no.
Ok, I don't actually know, but I would guess that all nations have had the gospel preached in them by now and the only end of the world we've had so far was 1975.
terraly
JoinedPosts by terraly
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7
Funny thing, religion.....
by JW72 init's not really, but, what can ya do?!.
i was just thinking, is matt 24:14 meant to be taken literally as the dubs do??.
that's my question, someone please answer..... chris.
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272
McVeigh vs Death Penalty
by Amazing ini am a policitcal conservative, at least a fiscal conservative and sociel moderate.
i support the death penalty, but i agree that our judicial system needs to overhaul how wwe treat criminals to achieve better rehabilitation results.
and of course, withhold the death penalty in cases where there could be doubt.. in mcveigh's case, i believe that he deserves the death penalty.
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terraly
Oh, and AG:
The reason the two posts look the same is that both were created using the LaTeX document typesetting environment, which is the standard for scientific paper and book writing. The formatting shown there is almost exactly the default formatting that this typesetting package provides- you'll see exactly the same thing in thousands and thousands of scientific papers.
Normally I wouldn't get involved in this fight, but I've been using LaTeX to lay-out my finals paper for the term, and I just wanted to give it some good press, because it's a wonderful layout environment. I recommend "A Document Preparation System LaTeX" by Leslie Lamport (the creator of LaTeX) for anyone who wants to learn it.
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272
McVeigh vs Death Penalty
by Amazing ini am a policitcal conservative, at least a fiscal conservative and sociel moderate.
i support the death penalty, but i agree that our judicial system needs to overhaul how wwe treat criminals to achieve better rehabilitation results.
and of course, withhold the death penalty in cases where there could be doubt.. in mcveigh's case, i believe that he deserves the death penalty.
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terraly
In anthropology we heard the example of some hunter/gatherer society (it might have been the !Kung, but I'm not sure) who had the death penalty.
When someone was found guilty of murder the entire community (only about 20-30) would all take part in the execution, which was normally done by stabbing with spears, everyone being forced to take part, thus driving home the point that everyone was a member of the society which was executing this person, and everyone was responsible for his death.
This seems at least honest- whether you respect the moral code of these people on the subject of capital punishment, I think it was very wise of them to institute this policy so that everyone knows exactly what the death penalty means, and everyone bears part of the weight and responsibility of it.
I personally am against the death penalty anyway, but if I had to physically help kill some of the criminals (as opposed to only financially) I know I would be much more firmly opposed.
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Deism- A Religion for the 21st Century?
by Big Jim indeism - a religion for the 21st century?.
more than 200 yrs ago deism made its mark on history.
many noteworthy people including a number of the founders of the united states were deists.
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terraly
While you know very little about the origin of the universe, astronomers know a lot more. However, since the universe is by definition everything, it did not originate by an external cause. It came to be as an uncaused event. There is, by definition, no such thing as "before the universe came to be."
Well, "know" is a very strong word. We have a theory, it fits certain facts and has problems with other ones. In my cosmology course last term our instructor guaranteed us that most of what he was teaching us was probably wrong- the point of the class was to learn how to evaluate the current evidence and the evidence that will be produced in the future. He always said, "Would I lie to you?" (WILTY) when telling us a possible lie.
Some physicist once said, "Cosmologists are always wrong and never unsure."
It isn't really relevant to the main thrust of the discussion, since I think we're making acceptable progress toward a description of the early universe, but there are still many unanswered questions. It is meaningless to speculate about "before the big bang", certainly from a scientific point of few, even if it came out of the collapse of a prior universe there is fundamentally no way to recover this information (WILTY?).
Philosophically however, the argument is not as neat as you would make it. To insist that everything has a cause today, and then define the first event as having no cause... well, it must be true of course, but on the other hand, how can it be? If the universe could "just become" without cause (as it must have), then why can things today not "just become" without cause too? Perhaps they can.
This is why God still has a place in things. You can postulate God as some sort of special different thing, not bound by causation like matter- you can postulate that a God can "just be" only once, eliminating the worry about other universes springing into "just being" without cause.
Answering the question "by definition" normally raises lots of other questions.
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For XJWBill - about the Evil Christianity
by Norm inhello bill,.
i have been away for a while so i didnt see your reply to my post about the final solution.
posted: may 25, 2001 1:50:01 am .
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terraly
Hi Norm,
I agree with you that Christianity has been a vehicle for evil, but I don't accept that it is fundamentally to blame for the fact that people are rotten to each other.
Ideologies, like religion has a very bad history. The two examples you mention [Soviet Union and People's Republic of China] above are excellent proof of that. But still, they weren’t able to match Christianity.
Humans are unfortunately very easily lead and we have seen the results of that when they submit to superstition and follow religious leaders and churches. But I do not buy the Christian idea that man is sinful and bad. Humanity as such cannot be considered evil like Christianity.
Where do these evil ideologies and religions come from in the first place? "From a few evil humans" you might say, but I disagree. It takes a lot of people to institute evil policies in the first place, and a lot of people not really bothered by evil to maintain them.
The history of mankind, pre-Christian and even today (which is sometimes considered Post-Christian) is the history of people being mean to each other. There have been wars which are not caused by religions or ideologies, there has been persecution of minority groups as far back as man could first pick up a stone to whack someone else.
It goes even further back, just look at ants if you want an example of cultural intolerance and violence.
What we consider evil- violence and cruelty and, yes, clinging tightly to those who are "like us" while fearing and hating everyone else, is observed all the time in nature. Does this necessarily mean that we humans are also evil? Well, no, but one has only to look at history to see that we have extended the lesson in savage cruelty handed to us by nature. Religion, including Christianity, has been but one of tools used to do this.
You don't need a concept of original sin to explain evil- survival of the fittest works just fine. We've had a long way to grow up, and I think we're doing an ok job.
Does this mean that religion is intrinsically evil? No, just a wonderful tool for the job. Things get a bit mixed up when religion moved from pure "die bravely in battle and you'll feast with the gods" to "love your neighbor". The words didn't really fit with what people wanted to use religion for, so they ignored it.
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Why did Jesus not start his ministry till 30?
by LadyBug ini have often wondered this.
his sole purpose in coming to earth was to make disciples and the sacrifice.
he knew this.. so why did he wait till 30 yrs of age to dedicate himself to his father?
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terraly
Very interesting Francoise, and very well written.
Jesus did not reveal "Man to God" for there was nothing for Jesus to reveal to God. God already "knew them all." Nor did Jesus reveal "Man to himself" because his Father's spirit revealed everything about man to Jesus.
I disagree Kes, it's a matter of subjective versus objective knowledge. See, people know logically that the earth is a small blue-green orb hurtling around the sun, but still when they're up in space looking down on our home they really know this- the knowledge becomes experienced knowledge, which is much more powerful.
Same thing in Jesus' case- God may have known what it was like to be human on an itellectual level, even from talking with humans, but to actually be a human is a very different sort of knowledge. That's why I've always liked the idea that Jesus really was God incarnate, God actually getting subjective, first-hand knowledge of what it was like to be human.
I'd like to think that any God I worship would have experienced what it's like to be me- not just "know" it, no matter how much more fully God can know something, there's nothing like experience.
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Christianity and human rights
by PerFect ina: human rights, articel nb 1 all human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.
.... b: christianity, dogma nb 1 those who belive in jesus christ will be saved .
i cant get a and b in agreement.
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terraly
I think I agree with you Francoise.
(you too Yeru)Pardon me if I'm putting words in your mouth, but are you basically saying that Christianity is simply a means to the end (love)?
This is one of the ways I look at it. Raised in the Judeo-Christian tradition I have a hard time getting at the fundamental truths through other religious angles- but I recognize the validity of those approaches.
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What's So Special About These One's?
by Englishman inim intrigued by the jws teachings re the 144,000 and i would much appreciate some input.. i mean, is their any real scriptural back-up to say that a set number of people will go from earth to heaven, or is this just a witness interpretation thing?.
also, how does this remnant become aware that they have a calling?
does the wtbts tend not to persecute these ones, if they hold views that would be deemed as apostate in others?.
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terraly
Just thought I'd add another thought on the stock-Christian experience versus the anointed.
It seems like the best a JW can do with any sort of spiritual experience is discount it. Unless of course they want to go through the travail of being a dubious young anointed, it's much easiest just to pretend it never happens.
It leaves scars on the far side too. Ex-JW's feel there has to be something really special about being a child of God- 'cause after all, the anointed really felt something really special. Now some born agains profess a sort of extreme spiritual revelation at the moment of faith, but I've always heard God much more as a still calm voice.
No disrespect meant to Amazing, but it's always been my belief that the anointed and born-agains exaggerate the whole thing. I mean, you're supposed to be one of these holy anointed, so this special feeling you get better be pretty darn special. So special they can't explain it... seems a bit suspicious eh?
It's a matter of expectation largely. With something like this if you're expecting fire from on high you'll probably get yourself pretty worked up and you'll be convinced you felt something.
In some ways the WT is one of the ultimate "Experience" brands of Christianity. You must have a spiritual revelation of monumental proportions in order for the Bible to apply to you (in it's entirety).
Someone posted a thread here a while back that dealt with a WT article attacking the Catholic Church for some announcement in the front of some Catholic bible's saying "not to be read without a priest". Ironic isn't it? According to the Witnesses much of the Bible should be marked, "not to be read (or at least listened too) unless you're anointed".
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What's So Special About These One's?
by Englishman inim intrigued by the jws teachings re the 144,000 and i would much appreciate some input.. i mean, is their any real scriptural back-up to say that a set number of people will go from earth to heaven, or is this just a witness interpretation thing?.
also, how does this remnant become aware that they have a calling?
does the wtbts tend not to persecute these ones, if they hold views that would be deemed as apostate in others?.
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terraly
Well, it is interesting that the WT takes 144,000 as a literal number, while they treat the "Jewish", "male" and "virgin" parts of the passage as figurative.
Obviously picking some select group to identify with is a good strategy for some small group of bible students- it gives them a feeling that they are special and unique, and have a place in the whole Biblical scheme of things. This strategy backfires if this group is a limited number and the students get too large. This is where the rather ad hoc "two hopes" strategy comes from.
At least in practical terms, they use some scriptures to justify it (I'm sure others can provide better details), but it's interesting to look at the underlying motivation for why they came up with this doctrine in the first place- it influences which scriptures they use to construct it.
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Flawed Design
by bajarama ini have a question to all those who believe in a christian god, or any others who would like to comment on the subject.
if god is perfect, and can not make a error, why are there comets, asteroids and meteors flying about the solar system impacting both the earth and other planets?
it doesn't make sense to me how a perfect creator could allow this chaos to exist.
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terraly
Hey, comets are extremely cool, a truly fascinating look at the early, early solar system (and in some cases even further back). For me, a universe without comets would be sub-perfect.
On the other hand, I worry a lot about what will happen that inevitable day when we detect the big rock which is going to hit the Earth. How many wacko believers will try to stop us from doing anything to prevent "God's Judgement"?