The growing irrelevance of the Watchtower message

by drew sagan 94 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  purplesofa

  I think the organization sees what they are doing as a war......what's been going on are all the battles that must be fought, some won and lost while fighting. They have retreated, somewhat, recently and are regrouping, reorganizing.

  Over history, wars have been won, only after retreat. They have rethought the plan, and come out stronger. When the opponents believed they had victory.

  I am not saying the org is going to win anything. As I don't believe there is anything to win anymore.

  But many people on this planet are deeply invested in their religious beliefs, their God, their doctrones and will fight to the bitter end.

  purps
• 

  Seeker4

  I've been in steady contact with a JW elder, and he confirmed that this 2034 date is being discussed to a degree in the congregations, and for the reasons given above. No official stance on it, of course.
  
  I've been re-reading Crisis of Conscience, and one of the really interesting things Ray brings out is is how many of the Gov. Body members were willing to consider alternatives to the 1914 date. It's obvious from what he experienced that among the leadership of the Witnesses, there is serious concern about the accuracy of that date - even 20 or 30 years ago!
  
  The fact that the GB turned around and made belief in the teaching that Jesus took up his throne in 1914 a a requirement when they were investigating the apostacy at Bethel in 1980-81, just shows how morally bankrupt those men were!
  
  S4
• 

  james_woods

  The irrelevance is bound up with one simple fact: The whole JW belief system either survives or fails on the basis of the eschatology. And this very belief system has proven to be false time and again since the days of the Millerite origins of their chronology.

  Not one single thing they teach falls very far from the "time of the end is upon us" tree. The "time of the end" story is the Jehovah's Witness version of easter bunny and santa claus. The irrelevance of it is that not many Witnesses actually believe in it any more - they are there for social reasons, family pressures, just plain habit of momentum, or off on some sad elder/governing body power trip. They are just going through the motions of the belief in the immediate end of the world.

  1914 is so far in the past that nobody in their right mind could pretend that it has or had any prophetic meaning now that we are just around the corner of the 100 year anniversary. And yet, this date still has to be taught - simply because to NOT teach it would be to admit that over a century of "time of the end" was not "time of the end" at all. Generations of witnesses believed it, suffered great hardship for it, were laughed at by the general public for it, and finally died without seeing anything at all take place.

  These facts will not simply go away. The witnesses themselves are well aware that the doctrine of the end grows weaker with each new day, and more irrelevant with each time it is hollowly retold.
• 

  Quandary

  A couple of years ago I was having a discussion with a fellow elder who is an old timer, grandfather came in during CTR's time, anyway, he was reasoning that if Jehovah waited 120 years for Noah's generation when the earth's population was only a few hundred million (I don't know how he arrived at that figure) are we to expect that he would show a less patient attitude with 6 billion people? Thinking back, I think his logic may have been influenced by the W article I referenced earlier.

  Q
• 

  Quandary

  Not one single thing they teach falls very far from the "time of the end is upon us" tree. The "time of the end" story is the Jehovah's Witness version of easter bunny and santa claus. The irrelevance of it is that not many Witnesses actually believe in it any more - they are there for social reasons, family pressures, just plain habit of momentum, or off on some sad elder/governing body power trip. They are just going through the motions of the belief in the immediate end of the world.

  Totally agree with your point James!

  Q
• 

  M.J.

  Are you really only 25 Drew? You seem wise well beyond your years.
• 

  wha happened?

  I was going to ask if anyone was still active if the 2034 date was getting attention. Looks like it has. What a perfect date for them. Just far enough to not lose the masses but yet far enough to bury another generation. I'll be retired by then
• 

  95stormfront

  I was a new recruit in the late 90's and did not last one decade in the organization. The main reason was because the idealistic picture of the organization I had before I became a member dealt with the reality of what the organization was after I became a member. I went right into pioneer work but became extremely frustrated because I did not the see excitement I had as a new member within those who had been JWs for many years. Their lack of enthusiasm eventually made me give up my idealism. I can't help but wonder about how many other converts out there meet with the same disappointment I did.

  That abou mirrors my experience as well.It was soon after baptism that I'd had a couple of issues with nosy elders and the my study partner dropping me from his friendship list when he couldn't count time on me anymore that I realized what the organization was all about.
• 

  Lady Zombie

  I'm 38 so I'm technically under 40. I have always known about the 1975 issue because, to save face, many JW parents of people my age make it into a big joke on themselves. My parents do this.

  My folks: Tee Hee! We planned when to have you so that you'd never have to go to school. Most of us felt that 1975 would be the end. Silly us! Well, it's our fault from running ahead of the organization.

  I know of about a dozen other people I grew up with whose parents had done the same thing; planning their birth so that they would be pre-school aged children when 1975 came.

  I also know of a few who went heavily into debt around this time (like late '73 to '74). They figured they would never have to repay the money. There were a lot of people driving new cars, indulging in luxuries, etc. Although the "materialism" was frowned upon, it was winked at because everyone believed Armie was on its way.

  When it didn't come, there were a lot of janitors and window washers saddled with excessive debt that they couldn't repay.

  I remember several people in my area left the bOrg over this.

  Of course, true to WT doctrine, they were viciously labeled apostates and told it was their fault for running ahead of the organization and "overly anticipating" Jehovah.

  Plausable deniability has always been established in the bOrg because while JWs are expected to obey the FDS, the JWs are also told that the GB are imperfect men and thus subject to imperfection and error.

  Classic case of Orwellian Doublethink.

  Those who didn't turn "apostate" and didn't leave the bOrg were however very bitter over the whole thing. I very much remember stern lectures from COs and DOs scolding the congregation for murmuring, allowing their zeal to cool, and "grieving the spirit."

  On a depressing end-note, the 1975 disaster had been stomped out of the R&F active memory by 1980 and hardly anyone spoke about it anymore. If they did, they were very quickly reprimanded. To even mention 1975 usually led to a JC.

  During my teenage years, my parents very reticent to even explain the whole thing to me.
• 

  TJ - iAmCleared2Land

  The Watchtower refuses to see value in local congregations having any sort of autonomy, even when it comes down to simple things like social activities. The general attitude is "If it's not scheduled by HQ, it doesn't matter".

  Ain't that the truth! At least when I was growing up, we and the other congregations would have picnics, potlucks, ball games, get together for cards and such weeknights... how many KH's do those things anymore? I'd venture to say that very few do.