I've been studying with JW's for a few months..

by MichaelM 101 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  jgnat

  I despise a religion that makes a man weak. You realize your study leader is predicting your failure, don't you? That he hopes you are too weak to make it on your own?

  But I sense you are coming in to your own and you won't feel the need to go back.

  By the way, the Witnesses have an explanation for "failed" bible studies, too. They call them "goats".

  Do you think you could go out to a cabin with a bunch of Witnesses, enjoy hanging out, and when they ask you if you've ever experienced anything as good and wholesome, say "Why, yes, I have," shake all their hands and thank them for a great time, and then go on with your own life?

  I hang out with Witnesses on occassion, as my husband is one. They don't have cooties. I'm extremely adverse to their conversion attempts, though. Their usual opening gambit, how "Bad the world is becoming," I shoot down with flaming examples of good in our world. If they slide in to cult-language, I'll call them on it. I fielded a rather insulting comment the last time a pioneer sister tried to engage me,

  "Are your children in the truth?"

  "What is truth?" I asked.

  "I mean, are your children Witnesses."

  "No, they were never witnesses. What does that have to do with the truth?"

  "Well, I mean, you seem to know so much...."

  But, if they stick to non-religious topics like children, the weather, hobbies, we get along just fine.
• 

  greendawn

  If you are seeking a spiritual guide, a kind of father figure as you say to structure life there are lots of mainsteram religions that can offer that, you don't have to rely on cultic organisations like the JWs to find it. The JWs will count you as a failure if you don't become one of them, their "love" is very conditional.
• 

  eclipse

  Hahahaha, good one, jgnat!

  Last time I went to a kingdom hall for a family event, I was asked by a JW who knew me, ''what hall are you in now?''

  I replied, "I don't go anymore.''

  ''ohhhh, that's a shame, I'm so sorry that you have lost the truth''....

  me - ''Don't feel sorry for me, I am very happy with my life now''

  and they have no idea what to say to that, they walk away with thisexpression on their face.

  Michael, I hope you come back to this thread and let us know what happened....
• 

  LiveLife

  That I should trust Jehovah God and his Organization instead of my own heart.

  They can show you in the Bible that you should trust God. But they put a rider on it that is totally unscriptural. They have no Scripture to show you as to why you must trust an organization.

  They will tell you that the Faithful and Discreet Slave is an organization, but they have no Scripture to show you to prove it.

  They will tell you that there was prophesied "an administration" that would appear at the fullness of days, and they will tell you that we are living during the fullness of days. But, they have no proof that this "administration" was to be earthly.

  However, there are Scriptures showing that the Faithful Slave can become the Wicked Slave. How could you ever be expected to put complete confidence in a Slave that could become evil? (Matthew 24:45-51)

  There are Scriptures showing that there is a heavenly administration that affects the earth. But it it is administered by Jesus, through Holy Spirit. (John 14; 16; 1 John 2:26-29)

  1 John 2:26-29—These things I write YOU about those who are trying to mislead YOU. And as for YOU, the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU, and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU; but, as the anointing from him is teaching YOU about all things, and is true and is no lie, and just as it has taught YOU, remain in union with him. So now, little children, remain in union with him, that when he is made manifest we may have freeness of speech and not be shamed away from him at his presence. If YOU know that he is righteous, YOU gain the knowledge that everyone who practices righteousness has been born from him.

  Even in the New World Translation it is easy to see that they take from the Holy Spirit a role that belongs to no other. Once someone was born of spirit they did not need another person to be teaching them.

  They will teach you to spend your time and energy serving an earthly organization when you could choose to
  —Live Life
• 

  Sunspot

  "I'm really afraid to tell to his face what I'm thinking. I've broken down the issue. "

  And don't you think he is COUNTING ON THIS??? He knows you have many questions, and he is doing his level best to bring you around to the "Watchtower--Way" of thinking and reasoning. THIS is what got ME into THE biggest and worst mistake I have ever made in my 65 years!

  "If I stray away and do my own thing, i'll fall back into my confusing life that I have trouble taking order to simply because I just don't have that feeling of "structure" like I keep saying to myself. I'm thinking now though.."

  BUT---at least you will making YOUR decisions about your spirituality and how YOU wish to demonstrate it---YOUR WAY! If you get in any further...you WILL be parroting only the WTS opinions and peculiar teachings without EVER being able to ask "why".

  "I was told by the Witnesses to not trust my own heart. Because my heart is one of the strongest weaknesses that I have because we are imperfect and have inhereted sin. That I should trust Jehovah God and his Organization instead of my own heart. "

  TYPICAL JW RESPONSE!!! It means nothing...but they KNOW that much of their stuff sounds hokey to you, and they want YOU to ignore that, and "go with it" by allowing the WTS to think FOR you.

  They are NOT "run" by Jehovah....they are NOT his" organization! It is all hype and nonsense! Jesus never once directed HIS FOLLOWERS to find an organization, identify it, and follow IT. The only church that was formed WAS Christianity! (" So for a whole year Barnabas and Saul met with the church and taught great numbers of people. The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch. Acts 11:26") They were NOT called Jehovah's Witnesses! MEN have dreamed up the Watchtower Society and dreamed up EVERYTHING they claim to BE as well.

  They have successfully cob-jobbed a bunch of scriptures, twisted those to "fit" their teachings, strung them together.....and now teach them as "present truths" from God. Why do you think they have to keep changing their doctrines? They are complete frauds, and will pull YOU away from the Christ they claim to follow. Do NOT listen to your "buddy" (who will drop you like a pulled hand grenade if you decide to stop studying the WTS bible aids) and your "friendship" will also be contingent ONLY on your willingness to CONTINUE ON with your "study" of these aids. See how long he will "be your buddy" if you do not.

  I cannot stress this enough---to QUIT NOW and pray as you have never prayed before. All you need to do is to put your faith in JESUS as He invited us to, and ask HIM to come into your heart and into your life to give you the needed strength to push these clever and deceitful people AWAY from you! You can be assured that the PROMISED helper...the Holy Spirit---will teach you all that you need to learn.

  hugs,

  Annie
• 

  Hoping4Change

  By the way, the Witnesses have an explanation for "failed" bible studies, too. They call them "goats".

  jgnat - Do you have a reference/scan for this? I am curious to see for myself how I am sure they would regard me if I ever indulged them in an 'official' study. Thx!
• 

  poppers

  There is a basic fallacy in using logic to prove anything about "god" and what he/she/it requires, and it is this: logic is of the mind; whatever "god" is is transcendent to the mind. To accept some logical argument is to remain fixed in the mind. There will always be a counter argument to whatever is presented and you will remain as ignorant as ever. The only thing you will be sure of is what you BELIEVE. Now, is that any basis for determining what's ultimately true? Or is it more "reasonable", for lack of a better way of putting it, to see for YOURSELF what lies beyond the mind?
• 

  Quandry

  Welcome to the forum. I know everyone is giving advice left and right, and I don't want to weigh you down more.

  Just suffice it to say that we all want you to slooooow doooown. You don't have to make any decisions today or tomorrow. The Witnesses want you to think that the world is going to end in the next three days if not sooner. My husband and I were "in" for over thirty years and stayed stressed all the time thinking that we were at the end of the end of the end of this system. Of course, then we found out that the first president of the WTS thought that the end would be here in the late 1800s at first, then changed the date many times.

  Well, anyway, you seem young and a bit inexperienced. The study conductor, on the other hand, exudes confidence and experienc. He speaks with authority.

  The thing that will combat this is education. Educate yourself on the Bible and the history of the Watch Tower Society. Many websites have WT quotes from days past. Education is a very good thing. If you have not started college, perhaps you could do this. This will really help you to be able to think for yourself and give you confidence.

  There is never any harm in asking questions. This man will eventually tire of them. Tell him you must be sure before you make any decisions. This is important. You mentioned that your sister is a witness. You risk her never speaking to you again if you become baptised and then decide to change your mind. So, sloooooow doooown.
• 

  MichaelM

  Ahh, I dunno where to start now.. the responding posts were great, especially sunspot that was really uplifting *smiles*. Again the help is wonderful.. I don't have much to say today.. Perhaps i'll just go along my merry way for now.. I'll update this topic if I have any more interesting talk with Russ or do go to his bonfire thing hes planning at his cabin. Catcha guys later.. I'm gonna get back to reading the New Testament.

  Thats another thing... I can't remember why, because I don't think I asked.. but They say "Hebrew Scriptures" and "Greek Scriptures" and they do not call them Old Testament and New Testament. I found that kind of strange.
• 

  5go

  Thats another thing... I can't remember why, because I don't think I asked.. but They say "Hebrew Scriptures" and "Greek Scriptures" and they do not call them Old Testament and New Testament. I found that kind of strange.

  It is a inside thing that sort of evolved some still do call them old and new. The watchtower pubs though tend to shy away from saying old or new in order to look smart and diffrent.

  My opinion on it.