Posts by Descender

28

Christian Freedom - Ray Franz

by Noumenon in

jw
friends

in the foreword of ray franz's book 'in search of christian freedom', he says: .

"there is yet another, very significant, side to the matter.

many persons seek only a negative freedom.

Captain Pugwash, imagine that you were born into a Jehovah's Witness family like many on this board were. You grow up in the religion, with Jehovah's Witness parents, grandparents, and friends. You are an outcast at school because you aren't allowed to participate in any sports or extra-ciricular activities and you don't celebrate holidays like the rest of the kids. You believe that all the people out there that aren't Witnesses are bad people that will die a horrible death at armagedon and it's just around the corner and you look forward to it more than anything else in the world because that's what you've been taught to believe since you were born.

One day, (lets say you're 21 years old) someone drops a bomb on you with a question about some questionable practices or change of beliefs that the Watchtower society has been asociated with. Of course these things can't be true can they, but they weigh on your mind, so you go and ask the elders about these doubts that have been culminating in your mind. The elders decide to disfellowship you because you have a lack of faith because you asked such questions that they can't answer. Now, the only people that you've ever known in your whole life will have nothing to do with you, your grandparents won't talk to you, your friends that you've had since you were 5 won't look at you, your parents disown you and won't allow you in their house. Why??? just because you asked the wrong question.

So, if that was your situation, would you just say, "oh well, I made a mistake" or would you be a bit pissed off that you just spent 21 years of your life learning and upholding something that's not true and because you learned some hidden secret, all the people that you ever knew will have nothing to do with you now. Mind you, these are the same people that were your best and only friends the day before you were disfellowshipped, now they look at you with loathing if they happen to see you walking on the street and walk the other way.

Would it be so easy just to let it all go? For being a counselor, you don't have a very good knack for walking in other people's shoes.

7

Idiot work mates

by Descender in

jw
friends

i don't really understand why some people can be such idiots.

how can people dismiss every other person's religion or belief as illogical while holding strong to their own illogical beliefs.

i work with a few bush worshiping ultra conservatives.

Descender

I don't really understand why some people can be such idiots. How can people dismiss every other person's religion or belief as illogical while holding strong to their own illogical beliefs.

I work with a few Bush worshiping ultra conservatives. My boss has actually said that he wishes that the United States would turn into a monarchy and Bush would be designated king of the USA. The guys I work with are always talking about how the US isn't doing enough in the way of war.

They're all in their 50's and they're college educated, but they think of the good old days as the days when England, France, and Spain traveled the world overthrowing peaceful countries and laying claim to new lands. They seriously think that the US should go to war and take over any country that disagrees with basically anything that the US says.

They hate foreigners, they hate gays and lesbians, and they don't like other races even if the other race is American. They were discussing recently how the US should take all people of Arabic descent and ship them back to the middle east. They worship money and are all for big business taking control of the world. They don't like the conservation of nature, they would rather see clear-cutting for the economy of course. They don't like the arts, if they had it their way they would completely cut arts and music from schools and replace those classes with economics and business classes.

To top it off, some of them are hardcore Baptists. They are always talking about the evil of drugs and alcohol and the rise of Babylon the Great in the Middle East and the anti-Christ and Israel being guided by the hand of God and how Bush is being guided by God because he's helping Israel.

The above are all conversation that they've recently had. There is no room for the voice of reason or disagreement. Their idiotic conversations are only for those that believe the exact same as them. It strikes me as odd that during these conversations they sometimes get mad and yell as if someone is disagreeing with them when all they are doing is yelling about why the US isn't sending all the Arabs back to the middle east and what they'd change if they were dictators of the US like Bush.

Just now as I was typing this, they were discussing how there is no such thing as alien life forms because humans were God's only inteligent creation. You wouldn't know it from spending a day here.

Anyway, I just wanted to vent a bit about my work mates. I'd get a new job, because I have no love for this one, but I'm putting my wife through the masters program at the moment and I'm the only source of income. But I just can't forsee staying in this environment forever, I might catch the idiot bug and turn into one as well.

Anyone else have work mates that seem to have lost a few brain cells along the way?

35

RATED R MOVIES

by sandy in

this past weekend a relative came over with these ultimate fighting dvds that he bought but he wouldn't sit down and watch city by the sea because it is rated r.

they can be so dense and hypocritical!

when i pointed out to him that his ultimate fighting dvds are un-rated but in my opinion it is far worse to watch people fighting for pure entertainment purposes than it is to see a rated r movie that teaches a great life lesson.

Descender

In my old congregation, it wasn't just "R" rated movies that were off limit. Two elder's wives had taken it upon themselves to guard the congregation from the evil Disney Cartoon Movies. I mean what could be more demonic than talking animals with human emotion and mystical creatures like mermaids and magical beasts.

Then there was a specific talk on the Harry Potter movies at my congregation when it first came out and my in-laws got pulled into the back and scolded because it was known that they'd read the books. And when my wife and I took my parents and brother out to see the last Lord of the Rings movie, I asked my brother why he hadn't gone to see this movie with his girlfriend and friends. He told me that witnesses were frowned upon if it was known that they went to see LoTR movies because they were filled with magic and pagan rituals and his friends wouldn't go see it.

I thought that was kind of funny, so I told him that there were plenty of pagan rituals that witlesses still followed and that he shouldn't give his fiance a wedding ring because that was a pagan practice. Then my mom got mad and broke down and cried and asked my wife and I why we weren't going to meetings any more. And that's another story all together.

32

X-box or play station...

by Panda in

please advise this old woman ... which should i get for a christmas gift play station or x-box?

on one games sight (starwars) they say x-box but i've never heard anything about that??

help

Descender

Well, I'm in my late twenties. I have the Playstation 2, Game Cube, and the X-Box. The only reason I bought the Game Cube was for the Zelda games, which are really fun, the other Game Cube games just seem a bit young to keep my interest for very long. The Playstation 2 has a huge arsenol of games, my favorites being the most violent, Grand Theft Auto series. The X-Box has some good games and the best graphics along with the best multi-player online setup.

But alas, the game that I play 100x as much as any of the other games is an on-line computer game called Everquest. I've been playing that one on a regular basis for almost 4 years now and it's so addictive I can't stop. But on a good note, it saves me money on buying new games and renting movies.

26

The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (2003)

by Sassy in

we just bought tickets online last night to go see it.... the first showing is at midnight tuesday night.. woo hoo!

can't wait!!

is anyone else planning to go??

Descender

I look at rottentomatoes.com to see how the newest upcoming movies rate, and so far, The Return of the King is pulling in 100% good reviews. That will probably change a bit over the upcoming weeks, but the other two LoTR movies got 94% and 98% good reviews. That's quite a feat for any movie, including independent and art films, to get that high of reviews.

This one is going to be a must see. It's one of those movies that if I were still a young JW, I would have been praying for Armagedon to be delayed at least long enough for me to see this cool film. Anyone else ever do that?

6

A terrible tragedy in Georgia....

by TresHappy in

police: parents beat daughter to death with umbrella

wednesday, december 3, 2003 posted: 7:42 pm est (0042 gmt).

joella reaves, 11, was beaten to death by her parents, police say.

Descender

How horrible, both of the accounts above make my blood boil. I'm going to have to agree with Mortons that they should have the same treatment administered to them, except I'll go a step further and say keep on till they die.

No need to put them away in prison where they may have a life almost as good or better than the one they already had, watching some TV and getting three square meals a day supplied by our tax dollars. Some crimes, such as the ones above, deserve no leniency. Give those people an execution the same way they executed their kids.

15

Did you ever had any TRUEl Friends in the WTS?

by Rick Aust in

jw
friends

how would you discribe a true friend?

and do you think you ever had any real freinds while you were there?

i think its hard to have a real freind if you need to be careful about everything you say and do.

Descender

Well, if I judge my friendships by the above poem, then the only JW friends I have left are my mother and brother. I can honestly say that I had a few JW's friends that I would have stuck with through thick and thin, but they would have none of it after I was df'd, so I guess that I'll just say they were aquantances and we were drawn together for no other reason other than the fact that we were outcasts in the the real world because of our religion.

As far as friends go, I have my wife and some of my family and my 2 dogs and that's it. I used to be quite the social witness many years ago with friends everywhere and something going on every night and weekend. But those things changed after I got df'd twice, and although I never would have thought it possible, I don't mind not having all those aquantances now. The peace and quite is kind of nice.

34

Should Sexual Offenders Be Detained Even After They've Done Their Time?

by Country Girl in

jw
friends

questions rise over imprisoning sex offenders past their terms

1 hour, 36 minutes ago

add top stories - the new york times to my yahoo!

Descender

If someone ever violently raped my wife, mother, or daughter and I knew who it was, it wouldn't matter if they were drunk or under the influence of drugs when it happened, their body would never be found.

On another note, I notice people always state that the legal age of consent is 18 so I looked it up because I had heard differently many years ago. Check this site out http://www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm - I'm not saying I agree with those ages, but you might be surprised to know what it is in your state or country. The legal age in my state is 17, yours might be 16 or even 14 for males if you live in Iowa, in Chile it's 12 years old. I just found it interesting, I don't think it's widely known information or maybe everyone else knew and I was in the dark.

5

This ever happen to you?

by Descender in

jw
friends

has anyone here ever tried to tread lightly until a certain date just so you won't screw up someone else's event by getting disfellowshipped or speaking your mind and getting shunned?.

i'm just wondering because my brother is planning on marrying a witness girl next spring.

the date is set and he's asked me to be best man.

Descender

My brother was going to have it at the kindom hall, but decided to move it to another location. So no, it won't be at the kingdom hall, even though his fiance's parents think it's sacrelige to have it anywhere else. He didn't tell me the reason that he moved the location, I can guess though.

5

This ever happen to you?

by Descender in

jw
friends

has anyone here ever tried to tread lightly until a certain date just so you won't screw up someone else's event by getting disfellowshipped or speaking your mind and getting shunned?.

i'm just wondering because my brother is planning on marrying a witness girl next spring.

the date is set and he's asked me to be best man.

Descender

Has anyone here ever tried to tread lightly until a certain date just so you won't screw up someone else's event by getting disfellowshipped or speaking your mind and getting shunned?

I'm just wondering because my brother is planning on marrying a witness girl next spring. The date is set and he's asked me to be best man. I don't particularly agree with him getting married the same month he turns 18 to the first girl he ever talked to, but I doubt that will stop him from doing it.

My wife and I aren't disfellowshipped, although we both have been in the past. I've been df'd twice, but we both were reinstated a few years ago so we could get back in good graces with our families. We haven't attended a meeting in 1 1/2 years now. We are shunned by most witnesses, and my brother's fiance shuns us to. She doesn't talk to us unless she has to and just gives us dirty looks most of the time.

I just have to make sure not to speak my mind to any witnesses for another 1/2 a year so I can keep my best man spot and not screw up his wedding by getting df'd or da'ing myself. I just worry that she'll convince him to shun us after the marriage. She doesn't have a hard time pulling his strings and she's a strong witness with a family full of elders and pioneers generations deep, whereas my mother and my brother are the only JW's in my family.

Imagine a big witness wedding. three hundred witnesses attending, most of them being people that I grew up with. And there I am, standing by my brother as best man, shaved bald head and a goatee. The officiating elder was in my judicial commitee twice and basically any elder in a 4 congregation radius has been in a judicial commitee with me at one time or another being the fact I met with 2 sets of elders both times because I filed appeals both times. The reason for my punishment was well known back then, and i'm not liked by that congregation because they think that I was the factor that caused some young ones to reconsider their faith and leave JW land back then.

Anyway, it should be fun to be one of the main focal points to a group of people that try their hardest to avoid me when they see me in public. I wonder if my brother has thought about this.