Personal experience of accepting Jesus as God, how was it for you?

by digderidoo 44 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  digderidoo

  I have decided to start another thread to the one on Jesus...God or God's son?

  The reason for this is that i started a thread really looking for personal experiences, looking for reasons those with a JW background would change their opinion on this. I wanted to know why those that believe that Jesus is God now feel this, whereas years ago they didn't.

  I think it's a shame the other thread has descended into a debate between Trinitarians and JW apologists, whereas only a couple of posters responded to my original post. That thread has re-enforced to me that Christians just can't even agree on the most central of doctrine. The handful (well less than a handful) of decent posts in the thread have been swallowed up between the arguments amongst Christians on this site. Had i have posted the other thread on a site like JWS where the OP can lock the thread i would have done, as the majority of responses had nothing to do with the OP. I accept that the OP cannot control how a thread goes here, but i would ask for any debates to be kept to that thread, not this one, as i am asking for personal experience of how you came to this decision.

  Please do not debate on this thread, i am asking for your personal experience of this, NOT trinitarian doctrine VS non-trinitarian doctrine. I have found the personal experiences of Christian friends interesting to me whilst i define my own spiritual path, but would like to hear those Christians with a JW background.

  For those that don't know here, i am a recovering alcoholic and using AA. The AA program is based upon spirituality, which 18 months ago was a massive issue to me, previous threads will show. I enjoy growing along a spiritual path now, love to learn from different philosophies and there is part of me that wonders whether i can take something from Christianity, rather than reject it outright as i did years ago. I now have a great respect for the bible, can learn from it and can live by many of the principles within, the thing however that does stop me attending a church is that i don't accept the divinity of Christ, even though i think he was a great teacher and a great man.

  So what CONVINCED you that Jesus is God?

  Paul
• 

  Black Sheep

  I became convinced that Jesus was God while I was reading Moffat's translation of the NT in the order in which it was written.

  Before I finished reading it I had formed the opinion that the Bible was not God's thoughts about man, but was only man's thoughts about god.

  I still haven't found any document that I would consider is God's thoughts about man.

  Cheers

  Chris
• 

  Narkissos

  I don't claim the "Christian" label currently but I can tell you more or less how I felt about it as I was reading the NT away from the WT -- over 20 years ago -- spontaneously focusing on Johannine literature, although I could easily find the same general pattern in other NT texts.

  I think that starting from strict monotheism I had not much choice but understanding Jesus as "God" revealing himself, i.e. as a dynamic process starting from the exclusive concept of "God" as separate from everything else ("creation") and ending (or unending) in the inclusive concept of "God" embracing everything. From this perspective a static, ontological definition of Christ as distinct from "God" in se didn't make sense anymore, in fact I perceived it as contrary to the very movement of revelation.

  One Pauline expression summed it up quite well for me: "in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself" (2 Corinthians 5:19; purposefully choosing the least "ontological" translation, here the NRSV, rather than the "heavier" one, "God was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself" -- from a dynamic perspective there is no difference actually).
• 

  sspo

  The issue has been debated for the last 2000 years and what you'll hear or read on this board is

  not going to settle it. If there is an almighty god, jealous, sitting someplace and expects exclusive devotion

  let him speak and settle the issue.

  Very simple solution.
• 

  Chalam

  Hi Paul,

  I was brought up in a Christian home. I learnt some bible stories and about Jesus. I made a promise to follow Him when I was young. To be honest, it there was no "Damascus road experience" and life continued. Come my teens, I was more into the "sex, drugs and rock and roll" than the church or faith. When I got to 16 my parents said "you are of age, do you want choose to come to church"? I said, "see you later".

  I ran my life for 20 years. Did what I though was best and what would please me. Certainly made a lot of bad choices and did some bad things. Life wasn't all bad, there were some good things. However, easily overall my life was like the weather here in the UK, many grey days and gloomy weather. I felt much emptiness and a lack of purpose in life. The average person would say I was "depressed" but to me there was a spiritual pain and a deep emptiness.

  God would call me. It is hard to describe the "pull" of the Holy Spirit. I remember actually telling God to leave me alone one day in my bathroom here!

  Anyhow, that kind of thing happened quite a few times over the years. However, I would drown Him out and "get on with life".

  September 11th 2001 was a big one. A friend told me to turn the TV on. I sat and watched all day. Come the evening I called my Dad and was crying. I thought it was judgement day! He told me to come and see him the next day. So I did. That was a huge step of faith for me.

  We spoke about what was going on in the world and faith. I never entertained spiritual talk for 20 years but now the time had come. Deep down, I knew it always would. They asked me what I believed. I told them that was why I was there, I obviously had some faith. We talked some more, I remember we prayed and I went home.

  Back at home I had an amazing experience. The best I can describe was it was like I was high on drugs. I felt like I was on cloud nine, like all the heavy things that were weighing me down had been lifted from me. I literally could not stop smiling all day long. That was not me! I had a few laughs in the 20 years but I was not a happy person, not all day long. Anyhow, it went on for days. My wife knew something was up. See could feel it and see it! The thing is, after that initial step of faith, I drifted back to "normal" and the awesome feeling I had ebbed away. Certainly after a couple of weeks, I was back to my sad life of sex, drug and rock and roll. It is no party at all.

  About four years ago a long time friend said he had cancer. It looked bad and I didn't know if he would make it. However, he was a born again Christian. I have never told him about my upbringing but I did then. That was another step of faith for me. He was more at peace with his future than I was! From there on, I started to seek God. My friend gave me a copy of The Message bible. I found myself devouring it, reading loads. I started to pray.

  It has been an awesome journey :) I still have problems but I give them to Jesus. I have no heavy burdens and a positive outlook on life. Many things have changed and for the better. Jesus brings life to the full. Not a life of prohibition but a life of freedom from addictions and sin. There is much more I could say but I hope that give you an idea.

  I will leave you with this. It was a prophecy spoken after I left the church. My dad kept it, thinking it was for me and showed to to me that day in 2001, 14 years later. When I read it I said, "yes that is me". I wondered whether to post it here but have decided to go for it because it says so much about my journey and the God I now love with all my heart, soul and strength.

  I tell you, says the Lord, that I will not depart from you; I will never forsake you. I will always walk with you and I will never turn my back on you; no matter what you do with me; no matter how you treat me. I will not change my mind about you, for I have chosen you. I have selected you to be mine and as a result of this, says the Lord, I will follow you wherever you go. I don’t care what you do; I have put my hand upon you and will never take it off you.

  I am a God of an Everlasting Covenant. I do not break my Covenant, no matter what my people do, says God. Nor where my people go; no matter what my church may do, I will not forsake it. I will not turn back; I will not change my mind, for I have sworn, says the Lord, that I will save my people. I have pledged my word and I will say it to you, says God, I will pursue you. I will pursue you no matter what you do and I will plague you with My Spirit, not in order to discomfort but to bring you back to myself.

  For I have a heart for you, says God, an immense heart of love beyond your understanding, but it is not without the bounds of appreciation and understanding on your part that I will work out a work in your life that will amaze you. I will make your ears tingle, says God, for I will do things in your life that you never thought I would do. I will change you as you never thought you would be changed, for I have intended it says God, that you should have a good inheritance; that you should rejoice before Me; that you should enjoy me for ever, not in discomfort; not in amazement and distress but that you should enjoy Me with an understanding heart; an understanding mind and a welcoming spirit. For I desire you, says God, to enjoy me; to rejoice in Me; to be mine, just as I am yours.

  Dr Maurice Robinson, Elder

  Bracknell Baptist Church

  30.08.1987

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 

  Satanus

  When i was christian, i could see from what was written in the bible that jesus was god. However, my personal experience didn't indicate one way or the other. In fact, my personal experience was that there was no bible god. Whether or not there was or is a bible jesus spirit is an unanswered question for me, but not important.

  S
• 

  Deputy Dog

  So what CONVINCED you that Jesus is God?

  GOD .
• 

  Amazing

  Digder,

  Like you, I do not like to debate the Trinity, as nothing ever really gets accomplished, and understanding it, accepting it, or not accepting it, is not essential to salvation.

  I grew up Roman Catholic, and believed in the Trinity, as that is what Dominican nuns taught as part of our Catholic education. While the Trinity was not a big deal to me, I still found it a difficult doctrine.

  When I was about 20, I became a JW. One of the reasons is that I liked their approach to understanding that God is Jehovah the Father, and Jesus was his first creation, and thus the Son of God. I also found the 'personification' of the Holy Spirit to be interesting, but not entirely satisfying. But, as a JW, I accepted the Watchtower teachings on this topic.

  When I left the JWs, I did not return to belief in the Trinity. Instead, I stayed neutral, and did not judge anyone on this belief. I did not know what to believe for sure. When I later joined a Baptist Church, one of the conditions was acceptance of the Trinity. When I was quizzed by the pastor, I simply said that whatever the Bible teaches about God, I believe it. Wherever it says that Jesus is God, I believe it, and wherever is says the Holy Spirit is God, I believe it. I was accepted into Church membership. My response did not really say anything, because I never committed to anything outside the Bible.

  About four years ago, while engaged in long research project that took me about two or three years, I ended up reading all of the early Church writers. When I got to Ignatius, who was Bishop of Antioch while the Apostles Peter, Paul, and John were still alive, who was a student of John, a friend of Paul, and groomed by Peter to be Bishop, and who also died as a martyr, I felt I had found a very credible writer ... and he accepted Jesus as God. He had been a Bishop for over forty years when he died about the year 105 AD. I found that all of the early Christian writings that supported the Trinity, did so long before the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. And it was the writing of Ignatius that finally convinced me that Jesus is both God the Son, and the Son of God.

  When I read the Holy Spirit speaking in first person, and quoted expressing his will in the book of Acts ... and it was still that way in the NWT, as the Watchtower forgot to doctor up that verse, I knew that the Holy Spirit was a person. His speaking in first person in a historical narrative does not lend itself to the poetic tool of personification ... it was a slam dunk. Acts 13:2: And as they were ministering to the Lord, and fasting, the Holy Ghost said to them: "Separate me Saul and Barnabas, for the work whereunto I have taken them."

  Finally, a 2nd century writer that is universally accepted, Tertullian (160 AD to 225AD) - over a hundred years before the Council of Nicaea, made the most eloquent argument in great detail for the Trinity in his book, Against Praxaes. See: http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/tertullian17.html About 20 years earlier, Clement of Alexandria also clearly detailed the Trinity. And, of course, Ignatius of Antioch was clear about Jesus being God in the year 105 AD. These early Christian writers fought all sorts of heresies and in so doing, laid out a long path of history that culminated in the Council of Nicaea in 325 and in 391. These Ecumenical Councils decided against Arian, who attended, while Athanasius was barred from attending. The Council based its decision on early Christian writings and long accepted Christian teaching. I could no longer continue the believe the fraud the JWs promoted. So, I re-accepted the Trinity.

  I still do not judge what anyone believes. I do not like to debate the issue, as I prefer to let people believe what they will. And, acceptance of the Trinity is not a requirement for salvation ... but I believe that when one does accept it, it makes the faith fuller, richer, and more meaningful to know that not just some creature came to earth to live among us and die, but it was a person of God himself. And that when the person of the Holy Spirit dwells in us, it is really being a part of God Himself.
• 

  BurnTheShips

  When I read the Holy Spirit speaking in first person, and quoted expressing his will in the book of Acts ... and it was still that way in the NWT, as the Watchtower forgot to doctor up that verse, I knew that the Holy Spirit was a person. His speaking in first person in a historical narrative does not lend itself to the poetic tool of personification ... it was a slam dunk. Acts 13:2: And as they were ministering to the Lord, and fasting, the Holy Ghost said to them: "Separate me Saul and Barnabas, for the work whereunto I have taken them."

  Indeed!!!

  BTS
• 

  snowbird

  I'd been told by Christians I met at the doors that Jesus is God, but know-it-all-JW that I was, I thought they were fools.

  However, as I began researching how WT had doctored up John 8:58, the Holy Spirit revealed to me that Jesus is indeed God.

  Initially, I struggled with this, but had to admit that it solved another problem for me.

  That problem was, why God would send someone else to deal with His less than palatable situation?

  The answer? He didn't; He took it upon Himself to straighten out the mess in which we find ourselves.

  My respect for Him skyrocketed after realizing this!

  Peace to you in your search, Paul.

  Sylvia