Posts by Buster

25

TO ALL BODIES OF ELDERS IN AUSTRALIA

by izobcenec in

jw
friends

watchtower

bible and tract society of australia.

box 280, ingleburn, nsw 1890 australia.

Buster

I still get a jolt out their reasoning: If the state requires reporting, they report. Though I have never seen a WT publication say so, if the state doesn't require reporting, they don't.

So, it is a Chistian act to report in a state that requires it:

regardless of whether there are two witnesses,
regardless of whether the accused denies the charge,
regardless of the existance of corroberating evidence

Yet it is also a Christian act to not report if the state doesn't not require it:

even though you may have more than one witness
even though the accused may admit the charge
even though you may have further evidence

It just depends on whether the state requires it?

Thats a tough one to swallow.

11

The Psychosis of an Organization

by metatron in

jw
friends

recently, some naive (loyal witness) friends of ours did a. tour of bethel.

they were told about the society's movement.

of printing and binding functions to other places, including.

Buster

So for how man years did they tell people that planning ahead was a sign of a lack of faith? I remember the talks - "Are youy planning your business five years into the future? Have you no faith?"

I would like to know how far ahead they had to plan for this move. I imagine it is like most others. It entailed, facility sizing, search, purchase and sale agreements, build out, a move plan that does not interupt current activities, plan for the existing property, ... tons of stuff. That process takes years for an industrial entity - even if God does edit their publications.

So, back at cha FDS, "Have you no faith?"

10

Is the basis for the "true religion" ...

by Gig in

jw
friends

i am not and have never been a jw.

however, i have spent the last two years meeting with them and studying with them.

not to worry, from practically my first day of research (independent thinking) i discovered what i am convinced is a very clear example of false religion.

Buster

You are quite right. They have to hold to some base of interpretation in order to claim authority. And claim it they do. According to their fantasies, Christ returned and took a look around, for a few years, then decided on one organization. But that was after Russell - even though shortly after.

Who was bragging about the Studies in the Scriptures series? It couldn't have been a recent publication. I can only guess that you were studing with an old-timer. Correct me if I'm wrong. I find the 'Studies in the Scriptures' particularly interesting since I just ordered the whole set - from 1911. I can't wait to read how he backs asserts the Great Pyramid and the rest of the clap-trap, in his own words, on his own paper, and in full context.

I think you would be hard-pressed to find a belief, or prediction that the JWs stand behind today. That isn't to say that they don't follow the same approach, mainly that the bible is an encoded message for the few enlighted to figure out and pass along to the rest of us poor slobs.

10

Is the basis for the "true religion" ...

by Gig in

jw
friends

i am not and have never been a jw.

however, i have spent the last two years meeting with them and studying with them.

not to worry, from practically my first day of research (independent thinking) i discovered what i am convinced is a very clear example of false religion.

Buster

Welcome Gig.

You are hitting on one of the key issues: It isn't what they taught. The issue is that the Governing Body (the self-styled Faithful and and Discreet Slave) sets itself up as prophet/mediator/god for its followers. An earlier thread or two from the last few days dealt with this exact point.

If the GB (I can never use the 'FDS' without thinking of the hygiene product) tells people that the difference is 'new light', they accept it, hook, line, and sinker. By now they are so used to it, that even those that have been around for a while will profess to believe the the WTS never proclaimed 1975 as the end of the world.

Its one thing for JWs to think that the 'light' from the GB has grown brighter, and that understanding is so great now. It is another thing for Witnesses to ignore that their founders believed in things that would make a Jamaican Television Psychic blush. My wife's and my favorite is the Great Pyramid - closely followed by the construction of a home to welcome the resurrected Princes of the earth -Beth Sarim.

If the JWs want to claim to have been on a road with ever-increasing quality of light, then their founders should have had some light back then. Fact is, I don't think there is one belief of Russell's that the WTS would stand behind today - not one. Their Founder had no light.

But these facts are irrelevant to those that accept the WTS edicts as though they are direct statements from God.

6

hye look who i found

by lurk in

well i never the net is a big place but look who i found .its whats left of the international bible students.. this is the library addy but you can get to the home page from here and read why they split from wts all that time ago.

http://www.nsbible.org/library.htm.

they still got their prophecys wrong though :p, i cant believe after all this time they are still preaching the pyramid at giza!!!

Buster

Full set - the first six volumes are in the mail. They are the ones that were published while that certifiable nut was still alive. The seventh volume (stuff collected and published after his death - and rejected by the IBSA) will be on the way as soon as Randy can round it up for me - he hopes to have it within two to three weeks. It is called a 'Winged Globe' set for the embossing on the cover.

I'm gonna get some more, probably Rutherford writings in the next few months. But the Russell stuff is the prize. Now Randy doesn't give these away, and if you want a set, be prepared to part with some rupees.

At the risk of wounding like an ad, visit at: http://www.freeminds.org

It has an area called 'Watchtower Store'

Randy Waters in an ex-Bethelite. Read his story.

- Buster

14

Its got me beat !

by redorc in

jw
friends

redorc from australia here.

i was raised as a jw but from about 8 years of age i left at the age of 18 having never actualy believed anything about what i was being taught , that was about 28 years ago.

my mother is still one of them so i guess its never completley left my thoughts.

Buster

I don't think that belief in all that stuff is directly related to intelligence. Though it helps to be able to articulate one's disagreement, it is not a prerequisite. I feel that the there is a spot in the human psyche that tends to make us look outward for higher meaning and direction. Bust because we look for it, doesn't mean its there. At work, about 15 years ago, I remember this Baptist holy roller that felt that the pursuit of so many humans for a higher authority confirmed that it must be there. My other co-worker replied that 'that is the same as saying that 100 Trillion flies can't be wrong, so lets all eat sh*t.'

I get a sense of awe and reverence when I walk into a famous Catholic cathedral. The music can really cause a reaction in the chest. But does that mean to me that God is there? No. But for some people it means exactly that. I think it is mostly derived from people's desire to believe - a need to lean on something. Sometimes I think it is emotional weakness - though I am sure that is too simplistic.

6

hye look who i found

by lurk in

well i never the net is a big place but look who i found .its whats left of the international bible students.. this is the library addy but you can get to the home page from here and read why they split from wts all that time ago.

http://www.nsbible.org/library.htm.

they still got their prophecys wrong though :p, i cant believe after all this time they are still preaching the pyramid at giza!!!

Buster

I was just looking around for these people yesterday! I was ordering some books from Randy Waters, and he mentioned that the Bible Students still use that pile of superstition as a basis for their religious beliefs. So I decided to poke around. I found a few spots, and they have a couple things in common: 1) They still use the Studies in the Scriptures, and 2) adamantly assert that Russell did not found the JWs - it was Rutherford.

By the way, I ordered a collectable set of the Studies from Randy. It's one thing to read book after book that contain quotes from these books. But I can't wait to read the logic behind God's residence in Pleaides (sp?), in his own words, in their full context, on his own paper.

Yup, can't wait to read the logic on the Great Pyramid. I have a hunch there won't be anything in there about the Miracle Wheat.

80

SHE LEFT ME!

by Yerusalyim in

jw
friends

my wife, liza, came home from work this morning (she was doing the 3rd shift thing) and said she was leaving me.

this afternoon at 1 pm i took her to the bus station.

at 4:20 pm she was off to nyc.

Buster

I remember the day like I was being told Kennedy was shot. We had recently adopted a child, but she wan't happy - she told me this whole parent thing just wasn't for her. It was an amicableseparation and divorce, free from any sizeable disagreements. I'll not forget her utter irresponsibility. Even though I had some notice, it was a huge adjustment. But truth is, it was the best thing that ever happened to me. We never should have gotten married. I was happier and all of a sudden, I had more money than I expected.

The stepson situation seems like a bit of a complication. Good luck.

33

Congregation get-togethers

by freedom96 in

jw
friends

did your hall ever organize times for the congregation to do activities?.

about every 6-9 months, mine would have a congregation picnic.

people would bring food, and we would play a softball game.

Buster

This was the part of being a dubbie that I actually liked. Our congregation in Franklin, MA had a whole passle of of kids within a three-year age range: 15 to 20 kids, depending on how and when you counted. My house had a big, wide driveway for b-ball, a big field next to it and a 20'x40' pool. The deck on the back of the house was where we would break out the stereo and wind down.

The congregation didn't necessarily have an official, organized outing. Sometimes they did. But we had a crew together, often with kids from other halls too, as often as we wanted. Tons of friends, and a lot of good times.

That was the good part.

23

597 bce or 607 bce !

by Dizzy Cat in

jw
friends

.

not my usual post - but can any of you reference any material for me that highlights 597 bce a relevant date, rather than 607 bce.. an old friend phoned this morning (who is a jw still) and wanted to know about alternate chronology, aside from what the wts teach.. any info' appreciated !.

cheers

Buster

I'm curious as to why no one has yet referenced "The Gentile TImes Reconsidered" by Carl Olaf Jonsson. It is a pretty fast read, unless you find yourself trying to follow the discussion of the ancient tablets.

It is a discussion of the timelines, set in Jonsson's battles with the anti-apostacy inquisitions of the late 70's, early 80's

I got mine from Commnetary Press. But I'm looking for an ad for the book at the Watchtower Store right at the top of this page, right now. Go ahead, order it.

- Buster