Posts by Bonsai

160

"The organisation is imperfect, but it doesn't affect my relationship with Jehovah"

by Alive! in

i've noted active, devoted jw's state the above.. and, it's not a problem for me to remain trusting of god, i just don't trust religions or men.. recently, a member of this forum stated that he remains an active jw, in the family of god's people, wanting to encourage and do good - whilst recognising that the pastoral leaders (the gb) have shipwrecked the faith of many, being unsound scripturally etc, etc.. stop and think about this - the bible says to not follow after those who lie and hurt the faith of "little ones".. the pharisees were accused of traversing over lands and expending much energy to make a single convert - only for that convert to end up worse of than he started off with.. it's one thing to not believe this is the 'truth' and feeling the awful pressure of managing ones life, trying not to lose ones family.. it's quite another thing to declare oneself to be a christian believer of god's jw household, and somehow believe the god of love would use corrupt liars to parade as jesus' brothers in the urgency of last days.

really?

and, to then visibly promote faith in corrupt men, and try to bring converts into a place where the rulership is wrong.. some of us are dying from hurt here.......give me a break..

Bonsai

An imperfect, family destroying, fact hiding, dual standard, money grabbing, fault finding organization is very much problematic when trying to worship god with "spirit and truth".

160

"The organisation is imperfect, but it doesn't affect my relationship with Jehovah"

by Alive! in

i've noted active, devoted jw's state the above.. and, it's not a problem for me to remain trusting of god, i just don't trust religions or men.. recently, a member of this forum stated that he remains an active jw, in the family of god's people, wanting to encourage and do good - whilst recognising that the pastoral leaders (the gb) have shipwrecked the faith of many, being unsound scripturally etc, etc.. stop and think about this - the bible says to not follow after those who lie and hurt the faith of "little ones".. the pharisees were accused of traversing over lands and expending much energy to make a single convert - only for that convert to end up worse of than he started off with.. it's one thing to not believe this is the 'truth' and feeling the awful pressure of managing ones life, trying not to lose ones family.. it's quite another thing to declare oneself to be a christian believer of god's jw household, and somehow believe the god of love would use corrupt liars to parade as jesus' brothers in the urgency of last days.

really?

and, to then visibly promote faith in corrupt men, and try to bring converts into a place where the rulership is wrong.. some of us are dying from hurt here.......give me a break..

Bonsai

My whole life I was told/taught that Jah's org. was clean and as a whole pure in worship. I was taught that using the divine name was the determiner between true and false worship of god. I was taught that god was a just and loving father. I was taught that the GB were directed by god's PERFECT holy spirit unlike the other religious organizations. I believed it all thoroughly and completely.

It was during my preaching to worldly people that they made me aware of:

1. encouragement of buying war bonds during WW1

2. The name "Jehovah" is a man-made concoction that was created by the very same kind of people who out of superstition removed it in the first place. Adonai is a superstitious title. Adding it to YHVH doesn't make it holy.

3. a Jew bashing letter sent to Hitler from Rutherford in 1933 which was filled with anti-semitism while yet commending the Nazi party for its high moral ideals. No doubt this letter further enflamed Nazi hatred toward the "big business" Jews leading up to the holocaust.

4. revisionist history (i.e. what JW's really taught 100 years ago about 1914 as opposed to what they say about it now)

5.False claims: 1874, 1914, 1915, 1920, 1925, 1943, 1975, "before the end of the 20th century" etc.

6. Invoking the creator in their false claims= false prophecy. look at the masthead of Awake! pre-1995 where it says, "this magazine builds the readers confidence in the creator's promise that before the generation of 1914 passes away this system will conclude." The creator promised no such thing.

7. Sleeping with the beast. They were secretly NGO's for over a decade "associating" with the United Nations.

8. Cruel and unusual punishment. The reinstatement process for a person who is repentant is NOT SCRIPTURAL.

9. Shunning for any other reason than being an anti-Christ (1 John 2:11) is NOT SCRIPTURAL and has destroyed countless families and caused countless suicides.

10. Terribly stupid policies that ended up protecting child molestors rather than the victims.

31

They're Making it Impossible to Fade

by DarioKehl in

for those of you who have already faded due to family still being in, have you noticed how the noose is tightening?.

if it's not memorial, it's special day assembly.

if it's not that, it's convention or the special talk.

Bonsai

The key to a good, successful fade is to be passively aggressive. Be adamant and upfront about not wanting to affect others faith and let them know for that reason you chose not to talk about religion at all. Also, make it clear you are mentally distressed and depressed and any conversation around religion causes you great pain and harm. They will get it after a while. I have literally trained the JWs around me to not get into religion with me. They know they can have friendly conversations about sports, the weather, even gossip about somebody still in etc, but when it comes to spiritual things - I run for the hills.

31

They're Making it Impossible to Fade

by DarioKehl in

for those of you who have already faded due to family still being in, have you noticed how the noose is tightening?.

if it's not memorial, it's special day assembly.

if it's not that, it's convention or the special talk.

Bonsai

A conversation with elders or cong members never has to advance beyond initial greetings. If they try to get into something I just jump in and say, " Sorry but any conversation revolving around god or religion just sets me off into a deep depression that threatens my mental and physical health. If I want to talk about some thing I'll call you. Have a nice day and goodbye."

If they come around asking to sign a new copy of the blood card, I will tell them the old one( which actually is in a garbage dump somewhere) works just fine. Bye.

72

Specific Comments By R&F About May Broadcast

by freemindfade in

i know there are many posts discussing the may money requesting televangalism...er... broadcast i mean!

but i wanted to start one where anyone can put what they have heard any non-exjw, non-apostate witnesses say good or bad about the broadcast.

i don't see how it can't rattle followers... but then again i might be surprised how they can twist things (2+2=5).

Bonsai

My mother-in-law said she had no interested in watching the broadcast even though it would be broadcasted for the first time in her language. When I explained the contents she seemed disinterested in how the arrangements or mistakes of the GB affect her relationship with Jehovah.

My very much still in friend said it's "cause for concern, but not cause for alarm.", He says he generally has no interest in donating to begin with, so any new donation arrangement would have no effect on him. He said he is however very disturbed that the org. is heading toward televangelism and becoming a mainstream fast food Christian corporation.

A relative who is an elder expressed the opinion that a lot of these problems are likely due to the fact that the society did not plan or expect this system to continue on as long as it has. Now they are trying to compensate through slapstick measures.

23

Another reason god is a terrible "father"

by _Morpheus in

its easy to look around and say if a singular all powerful were real he would stop the suffering of man and animal, a position i support.

however there is another even more basic premise i have pondered at times as well (im sure im not the first of course) : would any loving parent ever hide from their children?

consider it... our all knowing all loving father hides from us even though we cry out to know him.

Bonsai

Wow. great topic. I've never understood how an invisible, uncommunicative being could somehow deserve the intimate title of "father". Harkening back to my childhood when we studied the Revelation Climax book, I always thought of God as more like the grim reaper. He stands ever ready to allow his angels to release the four bowls of his wrath upon his own children whom he has left to their own devices for thousands of years. That book gave me shudders both then and now.

78

Am I the only "witness here besides the admins?

by TheOnlyRealWittnessHere in

jw
friends

with all the negativity here i was wondering if i am the only one here that's a witness.

.

the topic pretty much says everything..

Bonsai

I've been inactive for months and probably will be inactive for the rest of my life. This new brand of JW just sickens me. That being said, I still feel like I'm a witness. My friends, my family are all witnesses and being a witness is all I have ever known up until now. I'm waiting and watching world events while sitting on the fence I guess.

22

"Jehovah clearly answered my prayer!"

by stuckinarut2 in

so the fade is progressing well.... however, it has been noticed by the 'hounders', who i know will be "following up" with us soon i'm sure.. so i have thought of a way of shutting down the questions etc.... if they ask about things like meeting attendance and field activity, i am going to say something like:.

"oh, thanks for your interest and concern brothers.

this means a lot.

Bonsai

I just tell them now that the earthquake in Nepal is just one more reason on top of a stack of reasons why I no longer believe God is loving or even exists. Everyday I creep closer and closer to becoming an atheist...

22

"Jehovah clearly answered my prayer!"

by stuckinarut2 in

so the fade is progressing well.... however, it has been noticed by the 'hounders', who i know will be "following up" with us soon i'm sure.. so i have thought of a way of shutting down the questions etc.... if they ask about things like meeting attendance and field activity, i am going to say something like:.

"oh, thanks for your interest and concern brothers.

this means a lot.

Bonsai

I know the feeling Stuckinarut2. I went ballistic on the last elder who called me. I wish I hadn't, but what is done is done. It's only a matter of time before they get their isht together and come after me. If it weren't for my mother still being in I'd cut ties with everything. As of now, all I can do is avoid them like the plague and plaster a fake smile on my face when someone comes for a visit while out in service.

114

Why do religious people make claims and then refuse to back them up?

by Viviane in

several times over the past few months i have had conversations, both here and in real life, with religious people making all sorts of interesting and conflicting claims.

i like to know how things work, so generally i will ask questions to net out what i am being told and see if it can be explained and make sense.. for instance, if someone said 2+2=4 and i asked how, there are a variety of ways that could be shown to me, a number line, physical objects being put together, counting on fingers and toes, etc.

indeed, in my personal life, i often have to explain how certain technologies work, sometimes planned, sometimes off the cuff, from a variety of group sizes to a varying degree of technical expertise.

Bonsai

There will always be a place for religion as long as evil continues. Religion is for those who hate the idea of a finite life span. Religion is for those who need an answer (regardless of it being provable or not) as to why evil and suffering exists. Religion provides hope just as a good movie or book can provide hope and inspiration. Yet, more than a book or movie, religion provides that hope for as long as the person embracing it lives. Religion is a friend for many from the cradle to the grave.

Knowing that many people need the "mental drug" we call "faith", religious leaders know they don't have to provide proof behind their claims. The claim is the drug that is sufficient for the average theist.

The Buddhists claim that "shiranu ga hotoke" God (or Buddha) is the unknown around us. This phrase "shiranu ga hotoke" is also used to express that "ignorance is bliss". I feel that that sums religion up perfectly. Yuck.