My prediction is that it will refer to the "sealed" Jewish Christians from the first and second centuries, including some gentiles, as it appears to indicate resurrection. Whereas the Great Crowd is depicted in terms of survival, coming out of a great tribulation, which would involve anyone confessing faith in Christ whose destiny is Paradise on earth.
ukpimo
JoinedPosts by ukpimo
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135
Rumour 144,000 literal number teaching to be abandoned at Annual Meeting
by slimboyfat insay it ain’t so!
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in one sense it’s a no brainer because the figures just don’t add up any more.. in another (negative) sense it’s a no brainer because it’s been fundamental to jws since year dot and might undermine the whole thing?
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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ukpimo
Peacefulpete
I'm afraid your comment is nonsensical, as Jesus isn't ever described as passing through crowds and walls, as if he can morph his way through them as you might see in some sci fi or supernatural films. And Jesus isn't analogous with Apollo or Shiva. He's practically treated as a local magician by his people. Even the book of Mark portrays Jesus in a more realistic light than John. Either way, all gospels agree that Jesus had some sort of supernatural powers, but this didn't make him a supernatural being.
TonusOH,
You appear to be making a point without making a point, I don't seem to understand you. So you're saying there is an off chance that someone could be believable, but only if we actually lived at the time that person lived? And yet the Gospels acknowledge a very human trait that Jesus himself said in John 10:24 - 26
Then the Jews surrounded him and began to say to him: “How long are you going to keep us in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly.”
Jesus answered them: “I told you, and yet you do not believe. The works that I am doing in my Father’s name, these bear witness about me. But you do not believe, because you are not my sheep."
NWT
Jesus himself said that you have to be a sheep. As ironic as it is, if you're not a sheep, you'll never believe. And you prove that true.
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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ukpimo
Exactly TonusOh
"We are confident that Joseph Smith existed and that he established a new branch of Christianity, but we do not believe that his addendum to the Bible is legitimate"
I wasn't saying that a Christian's view of their religion proves the legitimacy of the Bible. You have helped prove a point, I too believe Jesus existed, but that doesn't mean certain extravagant details are legitimate. This doesn't however take away the need for faith in a man who proves to be more of a pacifist than Joseph Smith and Muhammad, Mr Smith being a sex mad polygamous chap and Muhammad being a fanatic who would justify bloodshed in the name of his religion.
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53
WTS 2024 Annual Business Meeting ...
by careful in... is just three weeks from this saturday.
the org has been tight-lipped, really, successfully secret about advance info on these in recent years,.
now that these relatively recent changes on dress and grooming, reporting fs time, judicial matters, etc.
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ukpimo
Watch this space on Saturday. I will do my best. -
189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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ukpimo
We have entered a very deep and dark place, I don't think some here even want to attempt to investigate anything or to build faith in Jesus. Criticise, criticise, criticise. Playing with words constantly. For flip sake, just read the gospels objectively, study what bible scholars have committed on Jesus and you can see for yourself that this man did exist. For if a person called Jesus Christ didn't exist at one stage, then Christians made themselves up from some literary fandom they created, which doesn't give much credibility to the fact that they had enemies who actively opposed them in the first century, including the Romans, who alluded to the fact they were followers of Jesus. So if the Jews were lying and the Romans were lying, my God maybe we should question if the Romans and the Jews back then ever existed!
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how do you feel about the use of the name Jehovah now?
by enoughisenough infor those who still believe in god and the bible, how do you feel/think about the name jehovah now?
i am one who never wanted to bring reproach on god's name.
i will admit using the word jehovah now makes me feel rather icky...like i am promoting a lie of sorts.
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ukpimo
Duran, although this is a clever breakdown, there is a major flaw in your reasoning. You forget that Je is not correct, it should be Yah. So in actuality the correct pronunciation of the tetragrammaton in Hebrew would be Yah • ho • ah. Other languages are bound to present a lesser variation of the original name. Although I would much prefer my name to be used in English, I wouldn't be butthurt if someone from another land pronounced it differently according to their language, so there is where I do agree with jws, I don't think the Almighty of the Universe will get angry for pronouncing his name as Jehovah in English. Besides, English is a modern language, and it has influences from many other languages.
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53
WTS 2024 Annual Business Meeting ...
by careful in... is just three weeks from this saturday.
the org has been tight-lipped, really, successfully secret about advance info on these in recent years,.
now that these relatively recent changes on dress and grooming, reporting fs time, judicial matters, etc.
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ukpimo
Rumour says that the "Sing out Joyfully" songbook is being increased to 200 songs.
And another speculation has started resurfacing that there will be an updated Revelation Cimax book, either announced at the AGM or via a JW Broadcast or GB Update in due time. The speculation is based on the idea that the GB have released brand new artwork for Revelation, in their bible drama at the convention this year. The slow moving images had a similar style to the ones eventually used in the Pure Worship book. It is worth noting that some of those images appeared on Broadcasts and publications prior to the release of Pure Worship. A similar thing happened before the release of the book Lessons you Can Learn From The Bible. Watchtower tends to follow a predictable pattern, they can’t resist using new artwork prior to official release in a publication.
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189
What evidence is there for a biblical jesus?
by Touchofgrey inis there any independently verified evidence that a miracle worker called jesus existed and did the things that the bible said he did?.
the four gospels were written by unknown authors many decades after the so called events, so can't be considered as eyewitness accounts.
i think that there may have been a apocalyptic preacher who was executed by the romans and the story evolved from their.
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ukpimo
Like many very good and well-natured men, Jesus did not leave this world with archaeological or pictorial evidence. Rather, he left with anecdotal evidence in the minds and hearts of those who actually loved him. Jesus was hated by many religious leaders because he was a man of the people. He actually cared about the welfare of others and called out hypocritical and deceptive men. Of course, such a bold and honest person would attract considerable hatred and opposition. And of course, these men in power would do anything they can to wipe away from history the memory of a man who was significantly better than they were. Many good men have indeed been wiped out of history, but not Jesus. Christianity helped keep the memory of Christ alive and well for centuries. And of course I believe in his miracles. Who wouldn't? Only those who had the mindset of those hypocritical religious leaders who claimed they were better than Jesus and also asserted that he used the power of Beelzebub. Sacrilege! Jesus was the Son of God on earth! The Messiah! No one else has a name so great under heaven. To reject Jesus means to reject the way to eternal life.
And of course, that doesn't mean following a religious organization, or even a religion. Jesus simply started a new way of life to a future life to come, not a religion. The start of Christianity as we know it was Paul's fault, don't get me into that one.
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135
Rumour 144,000 literal number teaching to be abandoned at Annual Meeting
by slimboyfat insay it ain’t so!
.
in one sense it’s a no brainer because the figures just don’t add up any more.. in another (negative) sense it’s a no brainer because it’s been fundamental to jws since year dot and might undermine the whole thing?
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ukpimo
Although the "it's a figurative number" line may be used, does it really add up? Does it really make sense? In the numerology of Revelation you have single numbers, then you have the 24 elders, then you have mentioned 12,000 from each tribe of Israel connected with the total number 144,000. It would be more feasible to stick with a literal number approach for most interpretations in the book, considering Jesus will rule for a literal 1000 years. This stupid "figurative" approach makes no sense whatsoever. It's either a number, or it isn't!
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135
Rumour 144,000 literal number teaching to be abandoned at Annual Meeting
by slimboyfat insay it ain’t so!
.
in one sense it’s a no brainer because the figures just don’t add up any more.. in another (negative) sense it’s a no brainer because it’s been fundamental to jws since year dot and might undermine the whole thing?
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ukpimo
I can't see this happening unless they were releasing a revised Revelation book! Then in that instance they would have an excuse to change their doctrine concerning the 144,000.