Jehovah's Witnesses and Child Protection ? Not. Check this Out !

by flipper 83 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

  • wobble
    wobble

    And me Seek 2 Find ,

    Many years ago in my congo.we had a sad case of abuse.and just one elder said "I don't care what you lot are going to do,I am going to the Police"

    He didn't have to because a relative,not in the "truth" beat him to it.but all the other elders would have swept it under the carpet,any way they could.

    Where is the "Love amongst yourselves" Not in this sick organisation.the victim counts for nothing,must keep Jehovah's name out of the mire.

    Let Him fight his own battles you stupid Witnessses,how weak is your God?

    Love to all,

    Wobble

  • StAnn
    StAnn

    Here's the point I tried to make with my ex-sil about my niece, who was molested, when she was angry that children's services got involved:

    It doesn't bring reproach upon Jehovah when someone molests a child. It only brings reproach upon the person who did the molesting. It brings reproach upon Jehovah when the Dubs try to cover up the molestation, though.

    Why can't the Dubs understand this very simple point?

    Given their "reproach on Jehovah" logic, one could ask them, "How can the WTS criticize the Catholic Church for covering up the sexual abuse scandal? If the conduct of errant priests had been reported to the police, it would have brought reproach upon Jehovah!"

    Do you think the Dubs would buy that crock of bull?

    What a double standard they have.

    StAnn

  • flipper
    flipper

    Very good points you all are making here ! Thanks for the input ! I'll respond.

    WOBBLE- Good points. When it's convenient the WT society always uses the " imperfection " card as a reason to excuse their blunders. There is no ongoping protection plan in their organization for children as you said - the society does try to keep child abuse secret at all costs ! Case in point is that 99 % of Jehovah's Witnesses did not know or were not made aware of the out of court child abuse settlements in California with 16 witness abuse victims last year ! The governing body is big on " information control " !

    FOKYC- Those elders who talked with you are NUTS ! It's pretty bad when they start pulling out illustrations of " bulls goring humans " to prove a point and compare it regarding child abuse ! Gawd- they are so weird !

    WHITE DOVE- Very true. It takes an act of congress to even GET an elder removed for child abuse ! I thought the point about the 16 year old and 15 year old having sex was ridiculous as well ! Amazing how they try to make THAT scenario apply to child abuse. I'd say a 50 year old man having sex with a 15 year old girl is a lot more dangerous than a 16 year old boy having sex with a 15 year old girl ! No comparison.

    OTWO- Very true. The WT society has NO expertise in child abuse counseling ! And it should be MANDATORY that ANY abuse be reported to police authorities. The WT society is mainly concerned with their outward reputation than the safety of children.

    NO MORE KOOL AID- It is sick to make children talk to elders in front of their molesters, very true. And you make a great point - Elders may know about this gross child rapist you talked about and his past - but they show horrible negligence by not informing people with children in the congregation about his past ! So the elders lack of informing families with children could cause another child to be caught unsuspectingly and sexually abused ! That's what makes me so angry ! Actually my friend who is a witness is trying to expose a pedophile in a congregation to the elders and C.O. I hope she is successful !

    SEEK 2 FIND- I agree - The confidentiality thing makes me sick as well ! The WT society should care more for the children's welfare and report it to the police authorities first ; instead of reporting it to their WT legal department first. It shows they are more concerned about appearance than the children actually getting protection ! It should be MANDATORY the WT society informs their elders to go to the police ; not if they feel like it.

    ST. ANN- Very good points. It brings reproach on God when Jehovah's Witnesses cover up child molestation among them ! They definitely have double standards ! The one committing the child abuse should pay for his crime ! Big time ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper

  • reniaa
  • flipper
    flipper

    RENIIA - I realize that some teachers may have been falsely charged as your ABC news links show - however most children who report being molested 99 % of the time are telling the truth- not making it up. Far more damage is done ignoring children's pleas for help and sweeping allegations of child molestation under the rug , thus emboldening a child molester to further abuse children while getting away with it - than any damage occasional false accusations could cause.

    If you check the court documents out on Barbara Anderson's CD explaining the details of the 16 Jehovah's Witness child abuse victims tragic ordeals - you will realize just how dangerous this evil is in the witness organization going on unchecked as it does in other religious organizations ! If you are religious- pray for these children, will you ? Peace out, Mr. Flipper

  • jamiebowers
    jamiebowers

    However, if two persons are witnesses to separate incidents of the same kind of wrongdoing , their testimony may be deemed sufficient to take action. "

    Oh, really? It didn't happen in Gilbert Simental's case in Murietta, CA, and he was committing his dirty deeds as late as 2 and 3 years ago. He molested at least 3 little girls, and they all came forward. Yet nothing was done by the elders in or out of the congregation.

    the elders may be required by law to report even uncorroborated or unsubstantiated allegations to the authorities. If so, we expect the elders to comply. Additionally, the victim may wish to report the matter to the authorities, and it is his or her absolute right to do so. "

    Again, in the Simental case, reporting didn't happen in CA, a reporting state. As a matter of fact, the elders on the JC CUT A DEAL TO BE SHIELDED FROM PROSECUTION IN EXCHANGE FOR THEIR TESTIMONY. Why were the victims who came forward on Dateline df'd?

    For the protection of our children, a man known to have been a child molester does not qualify for a responsible position in the congregation. Moreover, he cannot be a pioneer or serve in any other special, full - time service. " He would not qualify scripturally. We take such action because we are concerned with maintaining Bible standards and protecting our children

    BFD! Parents in the congregation aren't warned about the pervert in their midst, and neither are the people who answer their doors to him.

    In a few instances, individuals guilty of an act of child abuse have been appointed to positions within the congregation if their conduct has been otherwise exemplary for decades. All the factors are considered carefully . Suppose, for example , that a long time ago a 16-year-old boy had sexual relations with a consenting 15-year-old girl . Depending upon the U.S. jurisdiction where he lived when this happened, elders may have been required to report this as an incident of child abuse. Let us say that 20 years have passed. The child abuse reporting law may have changed ; the man may have even married the girl ! Both have been living exemplary lives and they are respected. In such a rare case , the man could possibly be appointed to a responsible position within the congregation. "

    Well, that wasn't the case with James Henderson and the other freaks of nature described in Barbara Anderson's watchtowerdocuments.com .

    Reinia, if you or the WB&TS are so concerned about false allegations of child abuse, one would think that police involvement would be wanted in order to clear the names of the accused. It seems you've adopted the same nasty style of the cult and choose to malign the victims.

  • StAnn
    StAnn

    Regarding sexual abuse in the schools:

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21392345/

    And Congress and the US Dept of Ed have done studies that all show the same thing.

    My husband is pursuing a teaching degree right now. One of his instructors is a school superintendent. He has taught or been an administrator in several different school districts over his career. He stated that in EVERY school district he ever worked in, a teacher was fired or otherwise "let go" for being a sexual predator.

    Let's stop sweeping this stuff under the rug, folks.

    StAnn

  • verystupid77
    verystupid77

    Flipper

    What a great thread. It just makes me sick what they are doing to the children.

    And reniaa it is amazing that you can be so blind but than again there are people who do not believe that the Holocaust happened either. YOU must be one of them. vs77

  • reniaa
    reniaa

    I like there to be two sided arguments! for personal reasons I'd like all pedophiles to be put on an island away from any contact with children but if the law can't do it niether can JW's.

    In this case the 'always two elder' rule when visiting people is refreshing when other churches don't do it and the priests/vicars still visit parishioners alone, the pairing on ministry too and gathering in groups is also productive in protection.

    Do you accept that if followed properly always two visiting rule and going on doors in pairs is a measure of protection to children?

    I am one of 5 girls brought up as Jw's I was never molested or even approached as a child by a Jw pedophile and niether were my sisters, I was never even allowed alone with a boy/man without a chaperone even when I was 18, we went out in groups too cinema. My memories are the Jws are strict on morality so opportunity is limited of between sexes contact, thats why i'm not surprised that the Jw cases mostly follow the same numbers as outside cases thats is...most are within-family cases.

    I recommend anyone do their own research on this and not let other people replace there own memories with theirs, there is definitely a feel of group memory on many of these subjects.

    Do you know in england pretend santa's in shops are no longer allowed to sit children on their knee? My son is severely disabled and he went on an outing to an art gallery with me (he has the mental age of 3 and cuddles everyone even though he is ten) he grabbed a lady who was an art gallery attendant and cuddled her she recognised he was just being friendly and happily cuddled him back, there was a group of children with a teacher and he was going to cuddle the teacher but she back off almost frightenned, thats why I put the link up, it's to easy to let hysteria and paranoia form our opinions but recognise when we are taking an issue to far beyond what is normal.

    I'm not saying that Jws haven't made mistakes in this area but my unbiased personal research and memories show this to be no better or worse than other organisations and religions, (the catholics actually do come up as unusual because their celebacy rules attracted men not interested in women/marraige to priesthood working alone in area's and so most of their cases are on boys this is also researcheable by anyone on google so don't take my word for it, look yourself)

    a measure of if you are approaching this subject without bias is how you research it and type it on google...it is a search engine which will only search the parameters you put in, so if all you google is 'Jw pedophiles' then that is all you will find out about, I checked silent lambs and even they have had to widen there scope because they couldn't just focus on the one group without looking specific in their agenda yet professing caring for all victims.

    Pedophilia is evil and personally I hope God shows no mercy to them but I think it is a world-wide issue that must be seen as such, from young girls in many countries sold into sexual slavery, to father's/step-fathers who think they can destroy their own children for their personal gratification, to internet groomers pretending to be children to gain access to other children. I say this only because I think there is a danger in thinking you only find pedophiles in one place whichever direction it is you are focusing.

    we have a responsibilty as parents to look after our children and take that responsibility seriously.

    I realise my words will have little impression on those who are using this subject as part of their agenda to discredit Jws but I only put what I have to those who are genuinely upset and worried, this is a subject we should be vigilant on in all it's aspects and not to let anyone's title whether it is elder/ms/Dr/Vicar/Priest/Manager/Teacher make you think they are safe but also not to be overwhelmed by hysteria either. Be careful but be realistic.

    Reniaa

  • Zico
    Zico

    "my unbiased personal research and memories"

    Is this a joke?

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