Are JW's generally better than average people?

by JH 299 Replies latest jw friends

  • Open mind
    Open mind

    Rosalee said:

    TopHat asked if they would still be rejected for not believing in the WTS teachings.
    I simply cleared this up by saying one must adhere to Bible teachings.

    Rosalee, what you did not clear up was the pretty clear implication that "WTS teachings" & "Bible teachings" are not one and the same.

    For example, I'd like to know, do you believe this "Bible teaching"? :

    The trumpet blasts of Revelation Chapter 8, written about 1900 yrs ago. According to the Revelation Climax Book, (current light that we're studying right now) John was prophetically writing about "lectures" that were going to be heard by a few thousand attendees at conventions of a tiny Christian sect in the 1930s.

    At a gut level and a brain level that so-called "Bible Teaching" appears ludicrous to me. Now, if I go to the elders and say, "Brothers, I believe Jehovah is directing the F&D slave and I don't have a problem with anything, except for these trumpet blasts. I just can't believe that they are the fulfillment of Rev. Chapter 8. I've researched it. I've prayed about. And it just doesn't make sense to me." If I don't back down on my doubt, I will be disfellowshipped and, ultimately, slaughtered by my loving God at Armageddon because I didn't buy the trumpet blast thingey.

    FYI, I'm currently an active JW and staying that way for family purposes. But if ever decide to go public and get disfellowshipped, I think this is how I'll get myself booted out. How ridiculous will that look to "worldly" family and work associates?

    Open Mind

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    Back on topic-

    JW's ARE average people, then they get sucked into a warped cult and
    often become warped people. Before you flame me, I WAS a warped
    person. But I'm much better now.

  • carla
    carla

    Rosalee,

    I am not exagerating as my husband admits that is exactly the way it went down. His flip flopping nature since joining this destructive deadly cult has also admitted it was wrong for them to suggest lying to me. Somedays he says he would do the same thing in their shoes, encourage someone to lie to their spouse so they could go to jw related functions. Is this a jw policy? Maybe you need to check your Aid book and look up the definition of lying according to the org. Do average non jw folks think lying to a spouse is a good idea? None I have run into. Do average non jw folks think it is godly or Christian to do so or suggest other do so? None that I know. Therefore I conclude that jw's are NOT generally better than the average person, not by a long shot.

  • Rosalee
    Rosalee

    Well,Carla, I think you have to admit, you have a unique situation.

    I've never heard ANY Witness talk as you have described.

    Never heard of any Witness telling anyone they should lie, either.

    Based on my experiences, JWs are a cut above the average person.

  • Rosalee
    Rosalee

    flipper:

    That dear lady you described sounds just like my (Irish) aunt Rose. Yes, I agree she sounds like a jewel and who are any of us to decide hers or anyone elses worth. My only point is that generally speaking, I find JWs above average in many ways.

  • 144001
    144001
    Having read quite a few threads on this site, I'd have to say JWs ARE generally better than most who post here. -- Rosalee

    Better at what? Acting like robots and kissing butt to a corporation that mentally enslaves them and exploits them for profit? I notice that you referenced your claim as being mandatory; "I'd have to say," which is another indication fhat you are another pigeon whose brain is owned by the Watchtower.

    As for the mental health issue mentioned in a few posts, I would suggest some of you get some help yourselves, never mind accusing others. But I suppose if any of you have mental problems, you know who to blame???

    Nice attempt at refuting facts, Rosalee, but studies of the mental health of Jehovah's Witnesses demonstrate that the mental illness rate among Jehovah's Witnesses is at least 4 times higher than that of the general population. Dr. Jerry Bergman has done an excellent job of assembling such studies and providing a neutral analysis of them in his book, "Jehovahs Witnesses and the Problem of Mental Illness," Witness; New edition (December 1992). I would recommend this book to you, except that I know you'd never read it.

    As for the "blame" for the high rate of mental illness among Jehovah's Witnesses, it's unclear whether such higher than normal rate of mental illness is caused by the religion itself or whether the religion has a tendency to attract those who are mentally ill. Dr. Bergman concludes that the teachings/lifestyle of the religion and the tendency for this organization to attract those who are mentally ill or are likely to become mentally ill are both factors contributing to the higher than average rate of mental illness among Jehovah's Witnesses.

    Blame lies on those who profit from the exploitation of the minds of others; i.e., the Watchtower and its myriad of legal entities.

    JWs do not say people are evil and wicked. This system of things is.

    Rosalee, who are you trying to fool with your lies? JWs are constantly labeling others as "evil and wicked," as well as this "system of things." You're going to have to work harder to deceive this group.

    Just as in the days of Noah. Most people then weren't wicked or evil. They lived ordinary lives. What they did not do was worship Jehovah. Mostly, today it is the same.

    It's nice that you believe in the fiction that is the bible. The account of Noah is a good example of the fictional nature of the bible. If: [1] evolution is a myth; and [2] Noah put 2 of each species of animal on the yacht he spent his life building, it must have been a hell of a boat. There are over 500,000 species in South America alone. So, Noah had 1,000,000 animals just from South America, not counting Africa? That must have been a yacht that would have made Paul Allen envious. But one question; which son was unlucky enough to earn the job of cleaning up the excrement and urine produced by these animals?

    Most people I talk to have absolutely NO interest in the Bible, any religion and could care less what the will of God is. In the 20-40 age group, many have never been in a church (barring weddings and funerals). They are quite happy doing their own will.

    That means that "most people [you] talk to" have no need to devote their lives to a book that is entirely lacking in foundation. The bible is the work of man, and there is absolutely no evidence to suggest that a god exists or that the bible is the word of such god. Indeed, society does attain a higher consciousness over time, so we can expect the bible to finally assume it's proper position in our world, that of a fictional work.

    The people I am talking about who have no interest in any religion are neighbors and co workers. Mainly, everyone just wants to get along and not be bothered by anything that is in any way controversial.

    Wanting to get along is certainly a horrible desire, isn't it? It's a good thing the Jehovah's Witnesses don't have such a desire. In my experience, acrimony is pervasive among JW families. Getting along must be "demonic," right?

    In the past, I'd say exactly what someone said but with a few extra thoughts and claim it was exactly what I heard them say.

    Your dishonesty is not unique among Jehovah's Witnesses. Such dishonesty is quite common among the Jehovah's Witnesses I'm acquainted with.

    OnTheWayOUt:: From your name I surmise you are still attending? That being the case, you know that all df'd and da'd ones are being welcomed back. Recent articles point to this as I'm sure you are aware.

    "Welcomed back?" You have a strange concept of what "welcomed back" means. Reinstatement hardly qualifies as being "welcomed back," unless you consider the subhuman treatment accorded those seeking reinstatement (e.g., sit in the back, be shunned by everyone, no "privileges," etc.) to be a desirable and happy experience.

    TopHat asked if they would still be rejected for not believing in the WTS teachings.

    I simply cleared this up by saying one must adhere to Bible teachings.

    Evasiveness such as that you've exhibited here is common to those who have something to hide, Rosalee. You're fooling no one in this forum, but you're likely fooling the circuit overseer and elders in your area as you count your time spent on your futile endeavors in this forum.

    Based on my experiences, JWs are a cut above the average person.

    Well, given your admission that you have been dishonest in the past, there's no reason for anyone here to accord any credibility to your statements. In my experience, JWs are nutcases and your cult is a cauldron of mental illness. Enjoy your life, Rosalee, instead of spending it in a futile effort to convert others to your delusional beliefs.

  • journey-on
    journey-on
    Evasiveness such as that you've exhibited here is common to those who have something to hide, Rosalee. You're fooling no one in this forum, but you're likely fooling the circuit overseer and elders in your area as you count your time spent on your futile endeavors in this forum.

    I didn't think about this one! I'm sure Rosalee is doing exactly that. The only difference in this type of witnessing and going door to door is it's more fun!

  • carla
    carla

    I wish I were a unique story. I have heard similar experiences from other so called unbelieving mates. As for lying, once again I suggest you familiarize yourself with watchtower literature on the subject. Google is your friend, use it.

    A cut above the rest of society? oh please! you are woefully unaware of the deaths, suicides, sexual abuses, physical abuses, spiritual abuses and emotional abuses that the wt is guilty of. And like most jw's because you prefer to keep your head in the sand about all of the abuses you say 'because I haven't seen it myself it doesn't exist'. Instead you condone and support all the abuses. Then jw's wonder why people don't care for their 'unique' teachings.

    If jw's turned out superior humans then why so many cries from all over the world about the abuses and wrecked families? Why so many cries from 'unbelieving' families that complain of the abandonment of family that the wt supports? Do jw's abandon their non jw families? With all the time requirements the jw's put upon their members how do they have time for family? I know, I know, if you would join then you would see your jw! and all would be happy. My idea of spending time with family is not sitting with non thinkers listening to false doctrines for over 2 hours every other day. That is not spending time. As a jw you may not know what a real family is like. A real family knows what is going on family members lives and actually cares, a real family spends time together in mutally enjoyable activities, a real fam can... oh forget it,you will never understand because jw's have such abnormal lives they cannot even comprehend life for so called 'worldlies'. And yes, I can say these things because I have lived both sides now. The pre jw life was far superior in every way, shape and form.

  • restrangled
    restrangled

    That dear lady you described sounds just like my (Irish) aunt Rose. Yes, I agree she sounds like a jewel and who are any of us to decide hers or anyone elses worth. My only point is that generally speaking, I find JWs above average in many ways.

    Who are any of us to decide anyones worth??? Then why do you follow the most blood thirsty cult this world has ever seen in condeming 99.9% of the world's population???

    Oh let me guess...because you too are a cut above....

    What a crock of BS. It reminds me of the lyrics to a Steely Dan song "you've been telling me you're a genius since you've been seventeen...in all this time I've known you, I still don't know what you mean."

    r's hubby

  • Rosalee
    Rosalee

    carla:

    I have lived both ways too, more so than you because you are not a JW now, but the spouse of one.

    For a long time I had no religion. Now I do. I prefer now. It has true meaning. I also have family who are JWs and some who are not. I love them all equally. The ones who share my beliefs have more in common with me, thus more to talk about, but that does not exclude the others. So I do know what you are talking about. I just see it from a new perspective.

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