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Cas
Survival of Human Consciousness Beyond Death
by Rapunzel 53 Replies latest jw experiences
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metatron
I strongly encourage you to read "Heaven Confirmed". I'm not sure if it's still in print but it is vital reading for anyone who is interested in life after death.
metatron
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Big Tex
Interesting thread.
This is a subject I have been spending a great deal of time thinking about the past couple of years. I am determined that I will not be afraid to shuffle off this mortal coil. Still, especially at 2 in the morning, and I think of what will come all I feel is cold.
If there is something beyond death I fear my prospects are very dim. This is why I find atheism's answer to be the most comforting. I'd much prefer being erased to facing a judgmental accountant-god. Religion, philosphy and/or new age holds some very grim, and cold, probabilities for me.
Having said that, I did have separate dreams about my mother and my father in law died. I have no idea if the dreams were "real" or not. I choose to believe they were because they were comforting. I do find though that, often, people's ideas and/or experieces relating to beyond death mirror their beliefs about it.
Chris
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Fadeout
If there were any evidence at all, other than ghost stories, I'd examine it. But frankly everything I have seen thus far requires as much faith as believing that a global flood occured 4000 years ago...
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Casper
Rapunzel,
Here is a post from earlier this year... I would be interested in your thoughts on it... (this was during the Twilight Zone time frame...)
If any are familiar with my history, you know that I have been widowed twice ,at fairly young ages. My first committing suicide at the age of 28.
Over the 10 years that that we were married… we often talked of death and tried to imagine what might be on the other side. He felt it was just a door way to the "Other Side" as he put it.
My Husband seemed obsessed with death and often brought up the thought of suicide, if things ever got to be too much for him, his escape hatch, I suppose. Sometimes he used it as a threat to get his way.
I heard it so often I didn’t give it much thought over the years. I was young and considering everything going on at the time …things just didn’t click for me, (while in the AF we did go to counseling, he refused to be honest with his feelings, at that time.)
During many of our talks of death, he always told me that when he "went" (died) that he would do "Everything" in his power to contact me from the other side. We had many long discussions over this…
I was told to "Keep on the Watch"… (where have we heard that before…lol).
I honestly feel that if there is, in fact, a way for the dead to contact us, he would have done it. He would have found a way. It has been 24 years and there has been nothing…"NOT" one thing has happened that I could honestly point to and say… "Yes, He contacted me today…"
My conclusions:
1. There is nothing after death.
2. The dead really are asleep in Jehovah’s memory.
3. The dead are not allowed to contact us.
4. They have to be invited in some manner… (which I never did)
5. That by committing suicide he lost all access to any powers.
6. Or, he is having such a "GOOD" time…he has forgotten all about me..!! J
Just wanted to share,
I wonder if the reason he never contacted me is because he is "Confined" to the area in which he died.
I am in Southern Ind. he died in Oklahoma... Something to think about.
My dreams are posted here too... strange dreams that went on for years until they reached a conclusion.
Cas
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Rapunzel
Casper - I definitely know what it is to be in the "Twilight Zone." Perhaps, at a later period of time, I will make a post about my stay in the Intensive Care Unit [I.C.U.] of the hospital, "E-dah," that I mentioned in an earlier post [Moreover, I think that I will read over some of your earlier posts, o.k.?]. Actually I have been in an I.C.U. on several occasions. Take my word on it, they are not pleasant pllaces. I.C.U.'s are truly for the sickest of the sick. Often, the "next stop" is another room in the hospital - the morgue. And, then, to borrow a phrase, "it's from there to eternity."
For now, just let me say that during a stay in the I.C.U., I had, what I think was, a "Near Death Experience" - a N.D.E. Mine was not an out-of-body experience. Rather, I had "visitors." As I remember, they did not particularly frighten me; in fact, I was not scared at all. They were not dressed in white, and they were not adorned with wings. Their faces were more or less impassive. They were looking at me with maybe just a bit of curiosity. Their clothing was dark; they were definitely not doctors or nurses. They said nothing. I just remember how curious it was that they would seem to disappear when I blinked my eyes. Then they reappeared. This episode lasted only a brief period of time. I really could not say how long, but I know that the period of time in question was a brief one. I wish that it could have been longer. Besides the horrrible pain that I was in, I remember feeling very lonely in that I.C.U.
Their disappearing and reappearing leads me to think that they were some sort of illusion brought on by physiological and neurological trauma. I had gone into a sort of septic shock. For a while there, I was on the thin line that separates life and death. Who knows? Maybe we humans have some sort of chemical or hormone in our body, which, under certain circumstances, relieves some of the pain that accompanies death. It might be "nature's way" of giving the dying organism some measure of relief or comfort.
I really don't know. All that I do know is that I survived, to my great regret because I did not come out of it "whole." I suffered some kind of nerve damage. In Taiwan, I had to leave a job that I loved [associate professor] and so many students whom I dearly love. For all intents and purposes, my life ended there and then in Taiwan.
As I said, I like to consider myself a rationalist. Above all, I wanted to teach my students how to think so that they could live well and have a better life than my own. So, I tend to view the concept of "angelic visitors" with a whole heap of skepticism. I mean, angels are supposed to be messengers and "psychopomps," guides for the soul. They are supposed to lead humans over to the other side. That's why I ask: If those were indeed angels that I saw, why did they not take me with them? I would have gladly gone. What I suffered after that stay in the ICU was horrible. Why did they not take me? Why did they make the trip for nothing?
As a professor, I used to teach the writings of people like Ralph Waldo Emerson and Henry David Thoreau. They had a very unique view of evil. For them, or for Emerson at least, evil was simply the absence of good. They saw evil as something "negative" in that it simply represented the lack of goodness. For tjhem, evil had no "positive" or active power.
They must have led charmed lives. Emerson was a brilliant man; and I can just picture Henry David strolling around Walden pond. Thoreau was also a good man with strong principles. But, based on my experience, I view evil very differently. I cannot say anything about the existence of God. But, for me, evil is all too real, and very active. Just as there are evil people, I cannot help but believe that there are other, non-human sources of evil. I do not know from what source their rage comes. Perhaps they are "trapped" in this physical realm of ours, and resent it. I just don't know. However, there seems to be another realm that "mirrors" our own [I realize that, here, I am now beginning to sound weird and "hokey," but this has been my experience], I honestly do not know if this "realm" of which I speak is merely a psychlogical "projection." Perhaps, just perhaps, evil - or most evil phenomena - is merely a projection of what is in our own minds. I really wish that I knew. Is getting rid of evil a matter of exorcism, or simply a matter of good psycotherapy? My ambivalence is evident. I am faced with an age-old dilemma. Everything that I know, everything that I experience, comes to me through my senses. The trouble is that my senses are flawed and imperfect. And did you realize that scientists cannot even agree on the question of exactly how many senses we humans have? The only thing they agree on is that we have more than the "traditional" five. I really wih that I could make better sense of the world.
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slimboyfat
What a fascinating thread and story Rapunzel. Personally I would really hope there could be some form of life after death, but I can't believe it. As you say the evidence is that consciousness is tied up with the brain. That is my tentative conclusion on the matter at the moment.
I had a fractionally similar experience when I was a young boy I was never able to explain to myself, although it was not what I would call a ghost. The person I saw was a real living person I am sure about that. I was about nine years old and playing along the road from where I lived. I had climbed over a wall into a garden I should not have been in and there was another boy with me. We were startled by a man we hadn't noticed who was tending his garden. He stopped us and gave us a lecture about how we shouldn't jump the wall into his garden and he had seen us do it before.
But as was he was talking I was struck dumb looking at his face because in between his eyes there was a protusion that was thin and about an inch long. And it moved about from left to right inquisitively. And on the end of the protusion there was what looked like a small eyeball. So it was like a tiny tentacle with an eye at the end. And I was sure it was looking at me because it moved in non-random sort of way. I asked the man what it was, and he got annoyed at me and we ran away.
At that young age I thought it was pretty strange, but I thought it might be possible that such a thing exists and I simply had never heard of it before. I was not at all frightened by the thought of this man having a strange third eye, only that he was annoyed at us. I was just curious what this strange appearance on his head could be. The world is such a marvelously wonderous place when you are young after all. Almost anything seemed possible. I innocently told my dad about it expecting he would explain it as he did other things about nature, birds, trees, clouds and other sorts of things that interested me.
I suppose it was just a trick of the mind and a big wart or something. But it really looked like an eye at the time. (Maybe someone will not tell me such a thing does exist after all!) And I have thought about it so much now it is hard for me to access directly the memory of the event without the layers of reflection I have placed over it getting in the way. And obviously it does not compare with the gruesome scene you saw.
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Casper
I'm so sorry ...
Sounds as tho you have certainly had your share, and then some, of physical pain.
I understand about ICU, I used to work in a hospital. A lot of people fail to make it out of that area, I am so glad you pulled thru.
As for your "Visitors", that is odd. I suppose some would say it was the pain and medication.... but you are the one that experienced it and you know what went on.
This again is the part where we always seem to have to "Justify" the events to ourselves or others. I hate that.
As for believing in Evil... I find that if asked, I will readily agree that evil in some "other worldly" sense exists... but, if asked about a "God" I just can't do it.......boggles the mind, doesn't it.
Sure, feel free to read my posts.... some are rather dorky... as I am not nearly as articulate as others here.
I look forward to your future posts and send you "Supportive Thoughts"...
(((Hugs)))
Sincerely,
Cas
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Casper
Slimboy,
Wow....
Cas
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Rapunzel
Casper - Thank you very much for your care and kind regards.
Slimboy - All that I can do is to echo Casper - "Wow!!"
Given that this tentacle-like protrusion moved "from left to right inquisitively," in a non-random manner leaves me baffled, utterly speechless. It really doesn't sound like a mole at all.
I'm wondering if you have ever considered hypnotic regresssion. Supposedly, under the guidance of a trained and ethical hypnotist, people can be "carried back" in time to a crucial/critical/traumatic period of their life. The word "ethical" is important because I have read that it is possible to "plant" or infuse false memories in people, especially children.
But I have also read that hypnosis has therapeutic and beneficial value. I really don't know. Have you ever considered "returning" to that moment in time so as to achieve some sense of awareness or clarification? Do you believe in hypnosis? Have you ever been in such a state?
For some reason, I am now thinking back to when I was a child. On several occasions, I distinctly remember lying in bed on my stomach and feeling a hand gently touching my back - almost like a parent would caress a child with their hand. Just a gentle touch. Needless to say, no one was there, and I would think to myself [rationalize?] - "It's just a muscle spasm," or something like that. When you're a kid, even a gentle touch "out of the blue" can be scary.
I also remember "zooming" down a steep hill on a busy avenue. Not a small suburban or rural road - a busy four-lane avenue. Of course, being the stupid kid that I was [now, at age 50, no longer a kid, but still stupid], I was zooming down this busy avenue on the wrong side of the street. I remember swerving directly into on-coming traffic in order to avoid a parked car. I can still remember the very last thing that I should have seen - the front grille of a car with its headlights and all. When I think back on it, I realize that there was no way that I could have possibly reacted quick enough. I was zooming down hill on my bicycle, directly head on in the path of an on-coming car. I can still remember that grille. It was the last thing that I should have seen. It's like they say. It's etched in my mind.
I have no explanation concerning how I ever survived that encounter. No explantation at all. Some would say - "It was your guardian angel." Well, all that I can say is, if I got one, he/she deserves the highest Medal of Commendation for pulling my dumb little ass out of that predictament.
My sister [a very devout Roman Catholic] says that "God" has plans for me.
Sometimes I wonder how it is that I am still alive. In March, 2003 I went into full cardiac arrest - total heart attack. In the hospital, they had to perform C.P.R. In real life, the survival rate for C.P.R. is only 5%. Five percent. And you know how I got myself to the hospital that night? On a motorcycle. I drove myself to the hospital on a motorcycle - a Yamaha 150, to be exact. On the very verge of full cardiac arrest. I was having :death gasps or death rasps, whatever. It took me almost forever to get DOWN one flight of stairs, and open my door.
When I tell doctors about it, they ask me: "How the hell did you manage that, on a motorcycle?' And my answer is always - I really don't know.