He said he would never give me advice again, since I, like his two-ex-wives, never want to follow it andI have to learn things the hard way.
Looks like he is right.
Hello.
by emilyblue 61 Replies latest social relationships
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ex-nj-jw
Emilyblue,
This guy is trying to control you and it seems like you are allowing him to! You are a grown A** woman, you do not have to bend to his wishes!! GRAB A HOLD OF YOURSELF! AND DO NOT ALLOW HIM TO MAKE YOU FEEL BAD!
Sorry, This infuriates me! He is using you to make himself feel better. Run away, stay away. The JW organization has no use for women. Women are second class and you better be willing to submitt and let him rule the roost. You are to be seen and not heard.
Please get away from this man, you seem to be a very sweet person, maybe even a little naive. Get away from him.
nj
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Sarah Smiles
Everyone is writing the truth! but it is your heart!
I wish you the best! I do not want to see you get hurt!
But it sounds like your already hurt! and it probably does not feel very good right now!
You are thinking with your heart, and not with your head!
but I do wish you the best! Come on J.W. do not believe in going to places like what you described.
Did it bother you that he even mentioned the bill?
Here is a book: Women Who Love Too Much! It is an old book but it will help you!
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sparrow
I got nothing to say becauwes everyone has said it. I just wanted to add...
NEVER ENTER A REALTIONSHIP WITH SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T LOVE A GOOD POO JOKE!!!!!!
<-- me taking care of business
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funkyderek
Emily,
In your post (and to the best of my recollection in your previous posts) you haven't said one good thing about this guy. What exactly do you love about him? What wonderful qualities does he have that make it worth putting up with his mistreatment? He wants you to completely change who you are in order to conform to a lifestyle he's not even able to live up to. Perhaps the reason his two ex-wives never followed his advice is because he's completely clueless. Divorced twice, bankrupt twice, disfellowshipped - and apparently blaming other people for all his problems. Why do you want to be the person getting blamed this time?
You can do better than this guy. It's not your fault he's a complete failure. You shouldn't feel responsible for him. Let him go. Find a man who won't make you pretend to be something you're not, one who won't criticise you for having a few drinks, one who can pay for dinner and one who doesn't need to borrow money from you. That's not too much to ask from a man, is it?
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nvrgnbk
<-- me taking care of business
Maybe you need more fiber in your diet sparrow?
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anewme
Emily Blue your post was hard to read. Sickening really. Some of us have married and spent 20+ years with just such a selfish whiny complaining unloving ungenerous woman hating man. They are so wrapped up in themselves they will never try to fulfill your needs or acknowledge them. And one day you will realize he really doesnt like you. Yup, painful days are ahead.
Why not start over? Find someone more healthy emotionally with fewer issues. Life will be so much easier.
Some people are just never going to be healthy and happy in this life. They have been ruined by early upbringing. Pass this pup up is my advice.
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J-ex-W
Hi, emilyblue. I hope you're doing well. I hope you don't mind my saying, but your most recent topic story concerned me. [Actually, I know you won't mind my saying--your purpose in putting it up was to get feedback...duh!] ;^)
Anyway---I want to say this to you now (and will post it on your thread later): Ignore the responses that were angry/ venting. These are people who *DON'T* know how to *respond* appropriately [helpfully] to a clear danger situation--just know how to *recognize* it.THAT part of their messages you can listen to. They are right--and unanimous--in having alarm signals going off all over the place. And you are right in listening to the alarm signals going off in your gut/ brain...the same ones that prompted you to seek outside feedback again in the first place.
Take the positive, affirming message that comes through cohesively in all those posts: You are competent, valuable, and worthy--and capable of self-care and appropriately self-directed action. You WILL navigate your way successfully through this one...at your own pace, and in your own time. Successfully!
Please read the series of articles I just posted about recognizing the signs of a controller-manipulator. I know it takes a long time to gather/ assimilate enough information and then to be able to move forward definitively with it. Take the time you need. And invest the emotional energy into figuring your SELF out, along with figuring out this maze/ puzzle, and nurturing your SELF through the process.
Are you seeing a counselor at this point? I would strongly recommend it!!! This is NOT something to be treated lightly or casually...your *SANITY* is what will eventually be at stake! Right now, you have self-trust and presence of mind enough to seek out the input of others. When you reach the point of abandoning even that...then you know you're REALLY in trouble!! Don't let it slide that far. And if you find yourself to that point--back up several steps and holler for help for all that it's worth!! And keep hollering for help.
You are not alone. You WILL get past this. You just have to keep plugging away and moving forward with it. [And yes--even the angry-sounding posters here are rooting for you...even if they don't always know *when* to chime in with a boo/ hiss or a cheer. You can do it, Aimee! You WILL get through this. You WILL find better life and better love.
Much love to you,
J-ex-W -
J-ex-W
emilyblue's words:
He asked me to have dinner with them, so I did, because he says he is so "proud to show me off."
Author Roger Melton's words ["When Romeo's Bleeding, Part 3"]:
When speaking of his family or friends, it sounds like he could be describing expensive cars, clothes, stereos or jewelry. People are possessions to a Narcissistic Controller, useful unto the degree that they make him look good to others and himself. They can be ignored, demeaned or discarded whenever they fail to make him shine.
and more Roger Melton, M.A., L.M.F.T, CEAP:
When talking about himself, everything he thinks, feels and does, sounds as if it must be important. Nothing is insignificant about a Narcissist, to a Narcissist. Regardless of what position he holds at his job, he is always better at it than anyone else. Whether a company's janitor or chief executive officer, he always conveys a sense of himself as superior to his peers.
The quickest and crudest way to confirm that someone is a Narcissistic Controller is simply to marry him. Unfortunately, this actually is the first moment when the narcissistic spell is broken and a woman realizes that Mr. Right is actually Mr. Wrong. If it were simply a manner of recognizing signs of self-centered arrogance, it would be a piece of cake to avoid this kind of man's clutches. But many Narcissistic Controllers possess a subtle weapon: charm.
Most people strive to be socially charming, but this is not the kind of charm displayed by a Narcissistic Controller. The manipulative impact of narcissistic charm is not intended to ease social connectedness. It is designed to establish social dominance. Instead of stimulating thought and interaction, it tends to lull or paralyze the mind.-----
This is all just from part 3 of his series of articles which I posted as a fresh topic under "Relationships: Recognize EARLY the controllers-manipulators."
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So basically, he won't pressure me to become a Witness as long as I'm following the same rules that Witnesses do. All the guts, but none of the glory, be what it may, I guess.
As long as you keep up appearances.... It's appearances only--as they reflect on him, that is--that he cares about. Nothing else...or nothing else as deeply. I know your paralyzed status/ confusion are partly wrapped up in the "But wait...my gut says that he cares about me, too" tailspin.... Surely, something about my perceptions must be correct...."
Yes...to a limited degree--a very limited degree--he cares about you. You are reading the signs of his 'caring' for you correctly. The signs are there...you are correct in perceiving that. What you aren't factoring in, as yet, is the intent behind his 'caring' behaviors. The intent is fully self-serving on his end. [This is the part that has you confused.]
As the above quotes from Roger Melton testify: He cares about you to the degree that you are able to 'service' him. Period. That's it. It's all he's capable of. And much less than what you deserve!!!
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I have NEVER behaved inappropriately before. I made a bad judgment call and apologized again and again. Then I finally told him he was being too hard on me, and I would call the guy up myself and apologize if he wanted me to, but he said I did enough damage.
He didn't want you to call and talk to the guy because it's not really about that guy to him. If it were about that guy, then he would be happy and relieved to accept your efforts at peace-making and mutual resolution. But, as a controller-manipulator, he sees it differently.
Talking to that guy might resolve the situation--which is threatening, because that would lessen his present manipulative hold on you. It's not about having a conflict resolved. It's about having something to hold over your head, to keep you paralyzed/ compliant through self-blame and guilt. Plus, it indirectly trains you to NOT act on your own initiative/ behalf. Double-whammy. See how insidious that is?
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I also said that I would never financially hurt him and that I would have gladly paid the bill for all three of us had I been more self-aware.
There was no reason for you to think you would need to take on the bill. Period. He knows that. He also knows that you can be easily prodded into believing that you should, anyway. This is the only thing you need to increase your self-awareness about, in this instance: Your present overly-easy malleability and putty-forming state in his hands.
Forget the bill. Forget his finances. Remember your own aim to be SELF aware. Let him worry about what happens that way on his end. You be concerned about your SELF.
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This is two weeks after I gave him a money order for $800 to declare his second bankruptcy. Now it's back to where I never do anything for him and have only damaged his reputation and his soon-to-be flourishing reputation in his industry.
Giant step backward for you, Hon, since the last time you were posting. I know you know that. Keep the outside feedback lines of communication open, unblocked, and flowing. These steps backward may be only that, and not destroy you or swallow you, as long as you learn to recognize what happened this time and avoid those pitfalls future. Keep open dialogue going with a professional the whole way through, and tell them everything. You need a knowledgeable guide to help talk you through your efforts to climb out of this quicksand. Seriously. It's no small feat and no quick steps, either, by this time. Just keep going at it!!
And, BTW, notice again how it's all about appearances for him. And no matter what he does to undermine his own progress, he will always have a handy/ ready excuse to lay blame for his failures (or even perceived failures) conveniently on you. He may lay it there...don't pick it up!! This is the moment at which you need to be SELF aware: Let him hold the responsibility all on his own. It will be uncomfortable and very hard for you at first...and believe me--he will try to maximize and capitalize on that. Don't let him!!!
Become SELF aware enough, emilyblue, to understand when your [legitimate] responsibility for something begins and when someone else is trying to lay [an illegimate sense of] responsibility at your feet. You know it's not yours to pick up. Step over it, and let them figure out how to handle their own sense of responsibility legitimately. Their [his] struggle at this point--not yours.
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Below is a link to a letter written by the former girlfriend of a 'Martyr Man.' I'm sure you will identify clearly with much of what she is saying, emilyblue.
http://heartless-bitches.com/rants/manipulator/martyr.shtml
[The name of the site, BTW, is based on the claim/ name-calling that [male] abusers will inflict upon their [female] victims who stand up for themselves. It's a name--and an action--to embrace, in this context.]
Anyway...take care. Take time...to understand...and to heal.
J-ex-W
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bluebell
people here are concerned - we did a emilyblue are you ok post even :)
you need to look at yourself and see why you think you need this guy in your life
leave him, in your own time but you still leave him, okay?