Xander

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Posts by Xander

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  32

  Dilemmas......What is their Purpose?

  by Siddhashunyata in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  what is the purpose of moral dilemmas?

  do they point us to god or to ourselves?

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  Xander

  I'm not sure I understand how those are 'moral dilemmas'

  Surely, they are not dilemmas of any kind?

  In the case of siamese twins where one must die for one to live, what is the dilemma? Whichever 'side' appears to be healthiest should be selected to live. I suppose the only other option would be to let them stay together, which dooms them to a short life of pain and segregation from 'normal' human society, anyway. Certainly, not a valid option.

  whether to switch off life support machines or not

  Again, how a dilemma? Firstly, if there is a chance of survival, human compassion dictates extension as long as possible. As to when there is NO chance of recovery or improvement, it comes down to what where the victims wishes.

  No dilemma....
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  32

  Dilemmas......What is their Purpose?

  by Siddhashunyata in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  what is the purpose of moral dilemmas?

  do they point us to god or to ourselves?

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  Xander

  To which do you refer?

  In general, a moral dilemma is caused by the conflict of a religious or belief system and society or government. As such, they are artificial in nature and have nothing to do with any divine being or beings, if said even exist.
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  36

  I have been challenged

  by SpiceItUp in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  my father has told me that if i can disprove the bible on any point he will discontinue beliveing in it.. i will be the first to admit that bible theology is not my strong point so i need any help that i can get.. thanks in advance

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  Xander

  Perhaps another good approach is here:

  http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/1991/1/1boobo91.html

  Which is entitled 'Scientific Boo-Boos in the Bible'. It covers a couple of them. Another one is the translation of the earth as a circle in space, when it is clearly a sphere. (Unless, of course, it was flat!) Yes, there are different words in Aramaic for circle and sphere, Isaiah called the Earth a circle. (It has been presumed that when Isaiah was referring to a 'circle', he meant the extent to which the Earth had been explored...IE., like a 'circle of friends' or 'circle of nations' does not require a LITERAL circle. However, as the JWs frequently use this verse to explain the 'scientific' validity of the bible, it's okay to attack)
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  36

  I have been challenged

  by SpiceItUp in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  my father has told me that if i can disprove the bible on any point he will discontinue beliveing in it.. i will be the first to admit that bible theology is not my strong point so i need any help that i can get.. thanks in advance

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  Xander

  The problem with using the flood is that a particularly brain-dub person will finally fall back on "Well, God made it happen, and he can perform miracles, so it doesn't HAVE to make sense or appear logical to 'human wisdom' (hack spit)"

  Although attacking the bible itself works fine if someone is already leaning towards secular thought, it is quite fruitless to attack it when arguing with a die-hard fundie or JW.

  Best bet is to attack THEIR interpretation of it, using their bible alone. (IE., the fall of Jerusalem being in 586/7 instead of 607 may also SEEM like a good place to start, but it's not. See, the whole world is 'lying in the power of the wicked one', and so all the tons of evidence pointing to Jerusalems fall in 586/7 has been faked, while whatever evidence there was pointing to the 'true' date of 607 was completely erased, such that none exists today.)

  It's a much harder fight, and takes a lot more research, but in the end their only defense against it can be "Human error" followed by "Must wait on jehovah". If your dad has already agreed to forsake such a position (he seems to have), these arguments can possibly win through.
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  36

  I have been challenged

  by SpiceItUp in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

  my father has told me that if i can disprove the bible on any point he will discontinue beliveing in it.. i will be the first to admit that bible theology is not my strong point so i need any help that i can get.. thanks in advance

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  Xander

  He said they encountered (to his son's great surprise) a statement to the effect of "...the name Jehovah really isn't in there, but we feel IT BELONGS THERE..."!!!

  They actually beat this to death in the introduction - devoting 2-1/2 pages to it. Essentially, it boils down to, "We believe the original text of the Christian Greek Scriptures has been tampered with, removing the divine name and substituting Kyrios 'Lord' and Theos 'God' in its place. Although we just KNOW it was removed, we don't know from where and from where Kyrios and Theos were actually the original words used. So, we pretty much haphazardly replaced them with YHWH to fit our doctrines. But, modern translators have made replacements in the same places before. We're not going to say who or when. But, trust us, this isn't all our idea. Really."

  EDIT: It is worth noting they also devote an entire appendix to it (Appendix 1, as it happens). But, most of the 'proof' they present there has been discredited from other sources.

  Edited by - Xander on 20 January 2003 20:48:36
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  36

  I have been challenged

  by SpiceItUp in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

  my father has told me that if i can disprove the bible on any point he will discontinue beliveing in it.. i will be the first to admit that bible theology is not my strong point so i need any help that i can get.. thanks in advance

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  Xander

  'Jehovah' just ain't there.

  I actually have my Interlinear Translation handy for just this occasion. (I only have newer literature, like 1980+, so this was the only thing I'm intentionally keeping).

  YOU MUST GET THE INTERLINEAR TRANSLATION IF YOU WANT TO ATTACK THEM.

  Else, they'll do as others said, dodge the issue, 'but but but' you, etc. If you can show them DIRECT proof of translation errors, that might open the door.

  Here are some freebies:

  Compare Rom 10:9 vs Rom 12:19 (same book!) How is Kupios translated in one place, and then the other? Same word, different meanings?

  Compare 2 Thes. 2:1 vs Luke 2:9. How is Kupiou translated in one place, and then the other? Same word, different meanings? What would happen if they were both translated the same?

  Jesus uses the phrase 'Truly I say to you...' over 50 times in the New Testament. In EVERY case, the NWT translated 'Truly I say to you, (COMMA!), blahblahblah'. See John 3:2, John 5:19, Mk 8:12, Mk 9:1, Mk 9:41, Mk 10:15, Mk 14:9, Matt 6:2, Matt 10:15, Heb 4:7, Luke 12:37, Luke 18:17, Luke 18:29, Luke 21:32, etc.

  It's important to use the Interlinear here, so he can see that the original Greek is EXACTLY THE SAME in all cases. Now, compare the original text of Luke 23:43. And compare how the WTBTS translated that ONE instance of 'Truly I say to you'. How does the placement of the comma change the meaning of the scripture? Why do you suppose they made that change?

  ----------------------

  In any case, the above attacks two of the WTBTS primary teachings, and shows how they doctored the bible to match their beliefs. If this doesn't open the door - proving the WTBTS false using their own literature that your father undoubtedly has in his own house and is still considered 'accurate' - I don't know what will.
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  18

  AOL BROADBAND

  by ScoobySnax in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  just signed on to aol broadband, but finding it a bit of a pig to work with....maybe i'm doing something wrong.

  ok you can sign on in a matter of seconds, and web pages load real quick, but since joining, morpheous doesn't seem to work, and media player is very jumpy....can anyone help me get the most out of this thing i've just agreed to pay 27.99 a month for....cheers.

  scott

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  Xander

  It'd sure be nice.

  Not sure how online gaming would work, then...
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  18

  AOL BROADBAND

  by ScoobySnax in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  just signed on to aol broadband, but finding it a bit of a pig to work with....maybe i'm doing something wrong.

  ok you can sign on in a matter of seconds, and web pages load real quick, but since joining, morpheous doesn't seem to work, and media player is very jumpy....can anyone help me get the most out of this thing i've just agreed to pay 27.99 a month for....cheers.

  scott

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  Xander

  If by 'most Microsoft operating systems' you mean Win95, then I agree.

  If you mean Win98, Win98SE, WinME, WinNT, Win2K, or WinXP, then I disagree. They are all pretty well optimized for broadband (well, LAN, actually). What they are NOT optimized for are modems, hence the tweak guides you see everywhere.

  As to AOL....oh, I wouldn't be surprised if they block the ports used by Morpheus or Kazaa or a bunch of other stuff. Don't like AOL at all. MSN, on the other hand, is another mass market-aimed ISP that actually treats their users intelligently. Granted, the DSL router they sent me did block the inbound FTP port, but, ehhh...there are ways around that . Other than that, I've found them quite acceptable for broadband. Kazaa, eDonkey, IRC, ICQ, etc all work. It's fast, it's always on, and it's reliable.

  It's also a bit more pricey. I don't recall what the introductory rate for it was, but I'm out of that now and paying something like $49.99 a month, which is kinda steep. Both the wife and I consider it worth it, and if the budget every became REALLY tight, DirecTV and the paper go first, so....it's that nice.
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  13

  Feb. 8, 2003 Awake - Is There an Unforgivable Sin?

  by Southland in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  another anti-apostacy article.

  speaks for itself.

  (updated with better scanned images) .

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  Xander

  Huh, they're doing crossword puzzles again. Fascinating.

  Oh, wait, was there something else in that article?
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  7

  sex talk

  by BATHORY in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  me and the misses come home from a hard day at work together at 9 pm and are busy cleaning up the house.

  cleanin cleanin tidy this up n that..... comes to 11:30 pm and we are sorta finishing off, havent had a shag in a week or so, not even a blowy, so i look at her and say.

  bathory : so mate, i mean just so i can know, so i can book it in and finish off this stuff, ahh, is there one in it ??.

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  Xander

  behind my tonsils

  How would that even....

  But, it doesn't....

  Surely, you can't....

  I can't quite seem to....

  I mean....

  WHAT?!?!?!