Posts by Bugbear

11

Are you a coward?

by Bugbear in

active jw:s spending their time with the preaching work, are often aware of that their message does not comply with simple scientific facts.

they know that evolution has taken place, that the timetable of the bible is not correct, and that most of the bibles content, are tales, that the original text has been rewritten, and rewritten, and misunderstood, and rewritten (except for a fragment p54, which is from 300 a.c.) still they go out preaching, trying to find possible converts to the teaching of the gb.. often they try to do as little as possible, one or two hours per month, talking to their children, or old parents.

this to satisfy the elder who is responsible for the report list to the society.. but are these people not responsible for promulgate a lie.

Bugbear

Tornapart!

I am very sorry if I have insulted you or made you feel bad. Can you think that the question I have brought up very well could be about my own situation? I faded away slowly for 10 years. This trying not to split my family. I tried to be “as nice” to everyone to please the congregation, the elders, my wife, my children and was “tornapart”, because I knew I wasn’t doing the right thing to anyone. I spent month in therapy (CBT), just to find out my own reason why I had to please everyone. I took classes in University to ensure that I was not wrong about what I knew. I spent more than 10 years as an inactive JW. Every one of “the friends” in the cong. wondered why. I was a coward, till one day when all my children was safe out of the cong. and my wife asked me to say a prayer at a family reunion. I refused and said that I am not any longer going to spiritually rape, my family or any person coming to our dinner table. (This is what it is..spiritual rape)

My wife of course cried (she is still in), and understood, that I no longer was in the truth. She of course must tell the elders about the situation. And since then my life has improved, I have got new friends, no more visits from sheeparding JC,s CO,s or elders. I am free. Of course I have not convinced my wife with what is wrong with the society. She of course is free to believe what she wants to believe. But she has also been forbidden to speak “spiritual” matters with me. So it is quite mute at home nowadays.

Now think if I had the courage to do all that 10 years earlier? I could have saved whole my family 10 years of suffering, not knowing what I though. I could have supporting my children all the suffering they have felt by leaving the cong. and both their parents. I have really been a coward and induced much suffering and danger my children’s future by not saying what is right and what is wrong.

I am the Nazi turnkey, not you tornapart

Bugbear

11

Are you a coward?

by Bugbear in

active jw:s spending their time with the preaching work, are often aware of that their message does not comply with simple scientific facts.

they know that evolution has taken place, that the timetable of the bible is not correct, and that most of the bibles content, are tales, that the original text has been rewritten, and rewritten, and misunderstood, and rewritten (except for a fragment p54, which is from 300 a.c.) still they go out preaching, trying to find possible converts to the teaching of the gb.. often they try to do as little as possible, one or two hours per month, talking to their children, or old parents.

this to satisfy the elder who is responsible for the report list to the society.. but are these people not responsible for promulgate a lie.

Bugbear

Active JW:s spending their time with the preaching work, are often aware of that their message does not comply with simple scientific facts. They know that evolution has taken place, that the timetable of the bible is not correct, and that most of the bibles content, are tales, that the original text has been rewritten, and rewritten, and misunderstood, and rewritten (except for a fragment P54, which is from 300 a.c.) Still they go out preaching, trying to find possible converts to the teaching of the GB.

Often they try to do as little as possible, one or two hours per month, talking to their children, or old parents. This to satisfy the elder who is responsible for the report list to the society.

But are these people not responsible for promulgate a lie . Are they not responsible for dragging people into a cult which could be very harmful, for all these proselytes and to their families?

Some of them can excuse themselves, by saying I did as little as possible, not to be shunned or destroy my family. Or maybe some of us can say I was loyal to my family and friends and in fact I believed a bit of it and I thought that maybe this was what god expected from me.

But when are you responsible to stand up and say loudly “The king is naked”. Many of the turnkeys in Nazi concentration camps, or is Stalins archipelagos, or I Maos prison, excused themselves with the word :I only did what I was ordered to do….

Where is the pivot point, when you cannot be excused personally, when are you just a coward, trying to be social with human fellows that don’t dare tell them the TTATT.

Bugbear

22

Alzheimer's hallucinations are demons?

by Once Blind in

my father has been suffering from alzheimer's for a couple of years now.

my mother keeps referring to his hallucinations as demons.

i haven't been to the hall in a while, i've been fading for 20 years now, but i find this amazing!

Bugbear

Modern science has explained the phenomena of “daemons” in a very simple way. The demons or ghosts, many people have been fighting against, and struggle at, are simply neuron flashes in our brains. This is working very much as a dream when you are sleeping. It could as well be a nightmare very true in your brain and causing you sweat and breathe heavily. But when you wake up it all seems very true.

Several old Greek philosophers discussed the subject, but could not naturally explain it with “neuron attacks”. During the history (you will recognize several stories from the Bible) together with earlier Christian ascetics you will find many people who most probably today instead of being hailed as good Christians, should have a diagnose. Severe forms of hallucinations, is easy for a good physician to diagnose as f.ex. Schizophrenia. There are several other “diagnoses” that could cause hallucinations.

Think of the fact, that during thousands of years, people round the world have been fighting daemons only existing in their own head. Millions of children have been scared at trolls, St. Claus, fairy’s, elfs, fairy tells that adults has find up to explain their own fear.

Bugbear

28

A Faders Guide to Field Service

by pronomono in

as a fader, i'm working on a mental guide to field service.

because most of this is a mental exercise realizing that your new knowledge, the mental side of things, is what makes it so hard to preach after learning ttatt.

what presentations have you used in field service as a fader to preach the good news without preaching jw propaganda?.

Bugbear

The stress you feel comes out of your own concienceness. You know that what you are suposed to tell the people at the doors is not simply the truth. I stopped 10 years ago going on the field although my wife still was in. I remember we had some arguments about me being inactive, she was mainly scared that I would be lost in harmageddon. But I just sincerely told her my point of view. I also showed her the facts for my position. Now 10 years later I am Dfs. This making it impossible for my wife to listen to my argument, but I am sure that she also nows the TTATT. Now she is only afraid of losing all her friends at the KH.

Bugbear

28

The TRUTH about Jehovah's Wittnesses (from MY 22 YRS. EXPERIENCE) - A MUST READ!

by gmason972 in

jw
friends

i have learned to stay away from all religion and jehovahs wittness doctrine (that includes the watchtower and awake magazines).

stay away from positions of ministerial servant, pioneer, aux pioneer, elder, and the like.

once you become a full fledged jehovah wittness you are doomed to be unhappy.

Bugbear

Welcome.

I think your observations are quite right. JW´s pretend always to be honest, deasent, trustworthy persons, who love all of mankind. The WTBTS, claims to be the only Christians that are interpreting the Bible correct and they claim to have the thruth. The basic for "shunning" or disf. members is the Bible. you say" It is best to stick the basic principles layed out in the bible and leave religion and watchtower doctrines alone". But is it possible to use the Bible as the basic for your philosofy? Take a look at 2:nd John verses 9-10. These verses are a few of what the society claims to bee the basic for parents to shun their children or for family members to be closed out, just becouse they have have discovered that someting is wrong with what the Soc. says.

Bugbear

20

How many Kingdom Halls have you went to in your lifetime?

by Iamallcool in

jw
friends

for me, i think i went to 20 kingdom halls in my lifetime.

just a guess.

.

Bugbear

I also used to give talks in many KH. I think I could have visited 15-20 KH,s And I have also given talks in Circuit Assembly halls (3). At the first I felt popular, and I liked all the attention that our friends gave our entire family. But silently I started to understand that the truth was not the truth. And I was more and more trying to avoid following the manuscript, since there was no connection to reality in these papers supplied by the WT.

When it became obvious that I had other talks and ideas then on the manuscript, the “brothers” released me from my “privileges” and that was the greatest thing. From this point I could start to “fade away” and start to investigate several doctrines. Now I had the time break the “brain barrier” and realize that no truth was coming from the Borg. Today the DO,s and CO,s are warning people to have any conversations with me, this of course is quite tricky in my area of my country, since almost every JW,s still know who I am.

Bugbear

27

John Cedar Confronts his Jehovah's Witnesses Elder Father on the UN/NGO scandal

by Scott77 in

my father (who is an elder) hasnt been abusive, but he has reaffirmed that he will be shunning us the moment things become official.

we spent a few days vacation together in picturesque northern croatia before i sat him down and attempted to explain my position.

after i revealed the information on the un/ngo scandal to dad by showing him newspaper articles from 2001, he was initially nauseous and didnt want to hear any more.

Bugbear

Since I left the Borg, my wife is told by the body of elders and CO not to have ”spiritual” conversations with me. This means that every talk about the Bible, WT teachings, Philosophical problems with the Bible, age of humans, questions regarding the WTBTS financial politics a.s.f. is strictly forbidden subjects. If we are eating supper together and (there are only two of us at house nowadays) and some of these or closely related subject comes up, she will take her plate and go to another room saying her prayer and eat her food for her selves.

The sad thing for her is that all of our children are also out. When they are coming home to visit us, she must feel very lonely.

The Watchtower Soc. Is really punishing their own followers with their strange rules. My only worry is that she will suffer emotionally. But I can’t just keep quiet and let her live in a lie. But Terry it is very true Their culture is so ingrained that Truth cannot penetrate it.

Specially after being a JW almost 40 years.

Bugbear

5

Sisters need a revolution

by Bugbear in

i am the father of 4 beautiful girls (and two boys).

when we were in and i was an elder.

some of the toughest discussions i had to take were with my girls on the subject paul s letter to the corinthians, and the content is basically:.

Bugbear

I think that this is a hard question for the "borg" to discuss. Thay understand that these word of Paul, is just an ancient reflections of the times when Paul lived. It in fact proves that the word of god needs to be changed. transcribed or whatever you will call it. And of course this is un impossibility for GB. They cannot admit that a lot of the Bible is just crap. If they do so, the Borg will collaps.

Bugbear

5

Sisters need a revolution

by Bugbear in

i am the father of 4 beautiful girls (and two boys).

when we were in and i was an elder.

some of the toughest discussions i had to take were with my girls on the subject paul s letter to the corinthians, and the content is basically:.

Bugbear

I am the father of 4 beautiful girls (and two boys). When we were “in” and I was an elder. Some of the toughest discussions I had to take were with my girls on the subject Paul´s letter to the Corinthian’s, and the content is basically:

1 Cor 14:23-25 , 31-35 (shortly: women shall keep in silence and it would be disgraceful for a woman to talk in the Cong.) My girls were very angry with Paul’s letter and could never understand that such a statement reflected “the will of god”. Was this some punishment because of Eve´s sin?

Needless to say I lost these conversations all the time, and none of my girls (or boys) become a JW. (“thanks god!!!?”) To most humans today it is obvious that the word of Paul, is a very severe discrimination against half of the earth’s population. And in fact, it is a violation on the UN act of the “human rights”, and a violation against many modern states local laws.

This is my question to all the “ sisters” out there on this thread: why do you not take up this subject and ask “the Borg” for some “new light” here. There are many more qualified sisters to become elders, then in fact boys (or grown up men!!) In fact statistics shows in many countries that girls often have higher points in their “report cards” then the boys.

Bugbear

20

I think they're trying to shake off the Watchtower...

by gingerbread in

jw
friends

we had another couple over this weekend.

after taking a reasonable hike in the woods, we came back to the house, made a fire and began to talk a bit.

these folks are long time friends of ours and are (like us) slowly easing out of the kingdom hall.

Bugbear

I think youre up to something that many of us is speculating in. Of course they want to "take distance" to everything that has happened within the org. Look at wath "Gorby" said on this thread:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/266280/1/A-new-start-Watchtower-renaming-at-HQ-Columbia-Heights#.UoDvz_krdBk

More info on whats happening is interesting. Is the GB divided and has to manage another big scandal, by making two different org.?

Bugbear