Posts by Skeptic

7

Canadian Chaperons

by Skeptic in

jw
friends

i am amazed at some of the things that jws in the states worry about that canuck jws do not worry about.

chaperones are one area.. i remember reading in the mags that dating couples should have chaperones but have never heard of it being practiced, except in the u.s.. in canada, we figure if you are strong enough in the truth, you don't need a chaperone.

does some hanky-panky happen from time to time?

Skeptic

Well, I'll be. RunningMan and mindfield, that is the first time I heard of chaperones being used in Canada. I was a JW in Saskatchewan, Ontario, and Manitoba.

I read about it in the mags, but never knew anyone practiced it. I am surprised that the elder who studied with me didn't tell me about it as he was worried about my first wife (then fiancee) and me fooling around.

I never heard of anyone actually using a chaperone until I was on H2O.

mindfield, you had the right idea. Keep the appearances up, and let the couple do as they please in private. If they are quiet, you have deniability....

Richard

7

Canadian Chaperons

by Skeptic in

jw
friends

i am amazed at some of the things that jws in the states worry about that canuck jws do not worry about.

chaperones are one area.. i remember reading in the mags that dating couples should have chaperones but have never heard of it being practiced, except in the u.s.. in canada, we figure if you are strong enough in the truth, you don't need a chaperone.

does some hanky-panky happen from time to time?

Skeptic

I am amazed at some of the things that JWs in the States worry about that Canuck JWs do not worry about. Chaperones are one area.

I remember reading in the mags that dating couples should have chaperones but have never heard of it being practiced, except in the U.S.

In Canada, we figure if you are strong enough in the truth, you don't need a chaperone.

Does some hanky-panky happen from time to time? Well, yes, but it could happen even in congs that practice the chaperone thing.

I would never submit to a chaperone arrangement. How can you get to know a person with someone looking or listening in on you?

Richard, who wishes he had been more naughty when he dated...

9

ARE BETHELITES FREE LABOR?

by Pureheart in

jw
friends

bethelites are not free labor as we think.

he does pay his way.

most are unskilled when they first go to bethel.

Skeptic

Pureheart, your numbers are why to high. don't forget that Bethel is community-type living, the buildings are probably owned outright from the time construction is completed. Also, all funds and labour to build Bethel are donated to the Society.

Your prices seem to be normal business prices. Due to its size and the fact that funds are donated for everything, Bethel's costs are much lower.

All they have is operating costs.

Rent----------------$800.00 per month

No way, the building is free. There will be a small amount needed for materials for maintenance. There is no way this would reach $800/month per person. Plus the printing "business revenue" probably pays this cost in full.

Telephone---------$20.00 per month
If they have their own PBX, this cost will be close to zero. Plus the printing "business revenue" probably pays this cost in full.

Water--------------$20.00 per month
Per person? No way.

Maid Service-----$40.00 per week
Donated labour. Cost is utilites and food for maid.

Laundry-----------$15.00 per week
I do my laundry for $6 a week. If a person does theirs at home is is probably $10/two weeks. I'll bet Bethel's laundry is cheaper.

Meals--------------$15.00 per day (Restaurants)
Doubt it, but I am not sure.

Electric Service--$100.00 per month
For one person in a building where electricity is common to all? No way.

Health Insur. ----$77.00 per month
I don't know either way.

Allowance---------$100.00 per month
Your probably right on this one.

18

Christendom basically has it right!

by Amazing in

jw
friends

i saw yadirf's post (formerly friday on h20) barking about how christendom still has it all wrong regarding the trinity, immortal soul, all going to heaven, hellfire, jesus dying on a stake and not a cross, etc.. it is obvious that such people as yadirf have never visited a regular mainline church or he would not make such absurd claims, the very same idiotic claims touted by the watch tower lying and deceit society.. most christians and christian theologians do profess the trinity, in varied forms, but it is not a matter of salvation to accept it.

likewise for the soul, hell, the cross, etc.. genuine everyday christians are far more concerned about living a christian life, doing good, and following jesus.

they do witness, though informally as the spirit moves them ... which is a far more caring, considerate, and successful method then the watch tower door-to-door system.

Skeptic

Rev B,

Doctrines like trinity, immortal soul and burning hell aren't biblical true.

You are right about the Trinity, I have yet to see anyone prove the Trinity using only the Bible.

Your statement is not necessarily true regarding the immortal soul and a burning hell.

A knowledgable Jehovah's Witness can show you why the Bible does NOT support the immortal soul and a burning hell.

A knowledgable born-again Christian can show you why the Bible DOES support the immortal soul and a burning hell.

It is interesting to have a knowledgable born-again and a knowledgable JW face-off over these issues.

The truth is, the Bible contradicts itself or is vague in these areas. Both sides can make reasonable arguments and "prove" their view.

I used to believe both points of view at different times. I am not interested in the issue now, as I am an atheist and have little interest in proving what the Bible says on theological topics.

SS/Richard

34

Any athiests here had a demon experience?

by Marilyn in

jw
friends

i've made friends with a mormon lady, and she told me that her 14yo daughter has thrown out all four harry potter books because she's realised they are dabbling in and encouraging demons.

then she told me about her demon experiences herself.

has any exjw, of sound mind, had a proper demon experience (as opposed to improper!!)?

Skeptic

More to the point has any athiest here ever had a demon experience?

I did, but they were while I was religious and believed in such things. Since I became an atheist, I have had none.

Makes sense, since such experiences are often dependent on one's interpretation of events.

Oops, there was one "demonic" experience since I was an atheist. A headless man stood by my bed once. I immediately recognized it as caused by a sleep state, and thought the experience was really cool. The man seemed very real.

Marilyn, have you had any? I suspect you have very interesting sleep states.

Richard

26

Rome was especially ruthless

by Yadirf in

jw
friends

i found this interesting picture on a site someone here referenced today.

can you fathom being treated this way (persecuted) as apparently some christians were under the government of the roman empire?

(also, look at the ones impaled round about the arena there.

Skeptic

Thanks for the amicable greeting, and I hope that you’re getting along fine.

Thanks. I am fine here, and wish the same for you.

First of all, I’m really astonished when I hear someone say, as you just did: “If God existed …”
I really have a difficult time relating to anyone being an agnostic, and especially an atheist ... particularly for those having gotten in more than a few decades of living among the glories of God’s creation. It’s really something that’s totally beyond me, I’ll have to admit.

I can respect that. I understand why many people believe in God.

You’re not really making a statement like that while having a clear understanding of the basis for God’s bringing about Armageddon, I’m fairly sure of that. But that aside for a moment, do you mean to say that there is NEVER any justification for a human life being ended by force?

There are several reasons for a human life to be taken by force. Even innocent lives are sacrificed in times of war. These are usually called civilian casualties...

My view of the death penalty is mixed and under evaluation. In principle, I am for it. In practice, there are valid arguments against it. Innocent people have been on death row. An unusual number of poor black people are executed compared to rich white people. There are a few people I'd volunteer to adminster the death penalty to though; Clifford Olson and Paul Bernardo and his wife Karla come to mind.

What I cannot find justification for is genocide or ethnic cleansing. And that is basically what Armageddon is: the ethnic cleansing of non-JWs/non-born-agains/non-Christians, depending on your particuliar religious view. No or few excuses allowed for the unbelievers.

Millions Hindus would be killed, yet they have never heard of the Bible or JWs or being born-again.
Then you have Satan deceiving people into not following Jehovah properly. Is that fair?
Then you have babies being killed because their parents have the wrong beliefs. Is that fair?
Householders in field service are often too busy to be preached to. One man was wallpapering his house when I called. Because I could not convince him in 30 seconds to join my religion, due to the wallpaper soaking, he could die in Armageddon. That was when I started to realize that Armageddon was not just.

Richard

26

Rome was especially ruthless

by Yadirf in

jw
friends

i found this interesting picture on a site someone here referenced today.

can you fathom being treated this way (persecuted) as apparently some christians were under the government of the roman empire?

(also, look at the ones impaled round about the arena there.

Skeptic

Hi, Yadirf, it is good to see you back.

If I had a choice of either dying at the hand of men or dying at the hand of God, I'd choose the former. At least it will have been an unjustifiable death. What a disgrace it will be though to have been put to death by the judgement of God himself.

Many share your opinion, but I don't think many have considered that Hitler was evil for killing 6-10 million people. God plans on killing 6 billion people. That makes God far more heinous than Hitler.

If God existed and he was the kind of God that would destroy the majority of mankind, he would not be worthy of my worship. I would rather die than serve such a god. It would not be a disgrace for him to kill me, as I would not serve him out of my moral principles.

Richard

14

MAJOR MESSAGE FOR "WAITING"

by hawkaw in

jw
friends

waiting,.

i have provided the details of how to build a "nuclear hydrogen bomb" via your email.. if your reading this go to your email asap.. oh, if anyone has the urge keep bumping this to the top until "waiting" responds - please feel free.

thanks in advance.. hawk

Skeptic

Hi Hawk,

Are you the same hawk who wanted me to describe how the Society makes money from disaster relief?

I was too busy to answer your email and hotmail eventually killed your message to me, including your email address.

If you want, I can email you with the info. Just send me your email address again. Or, I can post a thread about it here.

Richard

30

God on Trial - #1

by Amazing in

jw
friends

premise: many who have read the bible over the centuries have accepted it as authoritatively from god, and have glossed over some glaring inconsistencies, contradictions, and shear nonsense.

some cultish groups have attempted to mimick the myths and twisted beliefs they have derived from the bible.

jehovah's witnesses are no exception to this.. this raises the questions: if the bible (as we know it) is from god, having his stamp of authorship and approval, then can we ever at some point raise serious questions about it?

Skeptic

Amazing,

So, it seems that even when Jesus Christ himself tried to clear up the marriage arrangement to be monogamus,

Where did Jesus say marriage had to be monogamous? He talked about divorce, but he never spoke against polygamy.

You may be thinking of what Jesus said at Matt. 19:4, 5...the WTBS interprets this to say Jesus was promoting monogamy, but if you read the account, he is talking about divorce.

The reason I am asking you this is that I wrote a page on polygamy, and I want to keep my facts straight. My page on polygamy is at: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Aegean/2260/bible/polygamy.html

7

Why arn't these things in the bible?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

i just been wondering recently about the bible and it's content.. there are certain things that seem to be basic principles that humans have gradualy built up an understanding of through the ages and have advanced mankind in numerous ways.. so if the bible is gods word to man why didn't he mention these things earlier.. 1.germs.

humans have only recently come to understand the concept of germs and what they do and how to get rid of them.. imagine the suffering that could have been releaved through the ages if humans had been taugh by god about germs or bacteria .the black death need never had happened.. 2 logic.

why didn't he teach about how to come to logical and sound conclusions when confronted by an argument?.

Skeptic

AS IF JAH would sanction "holy" wars.

Uh, have you ever read the OT? Need I say more?

Richard