Some people are arrogant and jerks, and blow hards. That is life, that is why I do not trust anyone, anything or any organization unless I have proven it for myself. Don't be shocked, you sound like Witnesses do when they seem shocked that Witnesses lie to them. People lie a lot.
Why do apostates lie about where they get their information?
by slimboyfat 73 Replies latest jw friends
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TowerWatch
So why then the perennial insistence by so many apostates (such as is clearly the case with the Townsends) that all the problems in Watchtower history and chronology and history you spotted yourself, and never borrowed any of it from apostates or opposers? Why not just admit you read Jonsson and that that is where you convinced that the Witness chronology is wrong for this or that reason? Why not admit it was apostate literature that alerted you to the Kingdom Ministry that commened people for selling their homes before 1975. and so on? I have seen it so often from apostates that they really want to hide the fact that they got their new ideas from apostate literature. They are desperate to pretend that every point against the Watchtower they thought up themselves, every damning quote from 1906 - no matter how incredible that they actually sourced it themselves - they are adamant they found it through their own "research"? Why is this? Why not come clean and admit that you read some apostate literature and that is where you got the quotes and were alterted to the discrepancies? Where is the shame in that? I think it would be in the interest of all concerned.
Why are you making such a big noise about the avenue of research used?
Can you say "Smoke Screen"?
Cal
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Effervescent
they are adamant they found it through their own "research"?
I'm not sure I understand the problem in stating this. Doesn't research often entail reading a variety of sources and using them all to come up with an educated opinion or response? Where in the term "research" do you read- "Using only WT publications come up with an entirely new viewpoint that no one has ever thought of before"?
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restrangled
Slimboyfat
Why not admit it was apostate literature that alerted you to the Kingdom Ministry that commened people for selling their homes before 1975. and so on? I have seen it so often from apostates that they really want to hide the fact that they got their new ideas from apostate literature. They are desperate to pretend that every point against the Watchtower they thought up themselves, every damning quote from 1906 - no matter how incredible that they actually sourced it themselves
Because the witnesses have no idea themselves of their own history or literature. They know the latest study article for Sunday and Tuesday nights lesson......thats it. They also have been taught the word apostate is the devil personified.
If you reveal your sources it is instantly shot to hell because it came from satan himself.
2 cases in point with my own mother. When I mentioned the UN business, which she had never heard of, her instant response was, if you got that from an apostate website it's baloney. I had to tell her no, I went straight to the UN's own website.....She then was open to discussion and was upset the WBTS had done such a thing.
The second case in point is the Pyramid calculations by Russel. Again the denial and it must be from apostates statement. She happened to have the books in her library and my husband made her pull them out and read for herself. She then laughed at what she read and said "ignore anything the WBTS puts in print.".....still unable to admit to a life time of devotion to this orginization has been a lie.
The point being if it comes from apostates, they are lieing, certainly not thier beloved Governing body.
r.
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Honesty
Slimboyfat, I found in my personal research that the Watchtower Society and I no longer have anything in common.
I didn't borrow this from anyone else.
I discovered it merely by observing the hypocrisy and arrogance of JW's.
I learned about most of the Watchtower Society's history from the internet because the charlatans and thieves who comprise the Governing Body have a lot to lose if they ever admitted the truth about the cult's history.
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truthsearcher
Slim boy fat: You have learned how to push some buttons on this site, lol
In my research to try and help the JWs who come to my house to discuss doctrine, I have used my Bible, their Bible, the KIT, some old WT books and mags, and some websites that they would call "apostate". I have wondered what I would say if they ever asked, "where did you get this information?" As a Christian, I have a moral dilemna with their "theocratic warfare" approach and so I wouldn't want to use that approach myself (i.e. lie about it). So, we have stuck to discussing things from the Bible so I wouldn't have to answer about sources. I know that if they thought that I was frequenting apostate info, they would label me as being demonized and refuse to return. However, in my mind, the WT is apostate because they have left orthodox Christianity.
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carla
What does it matter where the info came from in the first place? If one truly cared more about truth than an organization it wouldn't matter, truth is not something most jw's can deal with. They must villify the source rather than look at the information. That is easy to do, it is much harder to examine their own beliefs and try to defend all the flip flops, ungodly behavior, ungodly doctrines, scandals, and so on.
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Arthur
Another very important point that I forgot to mention was that most Kingdom Halls do not have any of the writings of Russell or Rutheford in their libraries because the information contained is so outdated and erroneous. These works are not even reprinted by the Society; as such works would be a source of considerable embarrassment. Simply put; the Society DOES NOT want Witnesses to read these publications. It was only be going to sites like freeminds.org, and others that I was able to find the resources necessary to locate these publications.
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blondie
I never had to have someone point out the ridiculous statements and deceptive statements the WTS has made. I was alive when many of them were said and I wondered "how can they say that." I started reading the 1917 Finished Mystery and wondered, how could they say this. As I read the other six volumes of the Studies in the Scriptures, how could they say this. As I read in the WT publications that they had taught that Christ's presence started in 1874 but in 1993 read:
*** w93 1/15 p. 5 ‘Caught Away to Meet the Lord’—How? ***
The Watchtower has consistently presented evidence to honesthearted students of Bible prophecy that Jesus’ presence in heavenly Kingdom power began in 1914.
I wondered, how could they say that. As I read Rutherford's books regarding 1925 and how Abraham, Isaac, David, etc., were to be resurrected as perfect men to rule on earth as princes in Jerusalem over mankind, I now understood my family's stories about how everyone expected Abraham to be at that convention in the early 1950's.
What I didn't live through, my family did and related to me. I didn't need the internet to find these things out. All I needed was my library, with WT publications that went back to almost 1879. All I needed was the Proclaimers book. All I needed was the WT-CD to wonder, how could they say that?
Blondie
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Satanus
Some people are just cringey, i guess. Or, maybe it's a fake cringe in order to look puritanical, or pharisaical.
S