Jesus is the answer! (page 4)

trevor

It seems that people reach a point in their lives where they wrestle with belief and try to come to a conclusion. Discussion boards like this do help to clarify our thoughts and this board has helped me.

The trouble with reaching a conclusion is that excluding the possibility of a life force outside of ourselves we loose our connection with infinity.

I prefer to say that for now I am too busy enjoying life to concern myself overly with the concept of invisible forces influencing my life.

As for the Jesus thing, I abandoned that holed boat a long tome ago - but whatever gets you through the night is OK with me!

Edited due to impaired spelling caused by good Friday night wine. We are 8 hours ahead of you in the UK.

Shawn10538

All debates on the existence of God are won by the atheists as far as I am concerned. The religious will never fail to retreat to the claim that one MUST have faith to believe because they can not furnish evidence or proof of God's existence. When asked who told them they must have faith, they say coyly, THE BIBLE! Well, the Bible is the thing in question in the first place, so it doesn't make sense to quote the Bible to prove that the Bible is true. Of course the Bible will say that the bible is true. Proving it is true entails looking at secular history and seeing how it adds up next to science. in this case, it is science not the Bible that proves or disproves the Bible is true. Until it is proven true, it can not be referred to at all, or the experiment is null and void. So, you can't say we must have faith, because that statement originates in the Bible, and the Bible is the thing in question. It is literally begging the question to say that.
The other retreat that religious people run to is emotional appeal, or appeal to emotion. One "JUST KNOWS" in this case that Jesus is true. When pressed to disclose HOW one JUST KNOWS, the religious person either doesn't know at all, or they describe, like my brother, some generic event like feeling warm and fuzzy one day, wile sitting in traffic, and that warmness or glow was Jesus. this kind of vague "proof" is fine for the person having it, but it doesn't help anybody else to know Jesus. In any case, it's so vague that it can't be DIS proven. So, again, the religious person is safe, retreated rather cowardly to the safety of their own un provable claims.

Gregor

I believe Jesus existed. He was raised in a race/religeon based population that was once the glorious nation of Israel, God's chosen people, etc. except that now the Roman empire is the boss of them. He is indoctrinated in the Hebrew scriptures, the theme of which was that a messiah savior was going to come and pull all their chestnuts out of the fire. I also believe he was Bi-polar, I am serious, religous fixations being one of the number one manifestations, his psychotic break came at the typical age for this disorder. He went around ranting and raving and found a following of desparate, disenfranchised followers and also pissed off the Jewish religous hierarchy and got himself killed.. How long after his death were the Christian scriptures written?... many, many, years. He was a legend and the stories had gotten grander and more fantastic... etc etc.

Even though I am a very outspoken and, I think, persuasive, atheist I would feel kind of strange if someone posted here and said "....I used to believe very deeply in Jesus Christ...but after reading some of Gregor's comments I no longer believe in him or a god at all". That is not what I'm trying to cause and yet that is the conclusion I have come to. Can anyone understand my feelings on this? Nvr, Terry, etc?

journey-on

Jesus was a man that experienced the "Christ" presence. Religion has screwed up the person and experience by attempting to explain it, and the explanation became a doctrine that turned into something labeled Christian. It's been misunderstood by getting caught up in worshipping the mundane "man". This causes some to search no further because it sounds too preposterous to believe, so they stop their spiritual growth altogether because of this misrepresentation and so opt for nothing. NOTHING becomes their answer because you can't find SOMETHING if you cease to search.

Gregor

"Jesus was a man that experienced the "Christ" presence..."

Sorry, but that strikes me as just more Jesus gibberish and a good example of the kind of thing that makes non-believers roll their eyes.

journey-on

Think what you like. You can call it anything you wish...Jesus gibberish or whatever. But if you look at enlightened teachers (you probably don't understand that terminology either) from other cultures before Jesus, they experienced similar phenomena and an expanded consciousness. It's real. It's documented. It's just not common and only happens to certain ones on a certain level. Keep your mind closed shut and you won't have to think about it or you can label it something that makes you feel secure in your NOTHINGNESS belief. It goes beyond religion. These enlightened teachers did not intend to start a religion. It was the people that attempted to explain their teachings without full comprehension that started the religions. Don't shoot the messenger (the teacher) just because their followers got it wrong.

Gregor

It's real. It's documented.

No, it's not and you know it. Look up "hyperbole"

blueviceroy

I still believe we are all here so I would have to say not much was changed ,,,,,although my eyes were opened quite a bit by reading the posts here I cant seem to go a day without atleast reading everything new Im not really sure Im a believer or a nonbeliever Im still forming an opinion but I've been doing that for about three decades so what does that make me?

journey-on

Im still forming an opinion but I've been doing that for about three decades so what does that make me?

A seeker of Truth. You might be this way till the day you die, and, imo, that's a good thing. When you stop seeking, then you have "died" spiritually. I think we are SUPPOSED to search our entire Life as if we were looking for hidden treasure. Be open, examine everything that resonates with you, and continue the journey. Jesus may hold some answers for you. I don't know and neither does anyone else on this forum no matter how strongly they tout their opinions.

bbdodger

Singing love songs to Jesus makes me nauseous. Sticking your hands in the air and waving them back and forth with eyes closed and imploring Jesus gives me a headache.

Oh yeah, yuck... that's the worst! Gross. I cannot agree more.

Jesus is the answer!

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