by messenger 61 Replies latest jw friends
Thanks messenger. Now we know more than the average publisher.
Third Son
Towards the end of my jw enlistment, i didn't get any time in. A kind old elder used to automatically put in a report for me for a couple of hours, and tell me about it after. I never did get around to making good on them. Oh well, i guess it's too late now.
Fifteen minute publishers - wow that's a good one. As stated this will serve to bring up the numbers. It will also ease the consciences of the older drones.
SS
Well said Bridgette!
This whole child abuse syndrome brings to mind some scriptures applying it to the Borg:
2Cor11:14,15...And no wonder, for Satan himself keeps transforming himself into an angel of light. It is therefore nothing great if his ministers also keep transforming themselves into ministers of righteousness.
Matt23:27,28...Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because you resemble whitewashed graves, which outwardly indeed appear beautiful but inside are full of dead men's bones and every sort of uncleanness. In that way you also, outwardly indeed, appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
2Thess2:3...Let no one seduce you in any manner, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction.
2Tim3:5...Having a form of godly devotion but proving false to its power, and from these turn away.
John13:35...By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves.
Luke8:17...For there is nothing hidden that will not become manifest, neither anything carefully concealed that will never become known and never come into the open.
Yes, it is quite a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (Heb10:31).......
:*) Richie
"So now the Publishers have to turn in their time to the
"Book Study Overseer"? Is this a way to make people with
no time stand out and feel self conscious? "Brother, I noticed
you not turning anything in tonight"
Same thought I had. Imagine if you lie and turn in 10 hours but you never went out in service with your book study group. The BS overseer would then say, "Hmmmm, so how exactly did you get all these hours?????" My husband would have had this happen to him every month because he always lied and counted 10 hours for every 1 LOL. And the Holy Spirit didn't know it either because he was appointed and commended for his service activity even though no one ever saw him out in service LOL.
Prisca: They're only doing the elderly and infirm thing so they could pump their hours up. They want to give people a free conscience to lie about their time. Just think I got the flu but I go out in service for 15 mins. Well then I turn in 1 hour. It goes on the report and my conscience is clear.
No different than when the CO used to tell me to talk to my kids about Jehovah when I got home or call up an unbelieving family member so as to keep my time going - even though it was 20 minutes from the KH to my home those 20 minutes were counted just because I mentioned Jehovah when I got home.
In view of this summation I had additional questions for Jem,
I am posting them here as well as on Jemimiahs thread.
Re: WTBS GETS SHIRTY WITH JW Nov 25, 2001 12:45
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Jem,
I'm curious about something else?
How did your 35 min talk go at the elder school?
Remember...
* http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=8664&site=3
If it was cancelled why didn't you update us on this?
Or did you and I missed it?
In reading Messengers summation of the Elder school I see nothing about a 35min talk on new child abuse procedures.
I have other questions too.
I may be back with more.
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Yes there's more,
This is also very strange, the new Elder book that you have referred to more than once was not released or even mentioned as a future release in the Elder school.
* http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=4325&site=3
* http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=15351&site=3
Was the book postponed or cancelled and you just didn’t update us?
Ranchette
Ranchette
Well so big deal the 15 minute rule will bring up the total number of publishers but it will pull down the average hours. So for the society to keep their 10 hour average would mean that the younger publishers will have to put in more hours. Think about it... Just another way for the local BSO to get on your case to put in more hours..
Also I always thought that there was no great insights or new light at these elders meetings. They just feed the elders enough BS to keep them happy. If I was there my brain would have been turned off after the opening prayer and that’s exactly what the GB wants. No questions just except everything as coming from God himself. Good brainwashing techniques..
Good stuff Messenger. They are determined to improve the figures by imposing on brothers to report at the group and getting old dudes to report even if 15 mins. That is probably the extent of concern of the WTS to old ones...that they report and put the figures up.
ISP
Wow Messenger, I wonder how you can stand to hang in there. I had some thoughts about the 15 minute rule. The elderly could just go to the service meeting and then go back home. Those boring meeting last at least 20 minutes. Women might be able to take advantage of this rule too, just imaging, she could tell the elders, about being pregnant, or having very young kids. Others could use migrane headaches as an excuse. However, with this new rule, the field service hours will go down, because the average hours will lower with many claiming they are inferm. Those "kind" reminders on how to hold a shunning meeting were interesting. No doubt, because nothing new was mentioned in those proceedures, it was for the elderly elders who will use that 15 minute rule.
"Hand me that whiskey, I need to consult the spirit."-J.F. Rutherford
Jeremy's Hate Mail Hall Of Fame.
http://hometown.aol.com/onjehovahside/ and [email protected]
10.Judicial note: Two credible witnesses to different events can be accepted. The example of smoking was the only one used. One witness can involve no judicial committee but elders may continue to explore the matter.
Wouldn't this open up new possibilities for molestation victims? Part of the problem has been that no one molests a child in front of two witnesses, therefore there were never two witnesses to a single event. But if different but similar events can be used as evidence, does this mean that molesters who could not formerly have been nailed could now see judicial action?
Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan
I read with interest the summation by messenger regarding the elder school. The message offered by WT is a very clear one. No compassion, no love, protect the corporation. After reviewing the comments about standard wt policy which appears to have no change with the exception of telling elders to not threaten or disfellowship those who choose to report crime. I guess that is the point of this entire issue. Wt still does not get it. Their policy continues to hold that they have the right to judiciate crime. The fatal flaw in policy is ther reference to the 89 letter and reporting to legal first. Not only does this show the 89 letter is still considered the foundation of WT policy but also it shows that home office holds primary authority over the laws of the land. What about murder? Read the murder letter. The WT has set themselves up as being above the law and thus show no respect for the arrangement all citizens must adhere to. There is no other religion in the USA that maintains the requirement to authorize by home office the reporting of crime to the police. I noted the comment on reporting, "it is a personal decision." What??? Since when is reporting crime a "personal decision?" How is that proper respect for "superior authorities"? It seems they still just do not get it.
The instructions at the school is an insult to all the silentlambs who have spoken out about the weakness of WT policy. They are basically being ignored and called liars. What better way to describe the actions lieing hypocrites who refuse to make changes in the interest of children. Note also the reference to the "two credible witnesses." Is a child a credible witness? Why did they not use the anology of child molestation to clarify this matter for elders? Can you see how well the society keeps the elders untrained and then blame them when things go wrong?
One final point, it was stated after a local needs part the congregation should be able to put two and two together. This shows that policy is still in place of parents being df for slander if they try to warn others in the congregation. Authority is given only to elders who give no details. But then I think why wouldn't they as elders are instructed that they are above the law anyway.
There was a time when I held hope that there were good men in charge of the organization who would endeavor to do right once they understood that a problem truly existed. I believe the last eleven months have shown this to be a false assumption. After being clearly informed, WT leadership chooses to ignore the victims and those who are being brought into harm's way saying, "Not only have we not done nothing wrong but we are not changing anything." I have sat in judgement of people such as this and when I have it was a short meeting. You cannot appeal to wickedness. Yet, it is good for wicked arrogant men to think they answer to no one, as the fall to reality will be much harder. Can you hear that sound Governing Body? It is the sound of hard ground rushing up to smack you in the face.
