Is Jesus becoming less relevant - even to Christians?

by nicolaou 53 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  tetrapod.sapien

  hi RAF,

  indeed i agree with you that we can all believe what we like. my criticism of christianity isn't anything personal with you.

  do you think I'm stupid?

  of course not. i only challenge people that i think are up to the task. some days i let challenges go unsaid because i am lazy. and other days i say them because i think they need to be voiced.

  i like your style, and a lot of the thoughts you put together on this board.

  and you have every right to challenge me, and also believe whatever you like. don't worry about it! it's cool. :)

  have a nice night.

  tetra
• 

  Cellist

  I think Jesus will become less relevant as more people begin to realize that the Adam and Eve story is a myth. You don't need a "ransom sacrifice" if there's no original sin.
  
  Cellist
• 

  RAF

  ;-))) read you soon Tetra
• 

  Narkissos

  In order to raise one man to a pinnacle of holiness requires lowering the entire rest of the universe. This is a very high price to pay for a personal little deity

  Very insightful remark JamesThomas.

  But perhaps this is how realisation itself works. Arbitrarily singling out and focusing on one particular yet somehow exemplary figure, or fate -- the icon, the hero, etc.

  Think of media coverage, of disasters and celebrities for instance: one recognised voice speaks louder than anonymous millions; one famous tear moves more than rivers of blood. Consciousness drowns in quantity. It needs to zoom in on a particular face -- even an artificial one, as in myth or fiction.

  In the deepest teachings of Christianity the contemplation of the Christ icon is meant to change your way of looking at everyone and everything -- including your own "self".
• 

  abbagail

  Re: Is Jesus becoming less relevant - even to Christians?
  
  Of course not, not to "real" Christians (and I do NOT mean that in a JW/WT-sort of way).
  
  However, there is a huge spread of "New Age" Christian churches -- if you can even call them that -- who are not only replacing the Jesus/the Bible and everything to do with it, in favor of new age practices and other mystical spirituality "experiences." Having "experiences" are the big thing in the New-Age-Flavored churches these days...
  
  Then there are the "seeker sensitive" churches who all they care about is big splash and flash... big business, big bucks, big government, big mega churches that are more like carnivals... such as Saddleback and Willowcreek, to name two...
  
  Then there is the Charismania crowd, churches who all they seem to care about and talk about is the Holy Spirit, as if Jesus was somewhere on the back burner.
  
  Then there are the old-time mainstream denominations like Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, etc. who also have booted Jesus and the Word out the window in favor of whatever THEY think is more appropriate. These guys have been in the news frequently about these things the past few years. It's a real nose dive all around...
  
  And last but not least, the infamous Catholic Church, and like the WT, Jesus was never really important to them in the first place. Nope, the RCC has Mary as their Number One goddess...
  
  But none of this is a surprise considering that the Lord said that when he returned, would he really find any faith left on the earth? So look for more and more -- or I should say Less and Less -- of the Lord Jesus Christ being the prominent person in churches.
  
  /ag
• 

  Clam

  As time meanders onwards, will Jesus still be relevant in the year 3000?

  Without intending to be facetious I can't see the planet surviving to the year 3,000. Until then I've no doubt that Jesus, Mohammed, The Buddha, Granth Sahib and all the other big hitters will continue to enjoy popularity and relevance. Jesus in particular is so many things to so many people. The Jehovah's Witnesses however will die out. They're just a stale brand. How many centuries can you go on talking about living "in the last days?"

  R. McGeddon
• 

  LittleToe

  abbagail:

  Then there are the old-time mainstream denominations like Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, etc. who also have booted Jesus and the Word out the window in favor of whatever THEY think is more appropriate.

  Huh? Man-alive, that's some huge broad-brushstroke generalisation. Speak for Florida, by all means, but keep in mind that there's a wider world out there, one that extends beyond the US shores. Are you making such statements from personal experience or hearsay?

  I attend a Presbyterian church in Scotland and I can assure you that throwing out "Jesus and the Word" is far from true. Nor have I seen that to be the case in the churches that I've attended in the USA (including Presbyterian, Lutheran, Baptist, Bible Church, Non-Denominational, etc.), albeit the theological content of the sermons Stateside seems to be lower.
• 

  nicolaou

  Nark: insightful as ever. jesus reinvented and revisited makes a lot of sense and is not necessarily a bad thing, it just depends on who is reinventing him and for what purpose.

  Tetra on Jesus: . . . "he was nothing special as i am nothing special. he was special as i am special. sacrilegious? if it is, then my only question is: WHY?"

  Couldn't agree more and if it isn't the height of arrogance and hubris I'd say the same reasoning extends to the almighty himself. It isn't 'Him' that defines what is good or bad - you and I do. It isn't 'Him' that will provide for our futures, feed the hungry, cure diseases and fight injustice - you and I will do that. 'He' isn't god - you are and I am!

  Of course, we can also 'be' the Devil.

  DD: What is self-righteousness? You appear to condemn it but in the absence of a belief in Christ wouldn't you at least prefer atheists and others to behave with a form of morality and civility which, while it may be godless, is at least edifying and conducive to peaceful living? I certainly don't pour scorn on good people living a christian life by insinuating that theirs is just a placebo-righteousness or hero-righteousness. As I said in my opening comments, "it's what people do that matters!"

  JT: As with Nark and Tetra, I am finding so little to disagree with in your posts and much to learn. Thanks.

  LT: I don't go to church of course and I hope I didn't come off as disparaging any who do. My opening post was actually in the form of a question - not an assertion. "Is Jesus simply becoming a vehicle for this moral education?"

  If that is not the case I am happy to hear about it. But, for example, todays edition of The Telegraph reports;

  "John Lennon once enraged Christians by claiming that the Beatles were bigger than Jesus. The Church of England is now recognising the pulling power of rock stars by recruiting Bono, the singer and lyricist of U2, in its bid to boost congregations." -full story

  I know that there are millions of very commited, sincere and knowledgable Christians like yourself Ross but surely you must acknowledge that most native Brit's who entered 'christian' into their census form only did so out of inertia and a sense of group identity?
• 

  Narkissos

  Nic

  'He' isn't god - you are and I am!

  Just notice that such a statement only makes sense on the (cultural-religious-literary) background of a pre-existing "god" notion and story.

  Same with "Christ," doubtless a bit easier as he is explicitly a god-man character.
• 

  nicolaou

  agreed