> Hope for a cure
I get what you're saying. Sadly sometimes the pain is too much to wait through.
Right to Die Issue Terminally Ill, Hopelessly Paralized, Etc..What Are Your Thoughts?
by frankiespeakin 57 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Opus92
I do feel also that there are some people because of severe economic problem or chronic depression should be allowed by the state to end there pain and suffering in a dignified way especially if no cure exist for them.
I totally agree. I think anyone should have the right to die. There are worse things than death.
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sammielee24
ut where to draw the line? And who makes the decision whether there is no longer a cure or hope? If a person's thinking is distorted by mental illness or, arguably, by cult-speak, is their decision truly theirs? There have even been cases where terminal or hopeless patients have been "cured" and gone on to find quality of life. I'm thinking "quality of life" might be a key factor.
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Mental illness is a reality for many people who are suicidal already and thus we cannot say that they have no right nor the ability to make their own choice. Their reality is in part their illness, we are not linked to their reality in the same way so therefore, we try to judge outside their norm and really can't do so. I think it hurts us more sometimes for their loss and suicide is different than death with dignity - would be be better able to cope ourselves is they had this outlet and would they be better able to cope if they had it? sammieswife.
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AdaMakawee
A terminally ill patient that has been diagnosed by the two doctors, that MAY get the sympathy factor from people, but when you start talking about chronic depression, thats where you lose most people on the right to die stuff. I support 100% the right of the terminally ill to die with dignity, but I don't support depressed individuals being given the right to commit suicide. This is a treatable condition. The problem here is that we stigmatize mental illness in this country (the US), and insurance doesn't cover it or doesn't cover it adequately. With therapy and sometimes drugs, people can live happy productive lives.
Ada
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frankiespeakin
I think one of the most profound influences on a westerner's view of death is the Christan doctrine be it living forever on a paradise earth like the JWs teach or immortality in heaven as the mainline churches teach. Either way its appeal is to somehow negate the fear of death through flights of wishful thinking in a supreme being able to remove the "sting of death" by granting those obedient to church doctrine a much improved after life of blissful living.
This indoctrination I think is a main reason for our accentuated fear of death and dying and not coming to terms with it and societies laws which seek to enforce a policy that doesn't take into account a persons natural rights to exist or not to exist even when existence is faced with unendurable pain that could be avoided by a painless ending of life process.
And when i say natural rights I'm referring not to "government granted rights" but something on a much higher plane to which thinking persons not too heavily indoctrinated by religion can universally agree. I do think that is what the constitution meant when it said " We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" to transgress these rights by state or federal law is therefore unconstitutional but subject to a judges religious indoctrination they may be violated.
I remember working at a home for the mentally retarded (I only lasted for 3 weeks it was all I could take) and there were certain patients that would take any chance they could get to end there life drink bleach or Drano and so they had to be watch constantly. To me it seemed so cruel when a person may be suffering to that extent and nobody would allow them to do something that would end their suffering so I couldn't take it and got another job.
As I was one of Jehovah's indoctrinated Witnesses at the time and we were taught that ending ones life was a crime against God and a form of self murder but the experience really got me thinking.
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frankiespeakin
Sammie,
I agree with you as to,, where do we draw the line? Me, myself, personally, feel we should respect that person's wishes.
I do feel that if a person is suffering intolerable mental pain that he should be sent to a couple of psychiatrist that would try perhaps to dissuade him but if he is determine then his wishes should be respected and be allowed and even given reasonable assisted to do it as painlessly as possible.
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Opus92
frankiespeakin, that's it exactly.
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metatron
I gotta be negative about this topic, folks. Here's why.
"Oh come on, Grandma, you've had a full life, don't you want to meet Jesus in Heaven?"
The Wall Street Journal published a wise editorial on this topic years ago. They raised common sense questions about the lunacy of people begging a Congressional committee to be killed off. So, you can protest to politicians but can't competently kill yourself? Not credible.
Admittedly, there are a few paralyzed people who couldn't kill themselves but even in this situation there is caution: a great many paralyzed people want to be alive and have no inclination towards death. Yeah, I've known some.
In the Netherlands, doctors have admitted that they ignore ethical guidelines about euthanasia, regardless of the law. I say keep the government as far away as possible from legalized euthanasia. If you don't, I can only hope you end up surrounded by greedy relatives waiting for your planned death. Or government bureaucrats who say "Ok, you've lived long enough". Sarah Palin may not be that bright but economic necessity could easily enforce 'death panels'.
OK, beyond the above what really gets me angry (controlling myself here) is that people spend time and effort on this morbid subject instead of investing it in a future that might include regeneration of any organ in the body and an indefinite lifespan of good health. Too much God d*m f**king time is spent on war, idiotic celebrity, TV, and other crap that could be spent in developing the greatest freedoms of all: freedom from sickness and death thru technological development!
Good Grief!
metatron
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frankiespeakin
Met,
I'm glad we finally got an opposing veiw, but just the same I would like to comment on some of your argument.
OK, beyond the above what really gets me angry (controlling myself here) is that people spend time and effort on this morbid subject instead of investing it in a future that might include regeneration of any organ in the body and an indefinite lifespan of good health. Too much God d*m f**king time is spent on war, idiotic celebrity, TV, and other crap that could be spent in developing the greatest freedoms of all: freedom from sickness and death thru technological development!
Good Grief!
Being realist here, what about in the meantime, as in now when they don't have all the cures and a person is suffering with no escape in sight but death? Should we all just have the attitude lets not discuss this morbid subject, it's too negative, to hell with them let them keep on suffering perhaps if they hold on long enough they might live to see that day when everybody can get a brand new body and just drop their brain inside it. It sounds all well and rosy to just say instead of talking about dying lets talk about something more nice and pleasant like a pie in the sky miracle cure for all the diseases that plague mankind and the possibility of everlasting life(albeit on an over crowded planet) and like that is ever going to happen in mine or your life time.
Granted the subject may be morbid but at least it is realistic. An it may really be of help to some of us in the future because life is full of uncertainty and some of this stuff is good to know.
And as I grow older and my body is headed towards that eventuality to me it's time to start thinking about what to do if I ever become helpless and might face years of life with others having to wipe my ass and a dreary existence. To me it is quite natural and realistic to think about if I would ever let that happen and if it looks inevetable what i could do to avoid it and spare myself the uneccessary pain.