Posts by Sunchild

27

TRUE Christian Ex-negro Ministry!

by Kent in

jw
friends

we(tm)re standing for the truth that negroes can change.

a recent gathering of christians invoking god(tm)s old testament standards, a nationwide ex-negro ministry, drew more than 850 people to london, england, to proclaim that hope for change is possible for those still struggling with acting like a negro.

thousands of former colored people can celebrate a new life because someone cared enough to share with them the truth of god's healing love.

Sunchild

Hi, Shelby!

As for Lisa's comments and yours about blacks and homosexuality, I think Lisa MEANT that if you WANTED to hide your orientation (not necessarily would or needed to, but WANTED to), you could. However, unless one is extremely pale, one cannot 'hide' being black.

And my point was that I don't understand how that's relevant. The entire point of the satire Kent posted was to illustrate how silly it was to discriminate against people. If it's wrong to discriminate against Black people -- who cannot change their color -- why is it any more "acceptable" to discriminate against gay people, who also cannot change who they are? That was the point, I think. Nothing more; nothing less. JanH articulated this better than I probably could.

Moreover, I think it's actually more stressful to have an "invisible" trait that people might hate you for. Keeping such a very big secret can be quite a drain, with all the fear of being discovered and having to pretend you're something you're not. I guess that's why, since I live in a liberal climate, I don't make any effort to hide who I am... except, unfortunately, in front of my own parents.

It just seems to me that the PROBLEM is people using race as a means to 'inflame' others. On both sides.

I dunno, I just didn't take this as being "inflamatory" myself. It was simply a means of proving a point. I know that Kent isn't a racist person, and I knew what the meaning of the post was. I also knew that the stereotypes given in the post were just another way of bringing that point home. Stereotyping homosexuals -- especially by people who make a conscious effort to avoid them and don't even try to understand them -- is just as silly as stereotyping Blacks. Again, as someone who fits into both categories, I think it's a fair tactic.

Kent should have stated his INTENT when posting such a provocative statement.

This, I agree with. A disclaimer of some sort might've been a good idea, though it might've dulled the impact a bit.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

27

TRUE Christian Ex-negro Ministry!

by Kent in

jw
friends

we(tm)re standing for the truth that negroes can change.

a recent gathering of christians invoking god(tm)s old testament standards, a nationwide ex-negro ministry, drew more than 850 people to london, england, to proclaim that hope for change is possible for those still struggling with acting like a negro.

thousands of former colored people can celebrate a new life because someone cared enough to share with them the truth of god's healing love.

Sunchild

One of the reasons being, if you or anyone else wishes to keep your homosexuality a 'secret' for even a little while for even a small purpose from a group of people, you can do that. Can you leave your house with white skin?

I didn't expect most straight people to understand this, but for me, it IS about the same thing.

How would YOU feel if you needed to hide your true self from people for fear of being fired from your job, evicted from your home, beaten, or even killed? It DOES happen! How would YOU feel if you had to hide your love relationships from your own family instead of celebrating them? How would YOU feel if when everyone else was talking about their significant others around the water cooler, you had to keep quiet for fear that the wrong people might hear? How would YOU feel if you had to be subjected to people's ignorant "fag" and "lezzie" jokes, which DO hurt every bit as much as racist ones!

As a Black lesbian, I think I have every right to say, yes, it's a comparable pain! But only it's illegal to fire people just for being Black. Sure, I can hide my lesbianism, but that does NOT make it go away. And it isn't right that I should have to.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

27

TRUE Christian Ex-negro Ministry!

by Kent in

jw
friends

we(tm)re standing for the truth that negroes can change.

a recent gathering of christians invoking god(tm)s old testament standards, a nationwide ex-negro ministry, drew more than 850 people to london, england, to proclaim that hope for change is possible for those still struggling with acting like a negro.

thousands of former colored people can celebrate a new life because someone cared enough to share with them the truth of god's healing love.

Sunchild

Just for the record, Kent, I got the joke. And I think the reaction you got proves just the point you were trying to make.

Everyone, just substitute "homosexual" for "Negro" and I think you'll understand.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

90

Complement a Poster

by Black Man in

jw
friends

here's your chance to complement a poster whose posts make you think, make you mad, make you laugh, make you cry.

i usually find something that i dig in everybody's post around these parts.

but i'll single out some peeps in particular.

Sunchild

Hm, I'm almost afraid to post anything here because I know I'll have to leave people out, and I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings. So, before that happens, I just want to thank everyone here simply for being themselves. I've probably read something that's been posted by just about everyone who's posted here since I signed on, and it's good that there's so much variety. The constant appearance of new stuff and the nice mix of different ideas are what keep me coming back.

Seems like all the usual suspects have been named already, so I'll just say, "What everybody else said." That, and:

JanH, believe it or not, I like you. I don't always like the way you go about things (you do sometimes give the impression that anyone who isn't an all-or-nothing atheist must have something wrong with them), but I do like you. I really do enjoy reading your posts on the Bible, [the Xtian version of] God, etc., because the historical and scientific facts you present are very interesting. It's just the "opinion" stuff where we might disagree.

Farkel, I don't even know why I'm telling you this since it probably doesn't mean much coming from someone who likely means nothing to you. But I've enjoyed your posts since the H2O days. You're smart, articulate and funny, and your writing is a pleasure to read. Thank you for all of your good work.

Anyone who's ever posted something for me (or sent me a rare e-mail) that I didn't answer, I apologize. I know it's awful manners, but I really don't do it on purpose, and I'm not trying to ignore anyone. I always want desperately to say something more meaningful/clever/useful than just, "Hey, thanks!" -- and usually end up not saying anything. I have the same problem in real life.

And for all my fellow "invisible posters" out there that no one has mentioned by name, hang in there. Even if feel like no one cares about what you have to say, it's a pretty safe bet that someone somewhere has read and appreciated something that you've written. Just keep on thinking, caring and posting. You never know what the result will be, even if you're never told.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

42

Atheists at it again

by Rex B13 in

jw
friends

the site changed but the atheist proseletyzing continues.

isn't it odd how our two norwigs compliment each other in their attacks on god and the bible?

well, simon, you now have the honor of hosting a platform for the true apostates to spew their anti-god venom.. this kind of thing is sadly typical of those who leave the wts.

Sunchild

They ignore the stunning events of changed lives that follows a true conversion to Christianity.

My mother found "real Christianity" about six months or so before I left the Borg. Before that unfortunate event, I felt safe discussing anything with her since I knew that she would always love and accept me for what I was as long as I didn't hurt anyone.

Since her finding "real Christianity," though, Mom and I aren't quite as close as we used to be. You should have seen the look of sheer horror on her face when I so much as hinted at my having non-Christian beliefs. She even went so far as to tell me that she hoped I would "do the right thing before it was too late." The "right thing" being, of course, abandoning the path that feels most fulfilling and natural to me in favor of the idea that some boogeyman underground is out to get me, and that some boogeyman in the sky is going to send me to Hell if I don't constantly grovel before him and apologize for being born.

Needless to say, I haven't quite worked up the guts to tell Mom that I practice Wicca. Goddess help me when I tell her that I prefer women. But before Mom found "real Christianity," both of these things would have been non-issues. I wish I had my mother back.

They ignore the mountainous evidence of the resurrection as a fact provable in a court of law.

As others here have asked, where is it? Show me the proof.

Now, backtracking a bit....

...and those who do not want to face the fact that a life without eternity in mind is a wasted life.

*scratches her head* Why? If this is all I get, this is all I get, so I might as well make the best of it. To me, a "wasted life" is a life that's spent in fear.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

43

photo of 'the Princess'

by Mulan in

jw
friends

the regulars here may remember that my daughter starting posting here last week, under the name princess.

in chat, people have asked if she is pretty, and i say she is.

she also looks just like me, but thinner, and prettier.

Sunchild

Venice,

You were right the first time haha it's none of your business hahah!!!!

Pity, if you'd told him yes, I would've taken that as license to flirt outrageously with you at every opportunity.

*Rochelle.

108

What drives exJWs to atheism?

by ros in

jw
friends

a significant number of former jehovah's witnesses come out of the watchtower still believing the bible and considering themselves christians.

most coming out are in a serious state of bewilderment, and they look intently and sincerely for something to fill the huge void of lost religion, lost family and friends, and lost fellowship.

they seek some viable spiritual association with others of like mind while at the same time having become very wary of any organized religion.. what is it that eventually draws so many of us (not me) to agnosticism or atheism?

Sunchild

Larc,

Can there be a reconciliation between the scientific, rational, and even atheist position and the concept of spirituality? I think it depends on how you define spirituality. If if involves spirits, invisible creatures, atheists would say no. If you define spirituality as your core value system in combination with inner sometimes unconscious, motives and fears along with your ability to tap into this "spirituality", then atheists would be more likely accept this concept of spirituality.

From what I've seen, it's not that simple. I acutally started a thread once called "Defining Spirituality." It was a completely open-ended question, and I encouraged people to post their personal definitions, not what other people or sources told them. In my own definition, I made it clear that I thought of spirituality as something you must find within yourself, not in books, not in gurus, not in some external thing you might name "God."

As far as I recall, only one atheist responded. S/he made it clear that in his (or her) mind, spirituality was a concept inextricably linked with the God he no longer believed in, and that it had no place in his life. Even when given the opportunity to state his beliefs free of rules, constraints, or any expectations save that it must be his own personal view, not someone else's, he still linked it to "God," as in some mean old man in the sky. For me, that's a strange way of seeing things, although I do understand how it could happen after being spiritually raped by the Borg. But it doesn't have to be that way if you don't want it to. And not everyone who wanders in here wants it to.

The reason I post stuff like this is to show any lurkers, questioners, etc., who might be feeling spiritually vulnerable right now that fundamentalist Christianity and fundamentalist Atheism aren't the only options, and that they don't have to feel bullied or pressured into accepting either path if it isn't right for them. Having a spiritual life/beliefs doesn't mean that you have to surrender your brain or that others have the right to belittle you for it, and even being an atheist doesn't mean you have to surrender your spiritual life. There's plenty of room for variety and seeking one's own truth, and no one should be denied that chance by people who want to force their choices on others as the only viable option.

I should probably post a mini-thesis on my beliefs about God/dess and spirituality just to clear up where I'm coming from. <g> I'll bet that even then, though, someone will find something there to argue with.

Take care,

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

7

Ah, the sweet taste of freedom!

by Sunchild in

jw
friends

today, i did a couple of things that i never would've or could've done had i remained a jw.

first of all, i spent the first half of my day being a promotional model for snapple.

my job: smiling, looking cute, and handing out free snapple drinks.

Sunchild

Today, I did a couple of things that I never would've or could've done had I remained a JW. First of all, I spent the first half of my day being a promotional model for Snapple. My job: smiling, looking cute, and handing out free Snapple drinks. How I got it: I posted my picture on a model/talent search site just for the heck of it, and a placement agency thought I was right for the job. The pay: $124 for basically doing nothing.

And second... since the tryouts were held in the general area... I decided to try out for the game show "The Weakest Link." Long story short, I made the semi-finals! I'll find out sometime in July if they'll be flying me to California for the final interview, but most people don't even make it *this* far. It's incredible. I may yet get my chance to meet my dear "Mistress Anne" in person.

Just wanted to inject a little needed positivity to this message board and let everybody know that, yes, there IS life after the Tower. If I had been a JW and still paranoid like I was back then about "being greedy" and "drawing glory to myself," I never could have taken advantage of these very cool opportunities.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

108

What drives exJWs to atheism?

by ros in

jw
friends

a significant number of former jehovah's witnesses come out of the watchtower still believing the bible and considering themselves christians.

most coming out are in a serious state of bewilderment, and they look intently and sincerely for something to fill the huge void of lost religion, lost family and friends, and lost fellowship.

they seek some viable spiritual association with others of like mind while at the same time having become very wary of any organized religion.. what is it that eventually draws so many of us (not me) to agnosticism or atheism?

Sunchild

Hello again, Jan. And also again, you're trying to find hidden meanings where there really are none.

So, essentially, what you decided to tell the world, was that there exists atheists who are arrogant.

No, I said that some atheists hold the same kind of obnoxious, pig-headed, "Nobody's got the truth but us" kind of arrogance that Xtian Fundies do. In other words, from what I've seen, it's just opposite sides of the same coin. I thought I'd made it plain as day (if in somewhat more delicate terms), but for some odd reason, you want to find something else, and I really don't know what you're looking for. What more do you want me to say? Could you at least throw me a clue?

And you still haven't answered my question. What, exactly, are you trying to prove?

*Rochelle, curious.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

16

Beauty..Where is it? What is it?

by ISP in

jw
friends

what makes someone 'beautiful' to you?

has it changed over the years, so that you consider something else?

what attracts you to someone?

Sunchild

This question is actually part of the reason why I figured out I'm a lesbian. No matter how I wanted to or told myself I could and should, I could never see past a man's looks, no matter how much I liked him otherwise. Is he five pounds overweight? That's disgusting. I don't want him touching me. Does he look... well... too masculine? Ugly. I don't want him touching me. With a woman, though, looks don't really matter as long she treats me right and we have enough in common. It isn't something I can help, though I tried to for awhile. But I think I'm only about a 5 on the Kinsey scale, not a 6:

Or would it be the Leonardo DiCaprio/Johnathon Rhys Meyers feminine type look that may suggest a caring and affectionate person?

Assuming that Leo has slimmed back down.... I wouldn't really want either of them for myself, but I can't say I'd mind seeing them make out with each other.

*Rochelle.

---------
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."