Posts by livingagain

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Blood issue conscience matter?

by livingagain in

jw
friends

does anyone know where the wt ever said that taking blood was a conscience matter?

livingagain

Does anyone know where the WT ever said that taking blood was a conscience matter?

5

Comments?Elders Visit Again

by livingagain in

jw
friends

about 2/3 weeks ago the elders came to visit.

got rid of them pretty much didn't expect to see them again because i told them i was moving in a couple of months.i didn't plan on talking too much to them as i was studying for a test.

anyway it ended up being a long visit.

About 2/3 weeks ago the elders came to visit. Got rid of them pretty much didn't expect to see them again because I told them I was moving in a couple of months.I didn't plan on talking too much to them as I was studying for a test. Anyway it ended up being a long visit. Now here is where you on here come in. I talked to them about the blood issue and how JW's view it as a law of God not to take blood in any form.So I said why now can they have blood fractions? He said that it still is God's law not to take blood but that it is whole blood, and fractions are not whole blood and that when they are separated from whole blood they are another substance altogether. I said even if so fractions are derived from whole blood and still would be a by product of whole blood and that would seem to be circumventing the law to get around it. Then he said that blood is a conscience mattter and I said since when? He said it has always been the case. He pointed to the elder with him and said you see he will decide on what is good for he and his family on blood and I make the decision for what is good for me and my family because it is up to us what we decide on the matter according to our own conscience. I said if it is a conscience matter why do you need a liason committee then? each person will be operating according to their own conscience. I said have not people been D/F for receiving blood? He says you can't be D/F for acting on your conscience.

Is this man a lunatic or is it me? Where did he get the information that blood is a conscience matter? Where did he get that when blood is separated into fractions that it is now a different substance. Is there something I missed?

Needless to say he said the Dateline show was all a bunch of lies, that he personally knew of some of the information and it was all missrepresented. He said they mentioned on Dateline that JW's refused contact for the show but they failed to mention the letter that was sent to Dateline. I said seems like they were hiding why didn't they go on the show and read the letter or at least read the letter on videotapeand send the tape. He said their is not a problem in JW's with abuse and he knows how they are told to handle the case and it is never hush hush. He said do you believe it is written somewhere that we are told to keep it quiet? I said not written but unspoken.

They may want to come back because I told them I did care to discuss whether I still considered or wanted to be a JW. I said I have issues and am doing research to get the facts to resolve these issues ,and it would be irresponsible to make life decisions on anything but the facts. So we'll see if they return.

4

Elder Visit

by livingagain in

jw
friends

well i just had my elder visit here in my temporary job location town.

stood on the door stoop was not allowing them in my home uninvited.

my family had their visit on the weekend while i was down there(260 miles away) visiting.

livingagain

Well I just had my Elder visit here in my temporary job location town. Stood on the door stoop was not allowing them in my home uninvited. My family had their visit on the weekend while I was down there(260 miles away) visiting. Elders asked me was I going to the meetings, and I said no, asked could they ask why I said I did not care to discuss it. Also asked did I still consider myself or did I still want to be one of JW's, also answered I did not care to discuss it. One mentioned a scripture about Jehovah being camped all around(IChronicles16:9 he said it was) and asked me how did that scripture makes me feeI with the world so uncertain, that it made him very feel good. I've been working and living here temporarily for 11 months and never got a visit from any one at this hall. It is a shame that Elders allow themselves to be the henchmen for headquarters.Well so much for that I don't expect them back becaus I told them I would be moving back to my permanent address in a couple of months. What is this big thing that they want to know if you still want to be or consider yourself a JW since they asked my family the same question there?

4

Elders Visit

by livingagain in

jw
friends

two elders came by the house to speak with family on saturday afternoon.

one talked to my son who was washing his car( elder said son pretty much told him to get lost so he rang door bell and knocked until my daughter (he got same response) answered the door.

asked to speak with me, the mother, but daughter told him i was not interested.

livingagain

Just trying to fade away since about August.I started sharing what I learned first with hubby and gradually to two kids. They had already saw through a lot of it but was afraid to tell us.I beleive in time if we don't go back they will have spies to watch for wrongdoing to haul us in to JC. Neither of the 5 have a kind spirit but are vindictive. Always showed the petty side of them. Very jealous and petty because my husband made a lot of money (or so they insinuated) and we builded a large house and bought a so called luxury car. Of course they did not think I was a submissive wife but pushed ahead. But who cares? Right? I will never allow them to have that kind of authority over me again. Thanks for the Sunday's WT update.

4

Elders Visit

by livingagain in

jw
friends

two elders came by the house to speak with family on saturday afternoon.

one talked to my son who was washing his car( elder said son pretty much told him to get lost so he rang door bell and knocked until my daughter (he got same response) answered the door.

asked to speak with me, the mother, but daughter told him i was not interested.

livingagain

Two elders came by the house to speak with family on Saturday afternoon. One talked to my son who was washing his car( elder said son pretty much told him to get lost so he rang door bell and knocked until my daughter (he got same response) answered the door. Asked to speak with me, the mother, but daughter told him I was not interested. My husband was in back of house working on his truck and second elder skirted down there to talk to him. Seems that without going to the meeting they needed to tell us there will be no holy spirit for this family. I don't think they will give up because we were a very prominent family in the hall and husband was Elder until resignation in September.

On Sunday morning at 8:00 am a third elder phoned and hubby answered phone getting invite to meeting again, seemed to think the WT lesson was tailor made for family that all needed to hear, something about despondency.

Someone please tell me what the WT study was about yesterday. Please! Please!

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Molestors slip betweent he cracks...AGAIN!

by Quotes in

jw
friends

i don't want to bring anyone down, and i know it is important to hope for the best, etc.

etc.. but.... why, oh why, couldn't the cbc fifth estate program airing this week be airing during a "slow news week"??????.

all the news is about iraq, usa, dr. hans blix, weapons inspectors, yada yada yada -- not that those topics are not important, but i am really afraid that this much bigger news story will greatly drown out the very important story airing on cbc.

livingagain

I missed this! When is this program on and how can we get to see it in the US?

5

Ray Franz, DF DA & non JW's Salvation

by livingagain in

jw
friends

if someone disassociated themselves from the watchtower society due to research that convinced them that the watchtower was erroneous on many issues and yet still felt convinced that jehovah is much more gracious with regards to salvation than what we learned through the watchtower, is it possible for such a one to get reinstated, even if they did not believe numerous things that the watchtower teaches?

but is this possible if someone still does not believe that certain doctrines the watchtower teaches are bible based (i.e.

: 1914, blood transfusions, disfellowshipping, etc)?

livingagain

If someone disassociated themselves from the Watchtower Society due to research that convinced them that The Watchtower was erroneous on many issues and yet still felt convinced that Jehovah is much more gracious with regards to salvation than what we learned through the Watchtower, is it possible for such a one to get reinstated, even if they did not believe numerous things that the Watchtower teaches?

But is this possible if someone still does not believe that certain doctrines the Watchtower teaches are Bible based (i.e.: 1914, blood transfusions, disfellowshipping, etc)? Can you suggest how disfellowshipped or disassociated ones might get reinstated without lying or losing their integrity?

That is a difficult situation. First, you must consider the possibility that you are in error as well. When Jesus wrote to the seven congregations of his anointed ones, he twice mentioned that he hated the deeds of the sect of Nicolaus. Since Jesus' words were actually directed to the remnant of the anointed ones who would be living during the Lord's day, it indicates that there is a sectarian influence within the organization up until the time that Christ removes "all person doing lawlessness." Since such a divisive influence is not commonly recognized in the Society presently, it makes everyone more susceptible to it. Clearly, though, Jesus intended to alert his disciples to the danger of being misled from within the congregation. "Let he who has an ear hear what the spirit says."

Since Nicolaus was apparently a prominent person, he must symbolize an influential individual today that has a following within Christ's congregation. Unquestionably, Ray Franz and his sympathizers fit the profile of the modern day sect of Nicolaus. He, being a former member of the Governing Body, has an insider's credibility that he has used to draw thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses out of the organization. The modern-day sect's issues with the Watchtower are: 1914, blood transfusions, and disfellowshipping, etc.

So, since the spirit reveals to those with ears to hear that there is a sectarian influence in the organization up until Jehovah's judgment is leveled, and since that sect's influence is in evidence to those with eyes to see, it would be wise on your part to make sure that you have not fallen victim to the evil influence of the modern day sect of Nicolaus.

The main thing for all of us, whether in the truth or out of the truth, as the expression goes, is to have a close personal relationship with Jehovah and strong faith. Being disfellowshipped or disassociated, or alienated from the congregation in some other way, doesn't necessarily mean that we are also disfellowshipped from God, nor does it mean that we are disqualified from salvation or cut off from God. When Paul advised the Corinthian congregation to remove the wicked brother from their midst, he said that the purpose of that drastic action was for the 'destruction of the flesh so that the spirit might be saved.' So, according to Paul being expelled from the congregation, while harsh, was not a death sentence provided that the individual took the discipline and, in effect, destroyed his fleshly desires that had led him into sin.

Since sectarianism is also considered a work of the flesh, it would be well for persons who find themselves in the predicament that you describe, to reevaluate their situation and put forth an effort to humbly trust God to set all matters straight within his organization.

Has anyone read any of the questions and answes from this Watchman site? Who is this man? Highlighted info above caught my attention. Any thoughts?

280

UN FINDS WMD...OK saddam lovers, what now?

by dolphman in

ok lets hear your pathetic excuses.

c'mon now don't be shy.

let's hear what you have to say.

livingagain

Have you ever wondered if perhaps another world power may be ready to go off the scene.? I believe history teaches lessons but most fail to learn.Having the best military might does not gurantee victory if it is time for a world power to go. Somewhere along the way I think most in this nation think that being the greatest is a guarantee to longivity. World powers have come on the scene and gone and so will this one no matter what. Who can stop it? What brought most of them down? Was it not arrogance and haughtiness that that they could not be defeated? The greatest world power on earth can be defeated and whether you want to believe or accept it this will happen the only question is WHEN? Just my thoughts on this matter.

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