international of course:.
dave allen, irish standup (sit down drinking whisky actually).
bill cosby, love that fat albert.
Anyone see Robin Williams and Jackie Gleason together, HILARIOUS. I enjoy Paula Poundstone, I used to like Ellen Degenerous too. For you English folks MONTIE WILLIE, Benny Hill and Monty Python (though technically MP is a troupe and not just a comedian). Mr Bean is ok at times too.
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
sitting thru the watchtower study yesterday with my stepson, i noticed something i'd missed while reading the study article myself a few days ago.. without having a wt present i'll quote as best i can and hope someone can find me a direct quote.
in the third study article the society quotes deuteronomy 6:4-9 which says in part, and these words which i command you this day shall be upon your heart; and you shall teach them diligently to your children and shall talk of them when you sin in your house, and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise.
(rsv).
Urkel,
Thanks for digging up the article for me, I found it myself this morning.
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
last year on h20 much was discussed about whether jesus was a historical person.
it was brought out that no mention of jesus is ever made outside the works of christians (presuming that all christian historians are biased) except for the the writings of roman historian, flavius josephus.
and, even the brief mentioin of jesus in josephus works are challenged by some as being spurious addtions to some manuscripts.
Jan
yes, I think we have been here once or twice. Deja vue all over agian, huh?
Let's talk about this statement concerning Gaius Marius.
Now you are really comparing apples and oranges, or, rather, raisins and pumpkins. It is equivalent to saying that the absense of any extraordinary supernatural claim outside e.g. writings by Heaven's Gate (or, for that matter, early Bible Students) is equivalent to there being no sources outside the Western world (or, if you restrict it to native Romans, equivalent to Americans).
The question to ask is, "Why would anyone outside the small circle of Jews who knew him write about Jesus?" His execution wouldn't have been recorded, his preaching would only have been noticed by those interested in such things. For a rabble rouser Jesus was pretty much a nobody. Had he been a king like Herod, caused a major revolt, or been accepted along the lines of a Rabbi like Hillel or Gameliel he might have been squeezed in somewhere in the histories.
I guess then, to get back to square one, is it your contention that there was not an historical Jesus? Is it your contention that scholars view the existence of an historical Jesus with skepticism? If so, who are these scholars as I've never read any of them.
You acknowledge the Pauline letters as acceptable, wouldn't that argue in favor of an historical Jesus? Paul is closest to the source of the stories we have on Jesus if we reject the rest of the NT works. If Paul wrote when we think he did he would have been alive during the time of Jesus. If Jesus was a complete myth, to what was it that Paul was converted, wouldn't he have known that Jesus was a myth?
Finally, if your contention is that we can't know much about the historical Jesus, I won't argue the point with you, the NT is written through the eyes of faith not scholarship. If you out of hand reject that Jesus was an historical person altogether, I ask, on what basis?
What do you know about "acceptable norms of historical scholarship"? As we have seen above, very little.
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
ok so pardon me for the take off on richard scarry--he really is one of my favorite all time children's authors.. but i had to share this field service story with you--it's the gospel truth!
hopefully, you can add some of yours.. while pioneering in upstate ny, my sister and i had frequent occasions to work in service with a married pioneer couple.
yes, they were window washers, but that's not the real story here.. they had a return visit on an elderly gentleman who was kind enough to take the magazines every once in a while.
Even I as a Catholic went door to door. That Catholics do this on occasion is a VERY WELL kept secret. We don't have to report hours or placement, and there is no "school" to teach us how to do it. My lack of training was QUITE obvious when I was handing out flyers for an evangelical team that was coming thru town. As I was "placing" bills one gentleman said to me, drink in hand, "God doesn't want an old sot like me". My silly response was "Hope you come"
WOW, given this opportunity now I could have perhaps really ministered to this guy. I was only 14 years old then. At age 14 I had no life experience to offer this guy. The appropriate quick response might have been "You're exactly the kind of person God wants", probably would have fallen on deaf ears as it came from a 14 yr old, but I still wish I would have said it.
Funny story, no, but then again, I've only went door to door a few times. I believe "Witnessing is as much about LIFESTYLE as it is kncoking on doors. I would like to compare notes with DUB about the number of times someone has actually let them explain the gospel and responded to it either by going door to door or just in life in general. I honestly can't count the number of times I've been given an opportunity to present the Gospel, and more than a handful have made a commitment to Christ by this (Thanks and praise be to God).
Just eating up time waiting to move now. God Bless.
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
just as a loving father or mother disciplines their child for wrongdoing, god also disciplines us when we get out of hand.. he has that right, godrules!.
do you accept god's discipline?
WHile I gratefully accept God's discipline, that of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society (of any state) is not God's ARM OF DISCIPLINE. The Society's unbiblical DF and shunning policy is sad.
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
i only use this expression when something big is forth coming.
within the next four days another major news story will hit the papers regarding the pedophile issue and jw's.
as soon as i have the go ahead we will release the details here, so stay tuned and you can hear it first here.
SILENT,
Is this also related to the "Releasing Names" Post?
Enquiring minds want to know.
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
sitting thru the watchtower study yesterday with my stepson, i noticed something i'd missed while reading the study article myself a few days ago.. without having a wt present i'll quote as best i can and hope someone can find me a direct quote.
in the third study article the society quotes deuteronomy 6:4-9 which says in part, and these words which i command you this day shall be upon your heart; and you shall teach them diligently to your children and shall talk of them when you sin in your house, and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise.
(rsv).
Sitting thru the Watchtower study yesterday with my stepson, I noticed something I'd missed while reading the study article myself a few days ago.
Without having a WT present I'll quote as best I can and hope someone can find me a direct quote. In the third study article the Society quotes Deuteronomy 6:4-9 which says in part,
and these words which I command you this day shall be upon your heart; and you shall teach them diligently to your children and shall talk of them when you sin in your house, and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise. (RSV)
, later in the article the Society says something to the nature of "talk about the watchtower and teach them to your children, etc again quoting from Deut 6 put replacing it with Watchtower instead of the commandments. The obvious parallel being drawn is that the Watchtower is equal in authority to the Commandments of God.
Just thought I'd comment on it.
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
last year on h20 much was discussed about whether jesus was a historical person.
it was brought out that no mention of jesus is ever made outside the works of christians (presuming that all christian historians are biased) except for the the writings of roman historian, flavius josephus.
and, even the brief mentioin of jesus in josephus works are challenged by some as being spurious addtions to some manuscripts.
Jan,
Ya need to explain to me why the writings of Christians as to whether or not Jesus is an historical person must be suspect. There are no sources outside of the Romans themselves that refer to Gaius, Marius, yet no one doubts he was an historical person who reformed the Roman Legion.
WHy aren't the works of Philo and Tacitus mentioned?
The Talmudic references to Jesus, while not actually written down for some 300 years or so after the events, can not be dismissed as responses to Christian Myth, but, because of HOW the Talmud was developed, should be seen as Judaic counters to Christian evangelization when the seperation between Judaism and Chrisitanity was not as large.
Again, I've not read one serious historian that questions whether Jesus was a real person. The Gospels are of some historical value. For example, the bible was our only source of reference for the existence of Pontius Pilate until very recently.
Do you find it easier to dismiss Jesus as having never existed than to deal with an historical Jesus and trying to then determine who he was? Using acceptable norms of historical scholarship, there is no doubt that Jesus was a real person. The question remains, how much of that person do we really see in the bible?
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
new to the board - just saying hello - looking forward to participating!
finally free after 25 years.
Individual,
Welcome to the board, welcome to freedom from the BORG. What's your story dude?
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
we were taught in the wtbts as the bible clearly states that god created the heavens and the earth and on the seventh day he rested.. has it occurred to anyone else that god got up to a lot of wars ect whilst he was supposedly sleeping?????.
not only the wars but the actual writing of the bible which was pounded into us as being inspired by god.. if only i could do as much in my sleep.. ana....
To re-emphasize what I think SJ was talking about, and to give you the perspective of the Rabbinical tradition (hey, it's thier book, I trust their interp thereof); God rested from CREATING. The Rabbis recognize that God sustains the whole of creation by and active and conscouse force of His will ( ok, I misspelled a word or two SUE ME). God's PROVIDENCE (which we are speaking of now) ALWAYS remains active, if it didn't all things would cease to exist. So, while God rested from the work of CREATING, God still "works" and maintains all things, oversees all things, and sustains all things. Part of this goes into the reason the Rabbis explained that the Priests could sacrafice even on the sabbath.
Hope that gives you a better perspective on the term rest.
As an interesting side note, the Hebrew Shabbat is somewhere between Rest and Seven as far as it's meaning.
Shalom
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
