avi - normally I am quite outspoken. But there has been a lot of sickness in their family. Imo they are heading towards a crises especially now with all this armageddon fever.
edited to protect identity
stan my heart goes out to you
Can't speak with me, unless they need something
by Stan Conroy 69 Replies latest jw friends
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avishai
Gotcha. Which is why I said i can't say what i'd do in your situation. That's rough, anything I can do , lemme know.
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quietlyleaving
thanks avishai - Reniaa doesn't know the half of it. She knows the theory but in practice it is diabolical
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Mrs. Fiorini
Stan,
It is my understanding that "necessary family business" includes them needing your help since they are elderly and you are their son.
I'm so sorry you're being treated this way by your own parents. It hurts my heart to hear about it.
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boyzone
Hi Stan
I'm so sorry to hear this ridiculous request from your parents. They've just had heavy indoctrination on "how to treat a disfellowshipped person" at the book study meeting last week which I suspect is the source of their ultimatum.
I urge you NOT to be bullied by them.
As for the "we'll talk to you when we need something" clause, this would come under "necessary family business" which the book study article highlighted as an exception to the shunning.
This clause enables Witnesses to indeed have their cake and eat it, as you so aptly put it. In fact they allow themselves all sorts of clauses to speak when its convenient for THEM.
For example, I pass several sisters every morning at the school gate, they always ignore me despite my knowing them for many years as good friends. They've ignored me all the time I was alone in assisting my elderly Witness mum recover from bowel cancer. But as soon as one of them wanted a letter delivered to them, suddenly it was ok to ask me for it.
As soon as I gave the letter over, this sister went straight back to ignoring me again.
So be careful with this type of stunt. They write the rules to suit themselves but it ends up with you on the "will they speak, won't they speak" emotional rollercoaster.
I vowed after that not to ride that rollercoaster anymore. I'm not playing games to suit them.
In your situation I would give it time as I suspect your parents will bitterly regret giving you and your brother this ultimatum. They'll miss you and the grandkids too much.
This hardline is the Society speaking, not them.
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boyzone
Hi Stan.
This is the article studied in depth at the Congregation Book Study last week.
How should we treat a disfellowshipped person? The Bible says: "Quit mixing in
company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an
dolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man."
(1 Corinthians 5:11) Regarding everyone that "does not remain in the teaching of the
Christ," we read: "Never receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him. For he
hat says a greeting to him is a sharer in his wicked works." (2 John 9-11) We do not
have spiritual or social fellowship with disfellowshipped ones. The Watchtower of
September 15, 1981, page 25, stated: "A simple 'Hello' to someone can be the first
step that develops into a conversation and maybe even a friendship. Would we want
o take that first step with a disfellowshiped person?"
Is strict avoidance really necessary? Yes, for several reasons. First, it is a matter
of loyalty to God and his Word. We obey Jehovah not only when it is convenient but
also when doing so presents real challenges. Love for God moves us to obey all his
commandments, recognizing that he is just and loving and that his laws promote the
greatest good. (Isaiah 48:17; 1 John 5:3) Second, withdrawing from an unrepentant
wrongdoer protects us and the rest of the congregation from spiritual and moral
contamination and upholds the congregation's good name. (1 Corinthians 5:6, 7)
Third, our firm stand for Bible principles may even benefit the disfellowshipped one.
By supporting the decision of the judicial committee, we may touch the heart of a
wrongdoer who thus far has failed to respond to the efforts of the elders to assist
him. Losing precious fellowship with loved ones may help him to come "to his
senses," see the seriousness of his wrong, and take steps to return to Jehovah.
-Luke 15:17.What if a relative is disfellowshipped? In such a case, the close bond between
amily members can pose a real test of loyalty. How should we treat a
isfellowshipped relative? We cannot here cover every situation that may arise, but
et us focus on two basic ones.
In some instances, the disfellowshipped family member may still be living in the
ame home as part of the immediate household. Since his being disfellowshipped
oes not sever the family ties, normal day-to-day family activities and dealings may
ontinue. Yet, by his course, the individual has chosen to break the spiritual bond
etween him and his believing family. So loyal family members can no longer have
piritual fellowship with him. For example, if the disfellowshipped one is present, he
would not participate when the family gets together to study the Bible. However, if
he disfellowshipped one is a minor child, the parents are still responsible to instruct
nd discipline him. Hence, loving parents may arrange to conduct a Bible study with
he child.* -Proverbs 6:20-22; 29:17.
In other cases, the disfellowshipped relative may be living outside the immediate family circle and home. Although there might be a need for limited contact on some rare occasion to care for a necessary family matter, any such contact should be kept to a minimum. Loyal Christian family members do not look for excuses to have
dealings with a disfellowshipped relative not living at home. Rather, loyalty to
Jehovah and his organization moves. them to uphold the Scriptural arrangement of
disfellowshipping. Their loyal course has the best interests of the wrongdoer at heart
and may help him to benefit from the discipline received.* -Hebrews 12:11.
[Footnote]
* Bible principles on this subject apply equally to those who disassociate themselves
from the congregation.
* For more information about disfellowshipped minor children living in the home, see
The Watchtower of October 1, 2001, pages 16-17, and November 15,1988, page 20.
* For more information about how to treat disfellowshipped relatives, see the
Scriptural counsel discussed in The Watchtower of April 15, 1988, pages 26-31, and
September 15, 1981, pages 26-31.THis was also discussed on a thread posted by LUKEWARM
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independent_tre
Stan -
I can so empathize with what you're going through right now. What is pathetic is witnesses cannot see the duplicity of their actions when it comes to shunning, kind of a 'don't call us, we'll call you' relationship. No one needs to be exploited like that, especially when children are involved. I feel like I'm about to go through the same with my mother, yet i'm not DF or DA and have only recently stopped attending.
My mother never calls or emails just to see how me or my kids are anymore, it's always are you coming to this meeting or this assembly? The only thing I feel like to my mother is a high pressure sale. It's irritating and off-putting to realize that someone is feigning interest in your life, just to sell you a religion. I 'm done being passive.
I think the best thing anyone, including myself, in this situation can do is to prepare yourself for it mentally and prepare for the worst. Kind of a reverse shunning. Not in a spiteful way, but enough to let a person know that their actions are thoughtless and hurtful, and you will not allow yourself or your family to be treated this way.
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passwordprotected
@ Reniaa - "All of this only applies if you are disfellowshiped if you aren't then they are being very strict because we are allowed to associate with non-witnesses just have to be careful not to be drawn into unbiblical actions."
Unbiblical actions like shunning, perhaps? You still haven't shown me a scripture that says Christians are to shun.
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slimboyfat
I hardly think NT writers were any more enlightened than Witnesses on this issue. Witnesses did not invent the Christian conception of apostasy after all. Paul was as big a control freak as any of the governing body.
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maryacclaim
Stan, my father is a total tool as well at times. The WT tells them they can handle business and such with us, but not spiritual things. Yet, that is what he always does, brings out things he has read in the latest WT that he thinks will help me. Tell your parents that they are not following the FDS in this regard. When they call for something they need, tell them that if you were a Jdub you would tell them to suck it, but as a christian you feel the need to help the blind that are being led by the blind. Kill them with kindness and just let them know how great things are with your family and how wonderful your kids are doing, show them pictures and explain how they love your wifes parents so much. That should put them over the edge.
Reniaa, so you are a witness again? Using the term "We."
Password, you know the scriptures say stuff about "judging those in the cong. while god judges those outside." Or. "Not even eating with such a man, or saying a greeting." Now where you're right is, there is no scripture that says you should shun your family. There is no scripture that says if a husband commits a wrong he is no longer the spiritual head of the family, otherwise most of the men of old would not be the heads of their household. The WT would have ones beleive that once a member of the family gets DF'd, that he no longer should share in spiritual matters with the family. That is BS. Pure and simple!
MaryAcclaim