Posts by Valis

17

Are there any scholars in the society?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

i was having quite an intense disscussion (ok, argument )with some of my family last weekend.. my brother said in answer to some points that i raised , that the society has scholars who do research and will have the answer to my questions.. i said i know of no sholars in the society, he said thats because the world does not recognise them as such.what i ment (but did not continue saying as the conversation changed direction , again) was that the people who do research and study for the society arent really scholars as they are not free to look for the real truth only to confirm what the society says.their skills are really knowledge of the societies beliefs.. well it is true that a scholar is just someone who has a great knowledge of a particular subject.so you could argue that the society does have scholars as they are people with great knowledge of the organistaions rules .but what must people would mean my scholars are people who put a great deal of time and effort into research and study of an issue as to whether it is true or false, real or make believe.. can the society have scholars in that sense?.

well a recent watchtower article stated that we could not even have private opinions on bibles matters.. in order to research whether a certain witness view point was valid or not you would have to entertain the idea that a certain viewpoint could be wrong.

but this would put you at odds with the society , as you cannot think differently even privately your own opinions on bible matters.

Valis

This is an age old phenomenon, where scholars are scholarly and the church bastardizes that work to thier own end. I think there is a fine line between what is scholarly and the unscrupulous use and abuse of symantics/biblical verse to uphold ones views. I'm sure there are many at the WT who believe themselves to be bible scholars and that's all good and fine, but even scholars can't keep thier head in the books all the time, while people are being villified and shunned all around them.

66

Are Jehovah's Witnesses evil?

by SexyTeen in

jw
friends

i am shocked at the many accusations against jehovah's witnesses in this forum.. i know that i am young, but most of my family are jws and they are good people and i love them.

even my worldly family is very nice and i do not shun them.

the friends in the hall are very nice also.

Valis

To define most JWs as evil is a bit farfetched, but that is not to say that a great many have the personal fortitude to stand up in the face of opressive/backwards thinking. What does this say for thier true moral character? Not much. In this light, the absence of moral character leaves one deficient, which in turn leads to mistreatment of those they claim to love. All in the name of being a part of the org. Evil is as evil does IMHO, such as breaking up families, shunning lifelong friends, demonizing entire groups of people they don't even know, entertaining Paradise on Earth fantasies for generations to no avail, and providing the foundation for years and years of unjustified guilt, is as evil as it gets.

62

Taliban prisoners in Cuba

by Abaddon in

jw
friends

does this trouble anyone?.

it seems semantic tom-foolery to declare a war on terrorism, and then to say that prisoners of the war are not prisoners of war.. it also seems very suspect keeping them of proper usa soil, as where they are they are out of sight, mind, or appeal by civil-rights factions.. do not get me wrong.. i am not saying, "ah, poor ickle terrorists".. but in a war against terror, surely taking each and every opportunity to distance yourself from your enemies is the wisest and best course of action?.

why do anything that is even remotely dodgy or underhand?.

Valis

Did I mention they were recieving medical attention and culturally appropriate meals? No pork chops for Taliban...

14

With friends like these.......

by Belmont in

jw
friends

we've been out three years after many many years enmeshed in the org; not df'd or da'd, just fading away for family's sake.

this is a letter we received this morning from a jw friend of 25 years' standing who has continued to invite us to her house for meals, and eat with us during the past three years.. dear****, when i first knew you had ceased coming to the meetings, my heart felt love for you both, made me visit you.

the intention was to win back my dear brother and sister.. over a period of time i have come to realize that you have ceased associating with jehovah's organization and my conscience now feels i cannot continue our association.. i am sorry to lose you as friends.

Valis

Belmont, the vice grip of JW guilt never ceases...it might be slow, but it is always there and insidious. Obviously you knew that your "friend" always had that as an option and would possibly resort to it for lots of reasons, JW pressure, personal guilt, afriad jehova was watching...etc..sorry for your loss of friends, but there are plenty where that came from...

62

Taliban prisoners in Cuba

by Abaddon in

jw
friends

does this trouble anyone?.

it seems semantic tom-foolery to declare a war on terrorism, and then to say that prisoners of the war are not prisoners of war.. it also seems very suspect keeping them of proper usa soil, as where they are they are out of sight, mind, or appeal by civil-rights factions.. do not get me wrong.. i am not saying, "ah, poor ickle terrorists".. but in a war against terror, surely taking each and every opportunity to distance yourself from your enemies is the wisest and best course of action?.

why do anything that is even remotely dodgy or underhand?.

Valis

Actually they are being treated like very dangerous criminals. Criminals who obviously have a knack for breaking out, causing prison riots, they are proficient in using all kinds of weapons, and could be under considerable danger from the rest of the public if thier identities are known. The following are some assumptions that I have formed and will probably get flammed for, but so be it.

They are under strict guard for thier own protecttion. If they were sent to the US they would all be blamed for the 9/11 tragedies, which simply isn't true. Thier presence would probably cause riotous conditions among our own poorly run/guarded detention centers. Most of them couldn't spell World Trade Center, much less have the intelligence to participate in such an evil scheme. They were however willing participants and supporters of the Taliban, which happily gave bin Laden a place to base operations. Simmilar I suppose to aiding and abetting in criminal activity.

For the protection of fellow prisoners, as many of them will be asked sensitive questions that could get the informant killed. (I.E. We don't want the cronies still afoot to know who they are and what info the will or could release. As well, they will need some anonimity when and if they are released to thier respective home countries. Otherwise if they are found to be of no intelligence use, they will probably be released, for the most part.

They are not entitled to our set of rights (I.E. Constitutional Freedoms, Liberties), but only basic human rights, like food ,water, and shelter. They never practiced in a democratic society and as a matter of fact mistreated even thier own people. Eventually you stop offering the olive branch and kindness to those who feel it necessary to violate even the most basic human rights. Who among you would like to spend a day in an Afghan women's place? You would be like ignorant chattell...vieled chattell that is.

They are not entitled to a day in our civil court, except in Johnnie Ialiban Wlaker, only becuase he is a US citizen...for a while anyway. I think he should be released back on US soil and we could see what happens. He would never be able to get a job, would probably get beaten to death, and would certainly get shunned everywhere he went. I think its a rather appropriate punishment. He might remember the Western infidels aren't the great satan that many Islamic fundamentalist org profess.

12

JX's in the Mexican Army!

by Ivor Hope in

jw
friends

one of the many things that totally amazed me when i first read ray franz's first book was the way in which jw's bribed the authorities to get their "pink slip" to say they had completed military service.

not only that, they were also listed as reservists for the mexican army.. does any one know if those jw's are still listed, and if so, shouldn't they be d?a's by their actions?

?