Posts by Roddy

39

Sales of Bethel premises and transfer of millions to Brooklyn ?

by Nick! in

sales of bethel premises and transfer of millions to brooklyn ?.

just heard a very surprising and unbelievable news which i want to share with you and ask whoever has the right connections higher up in the borg, if this kind of news can be double checked for reliability.. .

the source of the information is believed to be reliable as it seems to be intimately related to some officials of the branch.

Roddy

The blog thereafter picks apart and analyzes the letter, quite flamboyently & sarcastically, speculating on Bethel layoffs among other things. He makes an interesting point though: This directive came from the Governing Body. According to what was written in 2000 / 2001 or so, the GB was separated from the Watchtower legal corporations so they could concentrate exclusively on "spiritual matters". How is it then that the GB is the one to send a letter to the Madrid branch that their printing services are no longer required (i.e., a business decision)?

You make a valid point. Especially when you consider that most of the GB are nursing home candidates so they couldn't have come up with the researched analysis and determination for all this.

I've become convinced that that the Legal Dept is the real power in the WTS. I once thought it was a two party system running the WTS - the Legal Dept and the Teaching Dept. But it looks like they both sleep in the same bed with the Legal Dept assuming the "male position".

The Teaching Dept will come with the necessary positive spin to hide the true facts. I'm fairly certain that the GB had no significant input in this.

I think the true facts will come from disgruntled ex bethelites from the soon-to-be former branch in Spain. As usual, this will be the biggest kick to those that have decades of service to the WTS and have no benefits and resources to fall back on as they are cut loose.

This should shake all Bethelites worldwide into believing the unbelivable: The WTS is not the ark where they can reside their lives in peace and security in a spiritual paradise until the coming of the New Order.

And I think this should end the general public Bethel recruitment efforts too. (Do they still announce that special Bethel application meeting held on the Friday lunch break at District Assemblies?) The COs have always been scouts for Bethelite talent. Now they will be scouts for Bethelite drones as well. What they can't offer is that this will be a secure job.

14

Which group would you say J-dubs hate more?

by awaken2004 in

catholics or born again christians?.

i know someone who doesn't believe the j-dub doctrines but anytime he talks to a non-witness about religion he takes on this arrogant attitude that.

the witnesses know more about the bible than any other religion.

Roddy

Traditionally it used to be Catholics because the Catholic Church was a big target. And the Rutherford legacy left the taste that when it came to disgusting Christendom, the Catholic Church is the representative bad guy for everything Christendom.

Lately it has been shifting to Born Agains. As the JWs seem to be more and more "mainlining", to lack a better turn, they have less reason to pick a quarrel with the Catholic Church but more so with Born Agains as they tend to be more controversial and more difficult to pidgeon-hole on issues. They present a moving target. And the WTS seem to hate moving targets. Those that prefer a more lively religion and personal religion will find the Born Agains an attractive alternative. So I'd say the Born Agains are more on the gun site than the Catholic Church had in the past.

Just my opinion.

5

What if Judge Rutherford never became president of the WT?

by Roddy in

i was talking with a friend and an interesting point came up: what if judge rutherford never became president of the wt?.

much of the heavy-handed, centralized, and authoritarian things we don't like about the wts is the rutherford presidency legacy.

if the wts stayed on the charles russell track, would we still be jws (or "bible students"?

Roddy

I was talking with a friend and an interesting point came up: What if Judge Rutherford never became president of the WT?

Much of the heavy-handed, centralized, and authoritarian things we don't like about the WTS is the Rutherford presidency legacy. If the WTS stayed on the Charles Russell track, would we still be JWs (or "Bible Students"?) Would there be less scandal, controversy, and dogmatic rules?

We rather thought that the WTS would be a kinder and less heavy-handed organization if it didn't have a Judge Rutherford presidency. It wouldn't have had its officers jailed in 1918, it wouldn't be arbitrarily injecting itself constantly into Bible prophesy, and so many things. I wouldn't be surprised if it would actually apologize for 1914 or other failed dates. And so much more.

What do you think?

27

How can I help my wife to get out

by Albert Einstein in

i am fading out after 18 years in jw cult (pioneer, ms, elder etc ...).

my wife was born in jw family, very strong family bonds, very loyal to jw.

at home we can talk pretty open, but she is so blindfolded, so loyal, not willing to admitt jw could be totally wrong... is there any chance to help her step by step?

Roddy

This is a tough one. You'll probably hear many menthods: the strong approach, the weak approach, the direct approach, the indirect approach. etc. What worked for one may not work for another, and vice versa. You need to know your wife and how important her extended family with the JWs really is. And If she is willing to sacrifice that for you.

This may not work for you but what sort of worked for me is the low, meek, under-the radar approach. Go inactive but don't go openly nor defiantly apostate. If you obviously turn apostate and get yourself disfellowshipped, you've just made your task ten times harder. So be inactive. Or irregular at the least.

Say that you are going through depression or other personal issue problems and allow yourself to loose your congregation privileges. This might be the hardest for you to do. It was for me because I enjoyed my congregation privilages. And the public shame that goes by their having to announce that I'm no longer a servant is a hard pill to swallow. But you'll get over that with time. In fact, if that depresses you further you can use it to further your case for depression. It will really be convincing if it was actually true. And being in a religiously semi-torn family should give you real basis for depression without you actually stating the nature of the condition.

They won't disfellowship you for being depressed or else they will have to disfellowship more than half of all JWs. But they will disfellowship you if you go against the WTS no matter what you got.

Start missing the meetings but also look for things that are of interest that you can do with your wife. If not on a Sunday then on a Saturday afternoon. Try to court your wife all over again. Not too fast, however. You'll have to be patient as it could take years. Start working by having her cut back on the time she spends in Field Service for starters.

When certain conversations come up just concentrate on what is the loving Christian way to do things looking for Biblical examples of them. Let her see how that is contrasted against how the WTS does matters. Winning her "without a word" is better then trying to argue or attack the WTS beliefs directly. Let her see how Bible examples of doing things contrasts against the WTS ways of doing things. Let her see for herself.

I'll turn over to others. May you find something that works best for you.

6

Memorial: A Superstitious Event?

by cameo-d in

are the elders required to keep a lunation journal?.

it seems to me that all the focus of the moon phase and getting the "exact right time" of the day and year according to the jewish calendar very much overshadows any stories of jesus.

all this full moon fuss seems to me to be an "observance of times" which was a method of divination.. my question is this..... do jws expect something big to happen on memorial one day?

Roddy

It's simply a ritual. They make such a big deal of the ceremony of which we are all to be spectators. But we have to be one of the lucky few congregations out of tens of thousands that actually witness hearing the stars of the program eat the crackers and slurp the wine.

In any other church, you are a participant.

I go for my folks and they seem happy that I come. By attending this one meeting they seem to forget that I don't attend any of the other meetings. If by attending this one meeting gets me out of attending five other meetings a week for 52 weeks in the year, not forgetting the one to three day assemblies too, I'd say it's a bargin.

13

Revelation Climax - book study question

by Roddy in

does anyone know how many times the revelation climax book (which was released in 1988) was studied in the congregation book study program up to now?.

in addition to how many times, if you know the years it was studied that would be helpful.

thanks.. .

Roddy

Does anyone know how many times the Revelation Climax book (which was released in 1988) was studied in the Congregation Book Study program up to now?

In addition to how many times, if you know the years it was studied that would be helpful. Thanks.

6

SM part this week: Blood Indoctrination from Reasoning Book. How'd it go?

by Open mind in

this week's service meeting has a 10 minute part which is an "audience discussion" (yeah right) of 2 or 3 pages from the reasoning book on blood.

there are several statements within the assigned material to effect of: 'well, if you die faithful, at least you'll be resurrected.

so pass the saline solution kool-aid!'.

Roddy

This week's Service Meeting has a 10 minute part which is an "audience discussion" (yeah right) of 2 or 3 pages from the Reasoning Book on Blood.

I can't believe it. The Reasoning book was published back in 1985. (With an update in 1989 - whatever that was.) How much more juice can they squeeze from any chapter of that book?

7

What about the Russellites?

by Roddy in

i was wondering about the russellites recently.

you remember -- these were the russell puritans who refused to submit to judge rutherford's new direction and/or centralization of authority into the watchtower organization.. in spite of judge rutherford's cursings, they continue down to this day.

they seem to be free of scandals.

Roddy

I was wondering about the Russellites recently. You remember -- these were the Russell puritans who refused to submit to Judge Rutherford's new direction and/or centralization of authority into the Watchtower organization.

In spite of Judge Rutherford's cursings, they continue down to this day. They seem to be free of scandals. I don't know if this is because they are more intelligent, stronger spiritually, too small to attract media attention, or a bit of all of the above.

Comments anyone?

7

Jehovah's Witness New Forum on facebook is now by invitation only

by bob1999 in

jw
friends

and they delete any thread that threatens them.. .

needless to say my threads have all been deleted.. .

http://www.facebook.com/board.php?uid=51298429787#/group.php?gid=51298429787.

Roddy

That's ok, Bob. If they come here to do the same the board admins will cut them off too.

35

Did there ever come a time where the meetings became unbearable?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

i try to attend about 3 sunday meetings per month just to keep my whole family from disowning me.

every week the meetings become more difficult to attend.. the singing is awful,the prayers are all about the ''faithful and discreet slave''.the talks are boring and repetative.the watchtower study reminds of trained seals at the zoo where they do the same tricks over and over just so they can get their treat of fresh fish.

the answers are short and read off the watchtower magazine word for word.

Roddy

I attended the Sunday meeting about a month ago because I thought a mutual friend was going to give the talk. Mistaken identity.

Anyway, the speaker was so intellectually handicapped, vocabulary challenged, and used so many stereotypic cliché and generalities I felt genuinely embarrassed for anyone sitting there listening to this speech.

Let me tell you how bad it was: The boring Watchtower study that followed was actually interesting by comparison!!!

I thought I was going to pull out all my hair!