Watch your spelling - it is noodity, and, anyhow I thought muppets were extinct.
No it's not! It's New Ditty!
Dansk (who thought this thread was about a song)
Posts by Dansk
-
4Newdity?
by Muppet inthought that would get your attention!.
so if the witnesses are wrong?
what do you believe is "truth"?.
-
-
Dansk
-
47
Made from Monkeys or from Dirt
by Satanus inthe bible states mankind was made by god from plain old dirt.
science however, has shown that we are in the nieghborhood of 98% monkey (chimpanzee).
was god lazy, in that he didn't start from scratch in making people, but used animal parts to assemble the human body?
-
-
Dansk
Abaddon,
http://www.talkorigins.org
There is no easy method to getting to grips with the evolution vs creation argument other than sitting down and reading for quite a while.
The link wouldn’t work. Also, I wasn’t saying that I believe in Creation – I really don’t know – but I don’t know about evolution, either. To give an example, David Attenborough, the famous English naturalist, has had some fantastic television programmes made and books published and in some he might say "40,000,000 years ago such and such evolved." However, I’d then pick up a newspaper and it would say "Scientists now argue that such and such only came on the scene 10,000,000 years ago." In other words, while evolution might be a fact – I don’t know! – the "evidence" has a tendency to shift.
I like permanent facts, such as the way Carl Olof Jonsson was able to prove incontrovertibly that the date for the fall of Jerusalem to the Babylonians was 586/7 BCE and not 607 BCE. He was able to do this by supplying 14 lines of evidence. How can anyone believe that something is right when scientists keep changing the dates (doesn’t that sound familiar!).
Hi Peacefulpete,
The brain seems to deny the possibility that species are a new type of animal rather than simply a variation.
I’m interested in ornithology and scientists believe they can trace all birds back to one common ancestor. The birds I specialise in are from the family Estrildidae , Estrildid finches, and it is apparent that, for example, in the genus Estrilda there has been some change resulting in different species, close examples being Estrilda troglodytes, E. astrild and E. rhodopyga. Three separate species, but all so similar that they are placed, rightly so, in the same genus. My brain allows me to appreciate this. What I say I have difficulty with is observing the actual change from one completely different animal into another, such as a reptile into a bird. I’m NOT saying it didn’t happen – I don’t know! – but I haven’t yet seen anything concrete to make me believe it. OK, there’s Archaeopteryx and there’s Confuciusornis, etc., but can we honestly say that the evidence for A resulting in B which resulted in C is incontrovertible? We only have hypothesis.
If nothing else, what I’ve learnt from almost two decades of Watchtower dogma is to be sceptical until proof is beyond doubt!
Dansk
-
47
Made from Monkeys or from Dirt
by Satanus inthe bible states mankind was made by god from plain old dirt.
science however, has shown that we are in the nieghborhood of 98% monkey (chimpanzee).
was god lazy, in that he didn't start from scratch in making people, but used animal parts to assemble the human body?
-
-
Dansk
Hi Abaddon,
Alan F;
No they don't. Acupuncturists have no clue as to why their methods work. Furthermore, they only work sometimes and on some people. I know, because my wife had acupuncture treatments from a prominent local practioner and, after a few sessions, nothing whatsoever happened, which leads me to conclude that the little benefit my wife thought she got the first few times was the placebo effect.
Actually, accupunture works (in terms of changing a recipients body chemistry) just as well as 'conventional' drugs;
Alan didn't say acupuncture doesn't work, just that it works sometimes and on some people. My wife is a qualified acupuncturist and more than once my boys and I have been her guinea pigs. We always felt better from our maladies afterwards - though there can be side effects even from acupuncture, such as diarrhoea, depending on where the needles are inserted (and two areas, especially, can be extremely uncomfortable - one on the hand and another on the foot). Acquaintances I've known my wife treat have always said they've been helped/cured!
AlanF,
When you speak of evolution, do you subscribe to the teaching of birds evolving from reptiles, man from apes, etc? I really don't know. I can accept adaptation, where something changes, such as forms changing sufficiently in a species to give them separate species status but keeping them in the same genus, and which is what some people term 'evolution'. But from one species to evolve completely from another is something I find difficult to comprehend. I'm open to presented evidence...........
Dansk
-
31
DOES SATAN EXIST?
by Dansk inthere are a couple of ideas on this.
one is that satan is a corruption of the egyptian god set who murdered the god osiris and was avenged by horus.. the second is found in the religion of the persian zoroaster, who professed the good god ahura mazda who was at war with the evil god angra mainyu, later known as arhiman.
the zoroastrian concept of hell is almost a mirror image of the jewish hell, and zoroaster's religion even had the concept of a purgatory, as well as a last judgement.
-
-
Dansk
Hi Gopher,
The way that JW's use Satan is different than that explained by the Bible scholar friend you cited.
You're absolutely right, of course, and as you infer, the JWs use the "scare tactics" of saying Jehovah will punish you if you "follow Satan", i.e. go against Jehovah. My friend is not conversant with JW dogma and his quote is based on his knowledge/experience with the usual Christian denominations.
Cheers,
Dansk
-
31
DOES SATAN EXIST?
by Dansk inthere are a couple of ideas on this.
one is that satan is a corruption of the egyptian god set who murdered the god osiris and was avenged by horus.. the second is found in the religion of the persian zoroaster, who professed the good god ahura mazda who was at war with the evil god angra mainyu, later known as arhiman.
the zoroastrian concept of hell is almost a mirror image of the jewish hell, and zoroaster's religion even had the concept of a purgatory, as well as a last judgement.
-
-
Dansk
There are a couple of ideas on this. One is that Satan is a corruption of the Egyptian god Set who murdered the god Osiris and was avenged by Horus.
The second is found in the religion of the Persian Zoroaster, who professed the good god Ahura Mazda who was at war with the evil god Angra Mainyu, later known as Arhiman. The Zoroastrian concept of hell is almost a mirror image of the Jewish hell, and Zoroaster's religion even had the concept of a purgatory, as well as a last judgement.
Since the Israelites were held in Assyrian captivity, it's very likely that they were introduced to the dualistic nature of Zoroastrian solar worship and more than a few scholars feel that much of Judaism was lifted from Persian influences.
Since coming out of Watchtower and realising we've been fed a load of baloney I have been conducting my own research, including to the very roots of the Bible. I don't believe Satan exists. As a Bible scholar friend puts it: "He is a manufactured scare tactic, as is his domain and the claim of eternal damnation, in order to keep the priests and the religions they offer as the only way to 'salvation'. It keeps the priests in business. The concept of a devil arises from the idea that God is ultimately good and can therefore not be evil, so there must be another anti-God element to explain the evil in the world - enter Arhiman, Set or Satan. Apparently the scare tactic still works as millions still believe in the fires of hell and that the Devil's gonna get you if you don't watch out. "
-
16
TIME FOR A BONFIRE? BOOKS FOR FREE!
by Dansk ini have some bound volumes:.
watchtower 1951-2001. awake 1987-2001. does anyone have any really good use for them, such as research against the organisation?
if so, let me know here or by pm.
-
-
Dansk
Nic,
Check your pm.
AlanF,
Please check your home e-mail.
Dansk
-
20
CONFESSIONS TO ELDERS ARE DANGEROUS
by Dansk ini can honestly say i never trusted the elders in my congregation; there wasnt a single one of them that i thought would be of any use what-so-ever in helping with a problem.
on the contrary, whenever i had to speak to an elder, i invariably felt worse afterwards!.
this brings me to the point of this post.
-
-
Dansk
Amazing:
I agree with your comments, but need to add that I believe the greater danger remains with active Elders. Often, these men will use older confessed information against the unsuspecting JW in future issues. Example: A young man, perhaps 17 or 18 years old, masturbates and confesses to an Elder. Later on, maybe at age 22 or 23 the same young man is now dating, and is seen holding hands with or kissing a girl ... he will often be counseled, and if the Elder he confessed to learns of the newer events, will use the older information to show how the young man has a "weakness" ... or ... at other times, such information will be used to stop a young man from advancing in the organization ... always peppered with the notion that he somehow needs "more time."
How true that is!! I was asked to appear before the Service Committee; that they wanted to talk to me about why I wasn't appointed an elder. The service overseer was the first to start talking and told me that they were concerned about my temper.
"My temper?", I asked incredulously. "What do you mean?"
"Well", he replied "there was that altercation you had with Bro. XXXXXXXX"
"Bro. XXXXXXXX", I exclaimed, "but that was TEN years ago!"
I'd had an argument with this elder, quite literally a decade before - and the elder apologised!! Now, it was being levelled against me!
Struggling now, the service overseer then said: "Er, well, you also had a recent argument with Bro. XXXXXX"
"Bro. XXXXXX!!", I asked in utter shock!
Now, OK, if I've done something wrong I'll take the punishment, but this was an absolute lie! I've never had an argument with this person, or anyone else in the KH save for the elder above - and he deserved it - in my life. The bottom line was the service committee was doing its utmost to hold me back. I knew it was a waste of time so just sat there like an imbecile for the rest of the meeting. What can you do with a group of people, one of whom is the P.O., and he allows his son, also an elder, to make fun of virtually everyone in the congregation with impunity. This is the same guy who told me about the intimate details of the couple having the affair that he'd learnt during a JC!
The body of elders are obviously responsible for my family and I being shunned - and yet one has a daughter living with a guy and she's not even been counseled. I don't have a problem with the girl at all - but the double standards many of us have been subjected to by elders leaves a bitter taste.
Dansk
-
20
CONFESSIONS TO ELDERS ARE DANGEROUS
by Dansk ini can honestly say i never trusted the elders in my congregation; there wasnt a single one of them that i thought would be of any use what-so-ever in helping with a problem.
on the contrary, whenever i had to speak to an elder, i invariably felt worse afterwards!.
this brings me to the point of this post.
-
-
Dansk
Actually, Physio (my wife) has just made a good point. Most of the elders in our old congregation - and especially the latest appointed elders - are young, late 20s to early 30s, and have no children. The last appointed elder (just a couple of weeks ago), is in his 30s, has no children (doesn't want any any) and his wife NEVER attends meetings (though she always attends any parties).
The point here is, these men cannot possibly understand what it is like to raise a family and the type of problems that can arise. They are also inexperienced in life.
One elder who DOES have a young family (two children) was on the ministry with our group one day (he was the group overseer) when I found myself suddenly having him walking by my side. He looked over at some shops and said: "I used to snog (kiss) my girlfriends over there. Did you enjoy snogging in such places?"
A sister, in her late 50s, overheard his remark and got him alone, whereupon she said "And YOU'RE an elder!" She wasn't amused at all - none of us were - but he just laughed. The guy is an absolute idiot.
Would you feel safe with these type of people on your JC?
Dansk
-
5
Warning for those people who pick their nose.
by Holey_Cheeses*King_of_the juice. in.
be careful.. cheeses - who always uses two fingers to avoid this happening.
-
-
Dansk
This reminds of the time the driver of a car wasn't concentrating but, fortunately, he only slightly shunted the car in front. People started to mill around, especially as the driver of the car who'd been hit had his shirt and face covered in blood.
"But I barely touched his car", the guilty person exclaimed "I don't understand how he could be covered in blood!"
It turned out the person who got hit had been picking his nose at the time!
Dansk
-
26
The pain has kicked in
by Pistoff inhi all and thanks for being here and caring.
i have had a bad day today.
most of you have heard me rant and rave about my thirty years in the borg, not yet over.
-
-
Dansk
Hi Pistoff,
Craig is right:
So trust me when I say, it does get better.
As you know, my wife, two boys and I are all being shunned - even by my two daughters! The first week or two my wife and I cried buckets. I couldn't speak to (non-JW) friends on the telephone without breaking down. Why? Because everything we had been taught has proven to be a lie. Coming from the organisation we would have at one times laid our lives down for this is hard to stomach, so no wonder you're having a bad day.
However, you mentioned that you never once shunned your DFd son - that tells me you're a greater man than anyone in the organisation. That's your starting point, you're kind and considerate - qualities sadly lacking in many borgites!
I've only been out of the organisation around 5 months now and there have been times I have been utterly ashamed of my expletives - words I would never have used as a JW. But that's how it gets you - and a good blast swearing can, in a rather bizarre way, be therapeutic, though I'm hoping it will pass!
A an exJW friend told me that it takes at least six months before one is able to completely chill out, and I believe he is right. We've all been through so much and here we have true friends; friends who REALLY understand where we're coming from. We KNOW how you feel pistoff, but time is, indeed, a great healer. You've done absolutely the right thing - you've poured out your heart here and you'll receive the best "counselling" anywhere.
We all love you, Pistoff. It's unconditional and it's starting to permeate the globe. You have SO MUCH to offer others searching for help. Yes, we may still get the odd black day - but the pain will be nothing compared to what you've been feeling of late. You have family still in but, like so many of us, just let time prove you right. Eventually, I'm sure all your family will come to realise the falseness of the Watchtower - but you're going to have to help them see this falseness by acting better than them. Remember, when they DO see how they've been lied to, they'll need someone to be there for them. It isn't your family and friends that are necessarily wrong. It's that rotten dogma that we all fell foul of!
Pistoff, I've found real joy since being out of Watchtower - and I've done this by tending to my garden, associating with some really good (exJW) friends and just going for walks with my wife. You may not like gardening or other things I enjoy, but the secret is to find something that you DO thoroughly enjoy. Going out into the countryside and seeing and listening to nature first-hand is the greatest tonic I need. Then I come here and log on and am immediately amongst friends.
I consider myself an animistic pantheist now. In other words, I don't have to believe in God but, if he's there, I can appreciate him through creation.
Bless you, Pistoff. Some of your own posts have really helped me and I know they will undoubtedly have helped others, also. This thread, without you even realising it, will also help others - because you have stated what others can identify with and they can fit the "counsel" to themselves. See, you've gone and helped me again!
((((((HUGS)))))) buddy,
Dansk