Posts by Daniel1555

61

Did the flood happen?

by BlackWolf in

so we were talking about noah for our family worship tonight and it ended with a little debate between me and my parents about how the flood was possible.

you know, where did the water come from, how did all the animals fit, etc.

of course it led nowhere and my parents came up with some strange theories like that there was "an expanse of water in the sky" and that's where all the water came from.

Daniel1555

There are many flood myths from all over the earth.

They have their origins in the end of the last ice age 14000 - 8000 years ago.

The sea level worldwide was more than a 100 m lower than today, which gave the people immense living place that no longer exists.

As this huge ice melt, in many places of the earth were catastrophic floods, making the sealevel to rise.

The mesopotamic flood myths (Gilgamesh, Noah and some others) could all be rooted to one of such LOCAL floods.

Scientists Pitman and Ryan found out, that about 8000 years ago, the Black Sea was a freshwater lake. As the Mediterranian sea rose, it broke through the Bosporus and flooded the area 1 year long, creating the black sea, a huge catastrophy for the people living there.

If you look at the hebrew words in the flood account, earth could mean land and mountains could mean hills. So it is not in contradiction to a 'local' flood.

The Watchtower sometimes quotes Flavius Josephus work 'Jewish antiquities' to prove their point.

In 'Jewish Antiquities' Josephus mentions that there were many others who survived the flood.

I have the book in german... so i can't quote it...

In Paragraph 94-95 Josephus mentions other ancient sources who talk of a mountain called Baris where many fled during the flood and survived, one coming in an arc.

In P. 109 Josephus talks about Noahs sons who went down the mountain and convinced many others who were on that mountain to come down with them.

There are so many geological, scientific, historical proof, that there couldn't have been a flood 4400 years ago. Dig a little bit in the web.

Dendrochronology (study of tree rings) has some proof, the study of Ice Cores, Cave Paintings who are 20-40000 years old would have been destroyed in such a flood.

Find out more about Cosquer Cave in France.

At the time that was the tiping point for me... as the only entrance to this cave with magnificent paintings is 40m under sea level... so the human painters must have lived during the ice age when sea level was down, being one of thousands of proofs of human existence more than 6000 years ago.

Cosquer cave also shows that the sea level was not higher than today, as those cave paintings would show signs of salt water if they would have been flooded.

31

Craziest meeting in last 10 years let's compare

by Chook in

hi guys ,i'm new here 27 in 1 year out.. ive escaped 2 judicially by changing congs in rapid escape .i will tell my last dodged bullet.i swear these word as gospel honest.6 years ago in oz i'm in cong only about a year and tensions were running high due to a crazy old european bro ex elder who took no shit from the 10 apostles.i like him i don't know if it was the rebel in me or underdog syndrome but good guy 74years old he was.we just had this big sense the razor were getting sharpened.we arrive at thursday's night meeting my wife was at home so another big boring night i thought,was i wrong.the body has every mongrel breed.the three main characters were the italian dutch german,service committee.we start with song prayer ,the dutchy get up and says we are making adjustments to meeting tonight the arrogant bastard says only bible reading tonight then there agender.dutchy says.what is most amazing is these 10 idiots agreed to this changing of meeting program.

(these words are true)"we have a korah influence in cong and the 10 apostles have established an open judicial committee,the elders said there was evil in our mist .so to root out the evil if anyone has heard a bro say anything against any elders recently the are to report to the three stooges.well dutchy dims light and play the old prehistoric korah movie to the cong ,the bloody creation movie by russell was higher quality.

30 mins later german takes to the stage for the circus to begin.he repeats the dutch mantra ,well the publishers were looking at each other like it was north korea ,could have heard a pin drop,we are all thinking to ourselves we are all guilty of bitchin about the bastards .before meeting had finished halfway thru movie i rang my mate to tell him about "the burning "as the meeting became affectionately known.get home tell wife she don't believe me,within 2 days she believed.it was the talk of area.i had never rang bethel previously because i believed it was heaven and it didn't need my voice.next morning ring service desk in sydney and all i said i was concerned what took place at meeting last night .

Daniel1555

It's weird... but I think your story and writing style are quite funny....

19

Reason's why it is so difficult to leave

by Truthexplorer in

1. concerns about the effects it would have on yours and your family's social life.. 2. fear of being shunned.

3. the stress it will cause.

4. the thought of feeling isolated.

Daniel1555

Mozzie

You can be spiritual but not religious...

31

Craziest meeting in last 10 years let's compare

by Chook in

hi guys ,i'm new here 27 in 1 year out.. ive escaped 2 judicially by changing congs in rapid escape .i will tell my last dodged bullet.i swear these word as gospel honest.6 years ago in oz i'm in cong only about a year and tensions were running high due to a crazy old european bro ex elder who took no shit from the 10 apostles.i like him i don't know if it was the rebel in me or underdog syndrome but good guy 74years old he was.we just had this big sense the razor were getting sharpened.we arrive at thursday's night meeting my wife was at home so another big boring night i thought,was i wrong.the body has every mongrel breed.the three main characters were the italian dutch german,service committee.we start with song prayer ,the dutchy get up and says we are making adjustments to meeting tonight the arrogant bastard says only bible reading tonight then there agender.dutchy says.what is most amazing is these 10 idiots agreed to this changing of meeting program.

(these words are true)"we have a korah influence in cong and the 10 apostles have established an open judicial committee,the elders said there was evil in our mist .so to root out the evil if anyone has heard a bro say anything against any elders recently the are to report to the three stooges.well dutchy dims light and play the old prehistoric korah movie to the cong ,the bloody creation movie by russell was higher quality.

30 mins later german takes to the stage for the circus to begin.he repeats the dutch mantra ,well the publishers were looking at each other like it was north korea ,could have heard a pin drop,we are all thinking to ourselves we are all guilty of bitchin about the bastards .before meeting had finished halfway thru movie i rang my mate to tell him about "the burning "as the meeting became affectionately known.get home tell wife she don't believe me,within 2 days she believed.it was the talk of area.i had never rang bethel previously because i believed it was heaven and it didn't need my voice.next morning ring service desk in sydney and all i said i was concerned what took place at meeting last night .

Daniel1555

When did that happen?

57

Got my JC cancelled... (at least for now)

by Sanchy in

jw
friends

so my wife and i have been in the process of fading for a few months now as per my original post here.

about a week ago, i was browsing some ex-jw facebook groups when i saw a post that linked to the crisis of conscience book.

i said "f@(k it" and hit share on it.. a few hours later, i get a long text letter from my mom (who was a fb friend of mine) telling me the typical "good luck finding friends in the world" and how we have "nothing in common anymore"; basically, it was a 'farewell' text.

Daniel1555

Be prepared to answer the loyalty question "Do you believe the governing body is the from god appointed faithful and discreet slave." They will ask that question in hidden, sinister and different ways.

I was in a similar situation. If you stand your ground and stick to your principles before them, they will finally disfellowship you.

For me it was a liberation and the best thing that could have happened. My family got used to it and my parents and grandparents of my boy have the same loving relationship as before. Of course I lost all JW friends.... but are they really trie friends if they drop you like a piece of shxt? I made new and better friends, which is not so easy but rewarding.

If you get disfellowshipped and your parents lose the contact to you and their grandchild it is entirely their fault.

Anyway I wish it goes as you like it to be.

Good luck.

154

I believe in Evolution and that God created life

by Crabby in

anyone else also hold this view or understand it at least, or do you feel the need to argue that both can in no way coexist?.

Daniel1555

Crabby

I believe the same. It's called theistic evolution.

13

My heart's not in it

by What is Truth? in

jw
friends

you know how when your asked to talk about something your not interested in how annoying it is, or difficult to debate something from the opposite side of your view.

after learning ttatt i've come to regard the nonsense the org spouts as quite evil then to have to give parts about how great it is makes me hate it that much more.. story aside, what might you say to the elders to get them to dismiss it or get off your back if you told them your heart's not in it any more?.

not the obvious it's a stupid hypocritical cult that needs to be wiped from the face of the earth..

Daniel1555

Just tell them, that you will stop doing talks.

If they ask why, you tell them not to worry but those are personal reasons.

If they wanna make a shepherding call you say: "Thanks for your concern; but no, I am fine. If I feel the need for your encouraging shepherding visit, I'll let you know right away."

Don't give the elder power they shouldn't get.

I tell you if you are persistent they can't do anything. They try but if you are persistent, they will leave you. I was an elder before.

23

Reinstated and then fade

by Zeds Dead in

i'm a man - d'fd for 2.5 years now and divorced.

find it hard to date girls out here only due to always having this secret i carry with me that i was once a jw and the thought of telling a girl one day why my family don't acknowledge me as even alive.. recently been thinking of trying to get reinstated and then do a quick fade as i cant go back to the whole jw stuff.. easier said than done and was turned down twice by elders after an immediate attempt 2 years ago.. my motivation for trying would be 1.

) to see if family make contact and 2) play the last hand in their game and give the middle finger.. interested in viewpoints?.

Daniel1555

Don't hesitate to talk openly about your jw past to a trusted person.

Most or nearly all I told were extremely helpful and loving.

17

Low Day For Me Today

by pale.emperor in

hi guys.

it's been about 4 or 5 weeks since i was disfellowshipped.

so far it's been easy, i enjoyed being left alone, no one bothering me, no one telling me i need to do more, need to reach out, questioning why i didnt go on the ministry, and the fact that my ex-wifes family cant talk to me even if they wanted to.

Daniel1555

That's a hard situation, to still attend when your ex and her family are in the same congregation.

Only you know, what is best to do in your situation.

I can tell you what I did. I am also divorced, df'd for apostacy, left alone by all my jw friends, my ex trying to limit my time with my son (3 years) as she said that she always will take him to the meetings, even if it is during my visitation time.

I'd never ever try to get reinstated. If someone is shunning me, it is their problem. However I am glad, that my parents don't shun me.

I slowly made new friends, who don't drop me just because I feel or think differently. I enjoy my free time, no service, no meeting anymore. I do some volunteer work of which I hope my son will be proud of me one day. And most importantly, I fight for my visitation time, I went to court and got the right to be with him every second weekend from Friday till Sunday and shared custody. Also my ex has to accept, that if he is with me, there'll be no Friday and no Sunday meeting for my son.

I celebrate his birthday with him and make it known to him that I don't follow all those crazy JW rules and that there is a world outside of JW life. I try my best to show him a moral way of life that is based on love, compassion, human rights and freedom. I show him tolerance of many different religious views. And I do everything that he has happy moments with me and that he feels loved by me. Love is the greatest weapon to counteract his indoctrination.

But I could never ever pretend to be a JW and hide something in front of my son.

Children are very smart. From an early age they realize when you are pretending something you are not.

If your daughter is older and she realizes your true feelings, I bet that you'll be df'd again.

You could ask yourself:

Would I allow a blood transfusion, if my daughter needed it?

Do I wanna raise my daughter in JW ways, when she is with me during my visitation time?

I was disfellowshipped for those reasons. Because I told them that I would never ever let him bleed to death and because I celebrated his birthday and because I didn't believe that a god of love commanded all those cruel things in the bible and that he never ever would kill innocent children or those who don't believe in him in armaggeddon. I openly told them that their shunning rules are against human rights.

I am happy and proud that I was df'd for those reasons. I am sure one day my son is older will understand and be proud and happy too that I give him a view of a different life than the JW life.

I know that this all and your situation is hard and that sometimes you feel low. But you are courageous and strong and a great daddy for your girl. She'll be proud of you.

12

How do i keep seeing my daughter when she turns 18

by agnosticnow in

hi.i have a 13 year old daughter that i still have for a limited time as she comes to stay about one night a month at present.the law here in australia is on my side in that the australian governments stand is that the child needs regular access to both parents .

i am currently arranging for mediation to have her more often .

her mother can not stand that i am living with another woman and doesn't want her here .

Daniel1555

Don't give up and fight for your time with her.

Shower her with all the love you have. If you have a relationship that is built on love you don't have to worry.

When she is 18 she'll be an adult and can decide for herself how much time she wants to spend with her mum or dad. This can be positive for you.

You'll always be her dad. Be happy about it. You'll have many wonderful moments with her.

Don't speak negative about her mother, in fact speak positive about her.

Give her freedom to decide about different things, also religion.

Let her know that you love her no matter which religion she follows and that she can change her religion a thousand times or even don't follow one.

When she asks why you don't follow the JW faith, you can tell her. Maybe you can let her know about the Australian Royal Commission cases. Or recommend her to research herself about her faith.

Maybe at the right moment you could also talk to her about your fear, that she might shun you. Show her how shunning is against the UN declaration of human rights and that these ethical values are so important for human life.

But don't force your views on her.

I am in a similar situation. I also had to fight for my time with my son. The judge decided that I can be twice every second weekend for 2.5 days with him. He is nearly 4 years old now.

The poster "Driving Force" has great advice for you, as he also has a teenage daughter.

I wish you all the best.