Posts by adamah

I never said it was righteous to follow your heart. What if what is in your heart is darkness? I think that most of the rest of your post is based on that assumption. Is that right?

Abraham listened to GOD... believed and obeyed... and that was credited to him as righteousness.

Not his personal desires... or even his own heart... but GOD.

Mark this moment (once again), since Adam is agreeing completely with TEC.

Yup, that's it, in a nutshell: Abraham was declared "righteous" since he "listened, obeyed, and was blessed" by Jehovah for following his orders, and put his faith in Jehovah. EVEN WHEN God later asked him to kill his son, Isaac: Abraham followed orders and didn't stop to think of what was in his (Abraham's) heart: he was completely willing to kill his son since God asked him to do so.

That's the problem with faith: it represents a WILLINGNESS to follow orders in the name of a higher power without stopping to ask questions, or consulting one's own heart or conscience. Why bother, since one's own human conscience is irrelevant, since believers know that the Bible says that the human heart is treacherous, and cannot be trusted anyway: that's the whole "faulty compass" thing.

Hence why Jihadists trust in Allah, JWs trust in Jehovah's power to resurrect and die refusing blood (based on a lie), when we all KNOW there will be no do-overs, no second-chances for those lives sacrificed in the name of 'faith'.

SNR said- The people in soddom and grommorah didnt know yaweh even 'existed', neither did lot, for goodness sake Lot had sex with his daughters the day after he was saved.... But is still called righteous by the bible and YOU tec!

TEC Said- Lot knew, but that is beside the point.

Yeah, Lot was the 'prodigal nephew' who unlike the prodigal son, actually never returned to 'true worship', since he turned his back on the 'family religion (YHWH worship)' that he had been raised in under his Uncle Abraham (Lot's own father had died long before while they were still in the ancestral homeland of Ur, IIRC). The Genesis account says that Abraham had publicly thanked Jehovah for the victory over the Kings (when he liberated captured Lot earlier), but the inhabitants didn't accept YHWH as their God.

Oh, and per the Genesis account, Lot was so drunk he didn't know that his daughters snuck in to lay with him.... Two nights in a row.

(Plus, later Mosaic law required 'two witnesses', and the daughters weren't confessing NOTHING!)

TEC Said- Sodom and Gomorrah were not destroyed simply because they did not know the God of Abraham existed... but rather because of the cries that had gone up to God BECAUSE of the actions of that town. Because of the blood that town had spilled of others, and perhaps even the innocent among them.

Yeah, there's plenty of extra-biblical stories and Hebrew myths that sprung up around the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, which I discuss in the blog article (link above). I suspect that the main reason behind the legends is much like how the stories of Paul Bunyan serve as a way to explain the natural appearance of America (eg the Grand Canyon is said to appear as it does today as a result of Paul Bunyan dragging his axe in the ground).

TEC Said- Does a person need to know God to know that raping/spilling the blood strangers that come into your town is wrong? God acted on behalf of the innocent BEING harmed and destroyed. The blood of those who had been harmed/slain cried out to Him, same as Abel's did. In the story, the two angels were sent to investigate, giving anyone the opportunity to prove their own righteousness, by doing good to those strangers. (do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by doing so, some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it) But according to the story, it was Lot who took them in, trying to protect them. Every other man, young and old, came to do them harm, and harm Lot also for protecting them.

That's all conjecture, of course (and smacks of moral relativism), but remember that Lot and Abraham were foreigners living in a foreign land as aliens (non-citizens), where the inhabitants worshipped their own Gods and had their own customs. The story smacks of religious hegemony, since it wasn't like they had any authority to move into a foreign land and expect others to worship their Gods, and adopt their customs, etc. It would be like S. Americans who cross into the States illegally, and expect us to become Catholics, do things like they're done in Guatamala, etc, etc.

In fact, I suspect that's likely the intent of the story of Lot in Sodom: the account was designed to stress the point that given the circumstances under which the account was written (during or after captivity in Babylon), the Jews were strangers living immersed in a foreign culture against their will, and Lot was the poster boy of a boisterous outsider who didn't exactly fly under the radar and lay low, but instead made a showy display of his strange customs and was clueless to how he fit into the surrounding culture: instead of being rewarded for his cluelessness and sticking to "true values", he was made the anti-hero who VIOLATED those same principles every chance he got. The story ends with him becoming the forefather to the enemies of the Chosen People.

Of course, the author's intent was likely lost on the author of 2nd Peter (who wrote his epistle some 1,000 years AFTER the Genesis account was written (!), relying on the Greek Septuagint, no less....), who declared Lot to be not a heel, but a hero (AKA a righteous man) to fit into Xian theology. Of course, Lot didn't make Paul's heroes of faith list, so there's another NT contradiction (as well as the OT/NT contradiction).

Adam

33

so happy today!!

by XstuckX in

jw
friends

i'm married with small children.

my wife and i both born-in and baptized jws.

i began my slow drift about a year ago.

adamah

XstuckX said-

adamah.....you're right. Unfortunately there are some circumstances that prevent a clean break. Mainly....I work for an elder and it won't be pretty. In a few years I'll be part owner....if I make it that long and he won't be able to screw me over. but now with what happened today it's got me thinking I need to make a move.

Of course, I don't know the details of your situation, but now that you know TTATT, what price are you willing to pay for your kids freedom?

There's no non-painful way to pull a bandaid off without it hurting, but I'm all for the fast method...

And hopefully you've been planning (and sticking to) an exit strategy all these months since you've committed to TTATT (where step #1 SHOULD be finding another job), because a plan isn't going to fall from the sky into your lap or develop spontaneously on its own....

Granted, it's a GREAT sign, but you really need to develop a plan with her TODAY, and commit it in writing, signed and dated with a definite timeframe. Even if you get her to commit to a plan, that's a GREAT accomplishment since you can plan it together, and then keep it on the down-low from the boss and KH. That's a great step towards getting to where you want to go....

Adam

28

bad manic episode-went to hospital

by love2Bworldly in

hi-- for those of you who struggle with bipolar & depression, just wanted to share my experiences.

i had a major manic episode last month and spent a week in a phsyciatric hospital, what an experience that was!

not fun.

adamah

Love2BeWorldly said-

I wrote down every symptom I could think of that starts happening to me and it is SO helpful because this past week has been pretty stressful with my whacky family members due to my stepmoms death. I am feeling empowered after that class, like I can take better care of myself.

That's great news to hear, as prevention is the key, learning how your brain responds to situations. I'm sure you're aware of the importance of getting plenty of restful and sound SLEEP, since lack of sleep is an extremely common trigger (and anxiety is going to prevent that, keeping you awake at night, tossing and turning).

BTW, I think it's time for you to get a new avatar: you no longer have to carry the weight of the World around on your shoulders, you know, since you're OUT of the JWs.

Adam

33

so happy today!!

by XstuckX in

jw
friends

i'm married with small children.

my wife and i both born-in and baptized jws.

i began my slow drift about a year ago.

adamah

XStuckX said-

I told her I'm not sure that's a good idea and we will think this through and discuss it.

Holy Hades, dude!

If you don't have any other legitimate excuses to delay (eg other family members), I say get while the going is good! She wants to celebrate Xmas (which is a week and a half away), so don't pussy-foot around and get cold feet now! The mall crowds are going to be atrocious the weekend before Xmas, and it's Sunday, so there's still shopping hours left today and the Xmas tree lots are thinned out by now! In fact, take her to the mall RIGHT NOW, and just "browse".

Making a clean break from the JWs with your family intact would be the greatest Xmas gift, EVER, and screw the extended family (they're likely not going to change their minds, anyway, and YOUR kids should be the most important ones in your lives, esp if you and her don't want them to waste their lives trapped in the vortex of chasing a pipe-dream).

Adam

48

Finally decided to introduce myself here

by cookiemaster in

hey guys !

i've stopped believing the watchtower crap a few years ago.

i achieved this on my own, despite being raised as one.

adamah

Welcome aboard, Cookiemaster!

9

I need to make some new friends now.

by quellycatface in

jw
friends

it gets harder to make friends as you get older and you're children more independent, i feel.. i know it sounds a bit sad but any ideas about how to make some new friends??.

i'm not averse to joining a club or starting a new hobby.

i just feel a bit out of practice.. nelly no mates xx.

adamah

Service clubs like Rotary and Kiwanis are primarily business people; in fact, there has to be an 'opening' within the local community club for a certain 'profession' or 'service' in order to join, since "doubling up" of professions is discouraged to avoid competitiveness (and you need a sponsor already within the club). Although they do community projects, the idea is to seek out the services of a fellow Rotarian, if possible. Many small communities will have multiple chapters that meet (new branches open in a neighboring area), since the older ones tend to be full.

Chamber of Commerce is all about small businesses, and it's a good way to network within the community to get to know the other small business owners, esp if you your community is small enough to rely on 'business-to-business' sales (rather than everyone going to the big chains (like Costco) for their business needs). They have an ambassadors program, where they'll conduct opening events for the newest members (businesses pay to be members) and their mixers are an opportunity to shmooze with the other members.

So none of those are particularly 'social clubs' per se, where the point is to make friends; for that, you might be better off finding groups that do volunteer community clean-ups ('clean a beach' activities) or even a nature club that has day hikes, etc. Many junior colleges offer night courses for adults who aren't necessarily seeking college degrees, but simply to learn additional skills to expand. Those are always good; in fact, look into the local junior college and sign up for a night course that seems interesting to you, and learn simply for the sake of learning, or to explore a new topic.

It's always hard to get out of your rut and go into something new alone, but go in with a good attitude and wearing a smile, and adopt receptive body language, and be open to meeting people.

Adam

24

Is there an official name for this comedic device?

by Island Man in

is there an official name for the comedic device where one replaces one word with another word having a similar pronounciation but a different (usually derisive) meaning?.

for example, some skeptics deride the bible by spelling it "buy-bull".

same or simliar pronounciation but entirely different meaning.

adamah

Steve2 said-

Contrary to what an earlier poster siad, a well chosen pun is often a counter-argument. E.g., Rutherfraud is unerringly close to the truth.

Uh, 'Rutherfraud' isn't even a pun (since it's not a homophone, unlike 'piosneer' for 'pioneer'). But worse, it goes no further to proving WHY you think Rutherford is a fraud, so it's actually a thought-stopper which demands the listener to adopt your conclusion without any reason given, which is absurd thing to do. You don't fight JW irrationality by countering with more irrationality: why would you even do so, when you HAVE "the Truth"?

So unless you're a Tea Party type (i.e., the type of person who thinks referring to 'President Odumma' is clever, when it just makes them appear childish), it's best to use puns sparingly as 'rhetorical devices'. Puns are best used for comedic purposes: George Carlin and Groucho Marx were masters of the pun), since puns are fueled by the 'style over substance' fallacy (as discussed in my blog post, written long-ago):

http://awgue.weebly.com/what-did-ojs-legal-defense-team-and-genesis-yahwist-have-in-common.html

Steve, I'm guessing you're confusing 'rhetorical devices' with 'arguments' (which unlike puns, consist of a conclusion with supportive evidence); you're using the two terms as synonyms, when they're not.

Adam

24

Is there an official name for this comedic device?

by Island Man in

is there an official name for the comedic device where one replaces one word with another word having a similar pronounciation but a different (usually derisive) meaning?.

for example, some skeptics deride the bible by spelling it "buy-bull".

same or simliar pronounciation but entirely different meaning.

adamah

3rd Gen said-

Adamah, while I agree that these puns may not qualify as valid argument, for me, they served an important purpose. As I was learning TTATT these funny words described what I was now noticing. Piosneers made me LOL as well as helped to marginalize their importance in my life. Who cares what an El duh thinks? ASSembly aptly describe the event. These words help new ones distance themselves from the cult and break away from its language.

Yeah, this subject pops up from time to time, and the situation boils down to realizing that the venting and self-perceived cleverness often comes at the cost of merely succeeding in triggering the hair-trigger cult defenses of those who are still in, by living up the apostate characture. So if we're trying to liberate those still in (like all of us who have family members in the JWs), it's unlikely to help: in fact, it plays right into the hands of the GB who say that apostates are childish mockers who are angry, hate-filled, etc. It's hard to imagine how that is helpful?

But on the other hand, all approaches have a certain value to someone, and certainly whatever emotional impact that derision and irreverance has on others, it arguably might help some to learn TTATT and question the authority of the JWs, helping to break the stranglehold.

However, it would be great to see people using the power of punnage not remaining trapped in the mire of their own emotions as if needing to act out against the authority figures they claimed to leave behind decades ago, but to bring up their game. But everyone does what they can do, I guess...

Adam

14

Can you be DFd if you were never really baptised?

by Slidin Fast in

here's a question.

i was baptised at a very early age.

it may have been as early as ten years old.

adamah

Blues Brother said-

Reminds me of a child from a rough family that had studied alone with the cong., a few years later. This girl too had "taken the plunge" inadvisably and then drifted away. After that, when she was a young woman somebody contacted her and was recounting that she was now living "in sin". The elder's respnse? not how to help her but "Was she ever disfellowshipped ?"

Yes, since they have to keep the congregation clean! Oh, wait: "she had drifted away"?

Well, they can't play it too safe here: she might wake up one morning and decide to go out in field service on her own, and what if some householder called the KH and complained about her activity and it turned out she HADN'T been DFed? Imagine the egg on their faces, and the disrespect and reproach that it might bring upon Jehovah's organization!

Meanwhile Brother Pedophile continues his "hobby", since we cannot be too presumptious about THAT (the "two witness" rule), and THAT'S not going to bring any reproach upon Jehovah's name, no sireee!

Well all know why: JW elders are generally Walter Mitty types who get off on their faux monkey trials and the power of deciding who's going to get shunned: it's a power trip and ego-gratification for uneducated men, pure and simple, and even more absurd than the men girl cliques of High School (at least insecure teen girls have an excuse for being catty: they're uncomfortable in their own skin, and seek to put others down).