That megiddo said it.When i went some meetings and was reading the WT etc etc back in the early 90's.There was this certain postive vibe from the people at KH...that evrything was growing. They had just built a new congregation because the other one was too small and the good news was being preached world wide etc.The WT mag itself was different too...I haven't noticed much stuff about Babylon the great and 'the sign' in 'em recently like there was 10 years ago.Someone put that down to Franz dieing, i think.I read 2 WT mags a few months ago...and i swear, they were the exact same article only re-worded slightly and re-titled.I remember in '88 they put out 2 WT mags in succession dealing with 'the sign' but they were different inside.Now, the WT mag just seems to be going through the motions...they need someone to write some real whacky stuff again, dealing with prophecy and all, just to entertain people a little.
Posts by Zep
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25Another interesting online personality - Nicodemus
by Pathofthorns inthis is another personality online that facinates me.
sort of reminds me of friend.
this was an interesting comment he made over at witnet regarding our all facing an individual accounting before god.. this is a subject which once bothered me as well.
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God and religion etc..............................
by Zep inthe communist world, it may be noted, has one big myth (which we call an illusion, in the vain hope that our superior judgment will make it disappear) it is the time hallowed archetypal dream of a golden age (or paradise), where everything is provided in abundance for everyone, and a great, just, and wise chief rules over a human kindergarten.
this powerful archetype in its infantile form has gripped them, but it will never disappear from the world at the mere sight of our superior points of view.
we even support it by our own childishness, for our western civilisation is in the grip of the same mythology.
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Zep
That about sums it up Waiting, really!!!!!!!!!!
He also said:
If only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name at a Swiss bank.
To *you* I'm an atheist; to God, I'm the Loyal Opposition.
I don't want to achieve immortality through my work. I want to achieve it through not dying. - Woody Allen
Why are our days numbered and not, say, lettered.
No matter how cynical you are, you can't keep up.
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25
Another interesting online personality - Nicodemus
by Pathofthorns inthis is another personality online that facinates me.
sort of reminds me of friend.
this was an interesting comment he made over at witnet regarding our all facing an individual accounting before god.. this is a subject which once bothered me as well.
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Zep
I usually head straight to the controversial topics folder!.That place is OK......
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25
Another interesting online personality - Nicodemus
by Pathofthorns inthis is another personality online that facinates me.
sort of reminds me of friend.
this was an interesting comment he made over at witnet regarding our all facing an individual accounting before god.. this is a subject which once bothered me as well.
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Zep
Whats with Witnet anyway Path.I mean, i very rarely ever went over there.....because i doubt i'd ever get on!.But its interesting and funny to read, since there seems to be a lot of lurking 'apostates' over there to me just trying to stir the pot.I think the place is more a positive for the 'apostate' movement... than the wtbts actually.But its also funny to read some of the hardliners over there....I remember Friend getting Chastised by some nut called Bobcarl on the blood issue, it was quite funny.
Does anyone here post over there?.I don't know, i'd like to get on over there...go over and stir the pot a little.Unfortunately they seem to have rather tight security measures owing to something that happened last year...what ever that was?????? I'm assuming a load of apostates got on and wreaked havoc and turned it into h20 or something? -
36
God and religion etc..............................
by Zep inthe communist world, it may be noted, has one big myth (which we call an illusion, in the vain hope that our superior judgment will make it disappear) it is the time hallowed archetypal dream of a golden age (or paradise), where everything is provided in abundance for everyone, and a great, just, and wise chief rules over a human kindergarten.
this powerful archetype in its infantile form has gripped them, but it will never disappear from the world at the mere sight of our superior points of view.
we even support it by our own childishness, for our western civilisation is in the grip of the same mythology.
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Zep
circare,
However, obviously the desire to have or see something a particular way does not mean that it is that way
Thats right, but it doesn't mean it isn't that way either.I cant prove God...but equally, i cant disprove God or a greater reality...or life after death.So, therefore, i am entirely free to choose....I can say :"Well, i cant see god, he must me a load of bollocks" or i can trust my instincts or desires, you know, just that feeling that there is a greater being.Thats all the basis of my belief is. My belief is no way rock solid BTW, i'm all too well aware that it all may be an illusion, but i've tried the athiest way of viewing things...and i got nothing out of it other than a real negative feeling.
I'm not sure at this stage how to believe just because I would like it to be.
Well, making something a habit is pretty much the only way. I think if you reflect on how you became a dub, you'll see that it was just the repitition of reading the WT, of going to meetings that strengthened you belief...it became rock solid out of habit. All that constant reinforcement served to build your faith, it was however, an illusion.I think the best way to cultivate a belief in God, is to create a habit....Prayer, i think, is a good habit to start.Probably the best habit!...better than reading some 2000 year old book i reckon..
I prefer to see them as evidence of a higher intelligence as compared to concepts like evolution.
If you prefer it, then why not see things that way!.I tell you, Atheism aint no great kick, i didn't get anything out of that belief when i tried it.Actually, i'm kinda an Agnostic now who's just decided he may as believe in something as opposed to nothing!.I dont know exactly what that something is....its a vague concept, but i like it that way, it gives me room to move, to change my opinions without shaking the fundamental foundations of that belief!
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78
Modern-day Israel's Identity
by Onetruesource ini would like to open this discussion on israel, because i have come to learn many things about it.
the bible scriptures continue to prophecy about the nation of israel.
we all know that the natural nation has been disowned by jehovah, because unfaithfulness.
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Zep
Thats not the point all TFS.You can go to Osarsif etc and there you have articles that deal with the subjects of the books you mentioned, like COC >R...some written by those very authors...also there are extracts from their very books(have the report guys matched that yet!).You can then decide on that basis, after reading their online stuff as to whether you wan to pursue a study further.These report Guys however, seem to be very koy about disclosing information....you have to buy the book first.Maybe thats an indication of the quality of their book, the fact that they seem to be quiet secretive about whats in it seems to indicate that its just rubbish.
I brought GTR on the basis of the information over at osarsif, i didn't need to, since enough information had already been provided online by the author...but i wanted to pursue it further.
Until these report guys can do the same and start opening up a little and give me a reason to buy their book... they are nothing but a sham in my mind. -
36
God and religion etc..............................
by Zep inthe communist world, it may be noted, has one big myth (which we call an illusion, in the vain hope that our superior judgment will make it disappear) it is the time hallowed archetypal dream of a golden age (or paradise), where everything is provided in abundance for everyone, and a great, just, and wise chief rules over a human kindergarten.
this powerful archetype in its infantile form has gripped them, but it will never disappear from the world at the mere sight of our superior points of view.
we even support it by our own childishness, for our western civilisation is in the grip of the same mythology.
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Zep
Like Path I find that there are too many things that are interrelated and marvelously balanced for all of this to be by mere chance for one thing
An atheist would argue all day with you on this point Frenchy.But you sum up my feeling on things and probably the reason why i decide to believe in god (in essence).Its just a feeling, an instinct that moves me to awe when i observe the world around, its just unbelievable and amazing...This 'awe' that i sense translates into God, into some vague purpose and meaning behind life.
Edited by - Zep on 6 September 2000 23:1:0
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36
God and religion etc..............................
by Zep inthe communist world, it may be noted, has one big myth (which we call an illusion, in the vain hope that our superior judgment will make it disappear) it is the time hallowed archetypal dream of a golden age (or paradise), where everything is provided in abundance for everyone, and a great, just, and wise chief rules over a human kindergarten.
this powerful archetype in its infantile form has gripped them, but it will never disappear from the world at the mere sight of our superior points of view.
we even support it by our own childishness, for our western civilisation is in the grip of the same mythology.
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Zep
If I'm reading this correctly, Jung is saying that the belief is more important than the truth of the belief. Man is getting benefit, inner calm & solace from the belief.
Jung is about balance.He subjected many things to rational inquiry and hes not saying you shouldn't think for yourself or question things to find answers.That was in fact what Jung was all about, thinking for yourself, finding your own INDIVIDUAL PATH in life....of which he called the 'process of individuation'.I probably should have put the first half of the article up, it probably explains a little more .It moreorless said that Communism and Capitalism fail to see their own short-coming of which they all too easily see in the opposing side.You could say the same about religion and people in general.With JW's, its the rest of the world thats evil and they(dubs) are the only way, the only good in an evil world.They project all their shortcomings and insecurities onto others but fail to see it in themselves, that they are no better.This is the problem with the whole world essentially and gives rise to wars and everything else.Jung was 100% against totalitarianism as any normal person should be.
You can have a belief in God and faith in a religion and not be dogmatic at the same time.I personnally put the idea of "god" in a separate catagory....into the realm of 'faith'.I have a very hazy definition of God now and i don't look to the bible as the one true source, but more so to my own mind and instincts.I put God outside the realm of rational inquiry, i dont need to prove his existence rationally to believe, i just let it go, let my instincts and desires go on the matter....I'm not going to deprive this world and life in general of a greater hope, whatever that maybe (it may well be an illusion but thats something i cant prove or disprove).My instincts tell me that a belief in God is better for me than an Atheist view of things.My belief in God is not a Dogmatic one...i'm not seeking to impose my views and morals on others because of that VAgUE belief i have, unlike other religions.I dont believe in a God of Hellfire and brimstone who makes you go out door knockin', giving out magazines...and is going to burn everyone at Armageddon! But i believe in something! -
35
Most disgusting thing from Watchtower Corp.
by spectromize inone thing that really doesn't add up with the organization and their registrating to be a corp.(yes i have to put this in quote sorry it's called non-profit corp.) is the very fact that they play in the worldly system of things while they tell you to keep out of it.
(while they see nothing wrong in themselves playing the stock market with other peoples money) think about it where did jesus say to register god's organization as a corporation?.
furthermore if you were living in jesus' period of time who would be the president-vice-president-secratary- treasurer-shareholders...?.
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Zep
circare,
I was wondering what other organisations you have belonged to?
Would there be some that would not fit the Orwellian Nightmare?
A football club maybe!, i've never really belonged to an Organisation as such, outside of work.Would there be Some that would not fit the Orwellian nightmare??? hmmmm....sure!.
Totalitarianism, Dogmatism and hypocracy pervades all levels of Society, even so called Democracy....Witnesses dont have a monopoly on it at all. -
36
God and religion etc..............................
by Zep inthe communist world, it may be noted, has one big myth (which we call an illusion, in the vain hope that our superior judgment will make it disappear) it is the time hallowed archetypal dream of a golden age (or paradise), where everything is provided in abundance for everyone, and a great, just, and wise chief rules over a human kindergarten.
this powerful archetype in its infantile form has gripped them, but it will never disappear from the world at the mere sight of our superior points of view.
we even support it by our own childishness, for our western civilisation is in the grip of the same mythology.
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Zep
Why, then , should we deprive ourselves of views that would prove helpful in crises and would give a meaning to our existence?
Well, myself, i have a lot of doubt now. But i cant disprove God or a greater being or anything.I'm not going to use my doubt as a basis to dis-believe.Why should i make that jump, what good would it do me.I think you can cultivate a belief or faith in a greater being or reality on nothing more than the desire to believe.
I don't see why i should put a cap on that need, feeling or instinct for something greater just because my rational mind cant put God under a microscope...because i cant understand everything under the sun.Thats how i see things.I think the instinct or desire to believe is more than enough of a basis to believe.Jung is fascinating but also complex and inexplicable at times.You can read his stuff and not understand any of it first time round and then read it again and 'bam', you can suddenly see what he's saying.They say you have to live Jungs ideas to really understand them...they arn't something you can just put into formula and there you have it!.He's about going beyond the rational mind and trying to understand the emotional, irrational, unconscious side of our Nature.He's was a great thinker.