If Jesus could talk to Satan...

by AuldSoul 62 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  AuldSoul

  metaspy,

  I thank you for the intriguing discussion.

  I am enjoying the discussion, as well. Makes me glad I brought the subject up.

  I will probably just do my own research.

  I wholeheartedly encourage in that pursuit. However, when referring to what may or may not get you disfellowshipped/announced as disassociated you will not find a complete list in the publications available to publishers/pioneers/ministerial servants/bible students.

  Some might say this is tantamount to encouraging one to enter into a relationship with an organization prior to being allowed to read the terms of the agreement. I would agree with those who think that way.

  Others might offer the explanation that there is no need to know everything that might get you in trouble if you are wanting to do what's right. They would have a valid point if "what's right" is determined solely by a standard they have available to them. For instance, if "what's right" is determined by the laws of the United States of America, then by my state, then by my county, then by my city I can fairly be held accountable to a standard of "what's right" because I have the law code available for my review.

  Therefore, if the organized religion that labeled itself "Jehovah's Witnesses" had a standard that was available for all to review, it would be okay for anyone who willingly claimed to adopt that standard to be held to that standard. It would not be unfair.

  I cannot, however, find any grounds on which a nebulous standard that can change circumstantially or on a moment's notice should be fairly used to judge the righteousness of someone. Since, as you have expressed, not all the teachings and standards are based on the Bible, the humans on whose opinion the standards and teachings are based need only change their minds for what was righteous to be declared unrighteous, for light to be declared darkness, for good to be changed to bad, to call sour sweet.

  I think there was a Scripture along those lines ... as I recollect, God wasn't happy with those who allowed themselves that latitude.

  If you use their list, then there isn't an earthly organization.

  You reached the same conclusion as did one they labeled an "apostate" because of it. The non-disassociation letter I wrote cited point # 3 as the basis for my decision and cited several specific undeniable examples. I left it up to them whether to accept my letter as a sheep that they didn't save or whether to accept it as a disassociation letter.

  But, when examining a religion can you not even fairly apply the test of the standards they impose on other religions? If not, why not? Apparently, in my case, the application of their own standards to their religion is cause for God to everlastingly cast me aside.

  My God is not so small.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
• 

  AuldSoul

  IronClaw,

  The religion specifically forbids any spiritual/scriptural discussion with one who is disfellowshipped/disassociated. The Bible does not. This is simply another of the many examples of their doctrine directly contradicting Scripture.

  Peter said we should follow the steps of Jesus closely. Paul said, "Become imitators of me as I am of the Christ."

  In the case of Jesus, he responded to Satan—a known apostate—with Scriptural answers to Satan's requests. He did not consider himself casting pearls before swine or any other self-aggrandizing tripe that JWs might forgive themselves on the basis of.

  In the case of Paul, he apparently tried to salvage Hymenaeus(, Alexander?), and Philetus but eventually gave them up to Satan. He encouraged Timothy to "divide the word of truth aright" in combatting their false doctrine. He publicly made known what doctrine they were teaching, he did not conceal it behind ambiguous accusations of "lies and half-truths" as the Watchtower Society does with those they label "apostates". He was able, with reasoning and Scripture, to refute their teaching.

  Nowhere in the Bible is there a penalty outlined for those who chose to talk with Hymenaeus, Philetus, Alexander, or Nicholaus.

  But this obscene organization I grew up in presumes to level the ultimate punishment the Pharisees had available to them under the Roman Governorship of Pontius Pilate, a third degree expulsion from the synagogue (heb. shammata). An instance of this punishment, and Jesus' reaction to it, is found in John 9. This was considered the nearest equivalent to the death sentence, and disfellowshipping has been so compared by the Watchtower Society. Such severity from a self-advertised "loving organization" is at best disturbing.

  On the other hand, they make a big to-do about their abstinence from war—possibly by remote extension an evidence of love among themselves. All the while killing their brothers and sisters by destroying reputations, destroying families, and destroying livelihoods in private (study the nighttime trial of Jesus in their publications) trials held in secret where unscriptural standards of guilt and innocence are applied as though these human ideas are God's divine judgment.

  And on top of it all they claim to be Witnesses for Him?

  It's disgusting.

  I hope things are going well with your family. I will PM you my new phone number after we get situated in Pennsylvania.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
• 

  IronClaw

  I hope things are going well with your family. I will PM you my new phone number after we get situated in Pennsylvania.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul

  I cant wait. We will be neighbors. Maybe we can hook up and have a beer or two.

  The Claw