there was a real Adam and Eve, well, that's just pathetic!

  S4
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  31

  Any Buddhists here?

  by DevonMcBride in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i recently started studying buddhism and found it to be very deep but most of it makes a lot of sense.

  any other buddhists posting here.

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  Seeker4

  Watched a similarly eager-to-convert-you-all Kirk Cameron and his buddy on TV the other night. These spiritual bullies just look pathetic when compared to the Buddhist spiritual leaders like Thich Nhat Hanh and the Dalai Lama.

  Buddhism has a serious appeal - and unlike Christianity, it isn't powered by the "you're a liar, thief and fornicator that God is going to burn in hell unless you repent and get saved" approach that the Kirk Cameron-types use. The power of Buddhism (and Taoism - which I prefer), is that you see people who practice it living in joy and satisfaction, while the face of Christianity is most often an angry, arrogant asshole telling you what a piece of shit you are in God's eyes and how you need to change and be like he is, saved, or his loveing God will kill you.

  I can't hardly think of any Christian teacher that I've ever met or even heard of that seemed even remotely Christ-like. Maybe Thomas Merton - but then he was half-Buddhist anyway, I think!

  S4
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  35

  I know that a lot of people here will not agree but........

  by Wordly Andre in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok, not to change anyones religious beliefs or anything but just because in my weird head!

  i think it would be funny to protest at the assembly, with a bunch of people wearing funny halloween costumes of all sorts.

  i know that a lot of people here are against that sort of thing, but i want to do it just because it will funny.

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  Seeker4

  What would be kind of funny is if all the costumes were the things JWs shot down. So, imagine a line of picketers at a DC, and in the line is Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Jesus carrying a cross, Uncle Sam, the New Year's Baby and Father Time side by side, the Tooth Fairy, etc.

  AND, each of them is carrying a humorous sign - nothing angry or bitter - just funny. I don't know, maybe Santa with a "Yes, Freddy Franz, There Really Is a Santa Claus," or "Maybe I Didn't Get to Your House this Year, But I Got to the Rest of 'Em!" I'm sure people would come up with some a lot funnier than those.

  The humor would be disarming, and belie the "bitter apostate" myth the JWs always believe.

  Any others to add to this?

  S4