Your ideas about a disaster at WTS headquarters

by Mindchild 32 Replies latest jw friends

  • Skeptic
    Skeptic

    The JWs would be even more convinced that they have the truth because Satan was trying to persecuted/destroy them.

    This is the same religion that thinks over 100,000 people were killed in Rwanda because Satan "will go to any lengths just to kill 400 Jehovah's Witnesses in Rwanda." (When I heard that one, I felt very ill and realized how insignificant JWs feel non-JWs are).

    Not to mention the WTS would make lots of $$ from a disater. If they have any insurance, they would collect it. Then brothers would give generously to the WTS to rebuild. They'd make a fortune!

    Richard

  • Mindchild
    Mindchild

    In light of the further concerns about this threads intention and the potential for giving dangerous ideas to unstable individuals I wanted to make some additional comments and explain more carefully what kind of ideas I’m looking for.

    To start with, again I’m not looking for new and creative ways of killing people. You see, there are already expert killers who have done that research and they have published their unclassified findings and made them available to the public. An example of this is the U.S. Special Forces Unconventional Demolitions Manual (sometimes called the “Black Book”) that shows step-by-step methods of using common household chemicals and materials found in any local hardware store, to do everything from leveling skyscrapers with people still inside them to blowing up subways. This type of dangerous knowledge can even be found in your local college libraries and some public libraries and on the Internet. The cat is well out of the bag for anyone who is determined to go on a murderous killing spree, as we have seen already in America with even school kids making explosives and murdering dozens of people.

    In no way do I want to see anything like this happening to Witnesses or anyone else in this country or others. I’m even against capital punishment. You won’t see me posting instructions on here of how to make high explosives from toothpaste and motor oil, or converting insecticide into nerve gas. In fact, my hope is that any unstable individual gets immediate professional counseling to deal with the wounds created by exiting the Society.

    So, what then am I fishing for, and why am I fishing for this in the first place?

    For the last several days, I have been developing a theory about the evolutionary development of belief systems and specifically how some higher order belief structures turn pathological and virulent to kill their hosts. I have discovered a disturbing pattern of some memes (think of memes as being the biological counterpart of DNA) transforming themselves into dangerous pathogens when the right elements fall into place. I’m trying to discover if there are plausible scenarios in whereby the belief ideology of Jehovah’s Witnesses can switch from being mildly pathogenic (after all this is a known fact considering the number of people who have died from refusing blood transfusions or committed suicide) to massively pathogenic. No, I’m not talking about a Watchtower coming out that encourages everyone to start drinking cyanide laced Kool-Aid or to leap off a cliff. This is not in line with the conceptual idealization patterns found in the leadership of the JW’s. Just what do I expect to happen? I’m asking you this!

    Think like the GB. How does their collective mind work? If my guess is correct, these guys follow three basic principles in formulating their ideology. The first is: look for patterns. They look for patterns in the timing (remember all their predictions for the end of this system of things?) and patterns in ancient examples (…just as in the days of Noah, so it will be when You Know arrives.) The second memetic structure they follow is the rear view model of history. This is simply taking modern events and overlaying them upon old prophecies and trying to force fit them. Third, they have the belief that all parts of the Bible, even the nonsense in it, has some special meaning otherwise their God would not have bothered to see it preserved.

    Considering this, along with other stuff I probably not have thought through, what do you come up with if you play the same game? I’m not speculating in the least as to if your game model will be right, I think the Bible is little more than political propaganda designed to create an identity for a group of expatriate Canaanites to become a new nation with heavy overtones of mythological thinking. Anyway, it doesn’t matter if your idea is right, what is important is your idea believable to the Witness population. For example, if a disaster happened at WTS headquarters and it was the result of an horrible accident, like a fire that got out of control, and explosion that killed many people, an earthquake in New York that caused major structural collapse and killed some of the people there…how would this potentially change their doctrine? Do you think they would feel they were being punished for bad leadership? Would it be interpreted as a “test” like that of Job (not the Apple computer guy)?

    If the hypothetical disaster was a result of terrorism, say of some mentally disturbed dub or ex-dub, how do you think this would play out? Would they say blame ex-JW’s as being the Antichrist? What social fallout do you think would happen if an ex-JW were to blame? Do you think they would become like antiabortion protestors and start picketing ex-JW’s homes or worse?

    Of course, let us not forget the famous dub standby Armageddon is happening. What is it that you expect dubs to do if they really surely thought Armageddon had started? Would they run naked in the streets? Would they quit their jobs? Would they pack up all their stuff and head to a National Forest or remote campground? Would they say make desperate attempts to kidnap their children who had left the “truth” and try to reprogram them to get saved at the last minute? What would you have done when you were a dub and you thought the big day was here?

    Some comments now on a few posts…

    Proplog2 suggested that a nuclear attack might happen from terrorism or otherwise but I have to agree with Abaddon that if the Taliban had these at their disposal, they would have used them by now and it would more likely be in Washington DC. Abaddon did raise an interesting idea about a coup in the Witness leadership. That would certainly make the dice roll unpredictably but my guess is that anyone not of the “anointed” isn’t allowed in the “theocratic pow-wow” and if they were invited, it would be someone they knew for a long time that followed the party line to a T. Avengers brought up the point that some Kingdom halls have indeed been bombed and burned. This demonstrates that the terrorism scenario is not that remote. I don’t know if any Witnesses have been injured or killed in such acts of violence but I don’t think that would be a deterrent if someone had lost their mind and wanted payback.

    Wendy brought up the good point about the fear factor. If something really nasty happened, would the mainstream dub be too frightened to leave or would the Kingdom Halls be deserted? If something happened to the USA headquarters, would the other branches take over? It would seem to me that the UK branch would be the logical choice in that case. Skeptic says they will be more convinced they have the truth...would this increase their membership roles?

    Okay, a few more ideas for you: what about rampant mental illness between the JW’s? It happened after 1975 you know. Can you think of any scriptural examples of something akin to terrorism happening to the JW’s? Do you think the dubs would switch from their preaching work to going around and telling everyone…your going to get it now sucker?

    Skipper

  • ballistic
    ballistic

    Kis had a go at me about a Sep 11th / Watchtower building joke I made a while back, but in all seriousness, I think Kis is right to pull you up.
    The easiest way to get a site shut down would be to have statements posted sanctioning terroism. Sites do get shut down and I feel sure (at least I hope) that Simon is aware of this.
    You must also all be aware that there are people who would like to see it shut down.

  • Simon
    Simon

    I don't think this discussion is very nice or serves any purpose.

    How different would it make us from the JWs we condemn for being glad of the WTC devastation?

    However much I dislike the WatchTower society, the things they have done, the rules they make and the hurt they cause people I don't think that the individuals in Brooklyn are "deserving of death".

    Posts like this do absolutely nothing to help the exJW community and just give the WTS ammunition to tell how 'evil' we are IMHO. There is also the real danger of crackpots taking things seriously.

    How credible is our outage of the WatchTower article lamenting the fact that they cannot kill ex-members if we are posting the same sort of thing against them?

    We have the moral high ground ... let's make sure we keep it!

  • OUTLAW
    OUTLAW

    Hey Simon,I couldn`t agree more.Good post!...OUTLAW

  • D wiltshire
    D wiltshire

    I think the thread is harmless.
    BTW if someone starts to post in a way that indicates they intend to do harm many here will admonish such a poster.

    And I'm sure Simon would take appropiate action.

    I think Mind child meant no harm and is being taken the wrong way by people who are prone to quickly see thing in a paranoid way.

    If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
  • OUTLAW
    OUTLAW

    Hey D wiltshire,I dont think Skipper meant any harm either,but Simons post has a lot of merit.With all the terrorist activity going on,this thread might give someone the wrong idea about the kind of people on this board..MERRY CHRISTMAS...OUTLAW

  • D wiltshire
    D wiltshire

    Outlaw,

    If you see possible danger in Mc thread, how do you feel about TV shows, or movies with a terrorist plot that some demented fool might get the wrong idea?
    Do you feel they are bad and should be watched or discussed?

    If someone lived a trillion X longer than you, and had a billion X more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?
  • Mindchild
    Mindchild

    Hi Simon and Outlaw,

    A few points about your comments. First this post isn't supposed to be nice. Nice has nothing to do with it. What it is relevant to is NOT sticking our collective heads in the sand and to examine if there is any potential chance of a totalizing religion going from mildly dangerous to moderately dangerous.

    Nobody is encouraging anyone to commit an act of terrorism against anyone. Even if terrorism is still a poignant subject to many people today the reactions to the events are almost always worse than the events themselves in terms of the harm done. The world still would have been shocked and horrified if say one of those airliners crashed into an assembly of Jehovah's Witnesses on Sept 11th but the secondary effects from what happened to the psyche of Jehovah's Witnesses could be even more deleterious. Perhaps it could have caused a massive triggering of suicides from dubs who suddenly got a religious disconfirmation of the worst kind.

    I think it is especially relevant to the ex-Jehovah's Witness community to realize the potential dangers of the fine print on the contract when you sign the dotted line. The JW belief system is not just another once-w-week feel good church service as we all know. Rather, it is a cult that uses brainwashing techniques, and emotional manipulation, not to mention advanced propaganda to attract and keep members.

    If you guys take the time to read carefully what I'm asking about, it might make you feel uncomfortable but this has nothing to do with morals, trying to scare dubs, or chit chat. I'm trying to get serious input from people who have been there of what might happen if there is a shocking event in the Borganization.

    Hope that helps you understand things better.

    Skipper

  • OUTLAW
    OUTLAW

    Hey D wiltshire,I understand the point your trying to make and I do believe in freedom of speach.(just read some of my posts! LOL)But I believe both ballistic and Simon make some very good points about this particular thread,and I agree with them.(I don`t want to stifle Skippers creative mind and boy does he have a creative mind!)Anyway thats just my own personel view point..HAVE A GOOD DAY EH...OUTLAW

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit