Posts by Sunbeam

10

scriptural intentional distortions

by tosko in

hi all!.

can anyone point out clear and intentional distortions in jws translations and interpretations?

dishonesty in translation?

Sunbeam

Hiya

You might find the following useful - especially the part about the NWT.

http://www.kevinquick.com/kkministries/books/reasoning/

In terms of deliberate distortion and divergence from mainstream Christianity, you will see that there is a pattern. Scriptures that relate to the deity of Christ and the work of the holy spirit, in particular, have been rendered in such a way that they support the org's continued power over their members.

E.g. Christ could not die for everyone's sins (he was only a man not God and so could only die to cover a man's, Adam's, sins) so you have to work for your own salvation.
E.g. the holy spirit is just an 'active force' rather than the power of God and the way in which God dwells in believers.

Upshot - you have to do all the good works we suggest (meetings, door-to-door) in the hope that you can earn your way into paradise, and you can't understand the Bible without us.

Contrast with mainstream Christianity - Christ died for everyone's sins so that those who trust in him can know they are saved and don't have to work for salvation, the holy spirit 'will teach us all things' and help us to grow as Christians and the result will be good works - so no-one needs an org to set standards, rules, translate the bible etc.

WTS - do everything we tell you all your life and you might be saved.
Mainstream Christianity - Christ's perfect standards are unattainable so we can never get there this side of heaven, Christians are to meet to encourage and support each other in their journey.

As well as deliberate mis-translation (sometimes in accordance with the view held by a minority of 'scholars'), texts are taken out of context or mis-interpreted, generally to create a fear of Satan/outsiders/people who have left the sect/dying at Armageddon - i.e. create phobias. At the same time, the WT proclaims itself and its members as the only true Christians - hence the arrogant, self-righteous attitute of many JWs. This is all supported by jargon and buzzwords that only JW's understand.

Thesis have already been written about some of these topics. Like the rest of us, you'll just need to spend plenty of time online, reading and digesting.

BTW, their may be differing opinions about minor points within mainstream Christianity - but the churches are in agreement about the important points: deity of Christ, work of the holy spirit, resurrection, etc. People shouldn't be thrown out for having their own opinions, as they are with the WTS.

Good luck. Would be interested in seeing the finished work if you decide to go ahead.

Sunbeam
xxxx

59

Guilt over Self-Pleasuring as a Dub. You?

by Lari in

i'm wondering if any of you suffered major guilt over getting yourself off while a dub.

or did you all manage to abstain until you left?

i know it was one of the main reasons i left.

Sunbeam

Hey alliwanna

Where do you get that from?

No, my long-suffering husband, now he's a confirmed ex-JW, likes to kid that now I'm a Christian (long, complicated story), Jesus wants me for a sunbeam.

Love
Sunbeam
xxxx

59

Guilt over Self-Pleasuring as a Dub. You?

by Lari in

i'm wondering if any of you suffered major guilt over getting yourself off while a dub.

or did you all manage to abstain until you left?

i know it was one of the main reasons i left.

Sunbeam

Hey Geordie,

Does your name mean you're a northerner?

Just wondering...

Sunbeam (in Gateshead)
xxxx

16

Part 3: The October Surprise!

by Amazing in

part 3: the october surprise!

jws were very eager about world events peace and security: the worldwide pronouncement of peace and security has been a prophetic mantra of the jw religion since before i became associated in 1968. and now, at long last, it was finally upon us!

true, 1975 had not brought armageddon, just as 1914 did not bring it either.

Sunbeam

Brilliant writing, Amazing! Thanks.

You've shown how hard it is for JW's who have invested so much time, energy and emotion in the org to leave it. Even firm evidence that the WT is in error can be rejected in favour of the 'bigger picture' and the hope that things will change. And there's always that fear that Satan has had a hand in the doubting process!

This also helps to explain why I've got a 50-something JW mother-in-law (30+ years in) who refuses to 'see the light'.

God bless
Sunbeam
xxxx

15

Where is the Truth???????

by BC in

jw
friends

i studied with the jws for a number of years and i found that on your doorstep they were the friendliest people in the world, but the firsrt time i stepped into the kh, with the exception of a few they didn't want to know!!!!!!!!!

i sat on a chair alone for the whole of most meetings, sometimes i even had a whole row to myself.. i then began to realise that i was only a statistic on a monthly report card.

in other words if someone was pioneering or it was raining they only had to come and see me to make their hours up.. question the blood issue and they will walk past your house with their heads down and push your magazines through the letter box when they know you are out to avoid seeing you.. i love my family, but according to the jws my lovely husband, my children and my grandaughter who i love more than life itself have no chance in the new system.

Sunbeam

Hi BC

...and welcome to the board from a fellow UK-er!

You asked 'Where is the Truth?' If you want the truth about the WT, I think you've already worked that out for yourself. There are plenty of links at the bottom of this page that will reinforce your conclusions.

From a Christian perspective, no-one and no religion can claim to have it. That's because Jesus himself is 'the Way, the Truth and the Life'.

If you are interested in joining a Christian religion, simply find a church that teaches that you have to be in Jesus rather than in their organisation. In the UK, I've generally found that the Baptist churches' teachings are quite sound from a biblical point of view (I think they are very different from the US 'fundy' version). My church is Anglican, but not all of them are following biblical guidelines.

Good luck in your search for truth. I hope you find the answers that you are looking for.

Love
Sunbeam
xxxx

13

Just My Story

by malian in

i would like to post my personal experience here because i can't tell anyone else.

i met my boyfriend when i was 15--i am 20 now.

we couldn't help falling in love, and we both made extreme sacrifices to be together.

Sunbeam

Hi Cello

Don't get me wrong - there were LOTS of hurt feelings. Hope you can find a way to reach her.

TP - your post was extremely verbose, but I have to say that I agree with every word. I would add that the simplest way to avoid being sucked into a Bible-based cult is to reject any organisation that says you need Christ plus something else, e.g. plus be in our club, plus do everything we say, plus don't grow a beard, etc.

Love
Sunbeam
xxxx

16

Woman turns tables on JWs

by QCA1 in

jw
friends

hello everyone.

i would like to share this with you.in the daily mail newspaper today there was an article about a woman who was so fed up of the jws calling at her home(which they have done for the past 12yrs)she decided to stop them once and for all,each time they called she told them she was not interested but they still came,so,the other day she went to the kh whilst there was a service and knocked on the door until someone answered,when they did they were not amused,the woman then started to ask completely irrelevant questions,she remained there for about 30 minutes then the police arrived to remove her,she went quietly and said she did it to prove a point.. paul gillies, spokesman for the jws in britain,said "representives did stop calling at homes if asked",he says "if someone states they do not want a visit we make a note and avoid calling",he also says that "we go to peoples homes because we are obedient to jesus's message,we want to spread the word of jesus and offer bible studies.if people phone our national headquarters saying they didn't want visits we would contact their local congregation and let them know".. i hope you don't mind me sharing this with you guys

Sunbeam

Hi Nic

Thanks for the greeting. And nice site!

Sunbeam

16

Woman turns tables on JWs

by QCA1 in

jw
friends

hello everyone.

i would like to share this with you.in the daily mail newspaper today there was an article about a woman who was so fed up of the jws calling at her home(which they have done for the past 12yrs)she decided to stop them once and for all,each time they called she told them she was not interested but they still came,so,the other day she went to the kh whilst there was a service and knocked on the door until someone answered,when they did they were not amused,the woman then started to ask completely irrelevant questions,she remained there for about 30 minutes then the police arrived to remove her,she went quietly and said she did it to prove a point.. paul gillies, spokesman for the jws in britain,said "representives did stop calling at homes if asked",he says "if someone states they do not want a visit we make a note and avoid calling",he also says that "we go to peoples homes because we are obedient to jesus's message,we want to spread the word of jesus and offer bible studies.if people phone our national headquarters saying they didn't want visits we would contact their local congregation and let them know".. i hope you don't mind me sharing this with you guys

Sunbeam

Hi QCA1 and welcome!

It's good to see another fellow Brit on the board. To post on a specific forum, simply go to the top of the page and click on All Forums. You will then be able to select the Personal Experience section.

Best wishes
Sunbeam
(Tyneside)
xxxx

49

The Baby and the Bath Water

by NeonMadman in

jw
friends

the other day, i was messaged by a young jw guy (using yahoo messenger, where i am breezyone2001; chat me up, gang!).

his opening line to me was, "why are you attacking the witnesses?

" i responded by asking him in what way i was attacking the witnesses, and he said that he saw my name in a yahoo club for ex-jw's.

Sunbeam

Hi folks

Just another evangelical checking in .

Interesting topic, NM. I'll be interested to read other people's replies to your original question.

I was never a JW, but my husband was. When he finally accepted that the WT was a cult, it was a relief for him. He'd left still thinking that it had the truth.

We've done a lot of research - freeminds, past WT's, the Bible, etc - and now he generally agrees with mainstream Protestant theology, but isn't remotely interested in being involved. He describes his faith as dead rather than living - it's only in his head, not his heart.

All the fallout as a result of leaving the society and debating the doctrines of the WT ad nauseum has 'innoculated' him in a sense.

BTW, I think I read that Randy was a Christian before he joined the JW's too...wasn't it via a Billy Graham talk?

Love
Sunbeam
xxxx

PS LoneWolf - I always love your insightful threads. Looking forward to part 2.

13

Just My Story

by malian in

i would like to post my personal experience here because i can't tell anyone else.

i met my boyfriend when i was 15--i am 20 now.

we couldn't help falling in love, and we both made extreme sacrifices to be together.

Sunbeam

Hi Malian

I'm so sorry that you had to lose your boyfriend this way. I too fell for a witness, he was 20, brought up in the religion and truly believed that the WT had the truth. Their logical arguments in support of their doctrines are very compelling and he believed that he had looked into the subject and come to the right conclusion. Of course, he had been protected from hearing 'apostate' views. And he had ready answers for the usual questions - 1975, etc.

So when I started to raise issues with his beliefs - why does God want you to die rather than have a blood transfusion, where does this religion originate, how many people in the religion have completed higher education, how can you believe that Adam and Eve story - he thought that I was attacking him for being stupid enough to hold these beliefs. I didn't realise this. I was just trying to make him think. And the natural witness reaction to negative info about the WT is to reject the messenger.

He was on the edge of the religion - long-haired, a bit of an 'independent thinker' - but was still under its spell. Eventually we split up and then I began my research in earnest.

A year later, I got back in touch. He had been thinking about the things that I'd said and had stopped attending meetings. Within a year we were married. Meanwile, through my on-line research I had become convinced of the truth and wisdom of the Bible. Via my local church's web site and Randy's free minds site, I learned the real truth and am now a born again Christian.

I don't want to get your hopes up of a reunion with your boyfriend. Obviously, every situation is different. But you might have planted some doubts that will bear fruit in the future. Having a 'worldly' girlfriend will have put him under a lot of pressure for 5 years. In the end, the WT's mind control sucked him back in. It was probably the only way that he could cope with the dissonance in his mind. If it's possible, perhaps you could try to keep the door of friendship open, just in case he needs you in years to come.

I'm glad that you've found this forum. It does help to talk to others that understand. Hope to hear more from you.

Oops, rambled on a bit...

Love
Sunbeam
xxxx