Meet the biggest APOSTATE in history---he started it all: MARCION!!

by Terry 34 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Terry
    Terry

    Meet MARCION.

    Quite a guy.

    Very influential.

    In many ways, just like you and me! You see, he was an APOSTATE!

    Just like you and me, he didn't start out that way. Noooooo....

    He was a convert and a true believer. But--like you and me, he was also a THINKER in a world where conformity was expected when it came

    to belief in Jesus, religion and "right" doctrine.

    He changed the course of Christianity. Here is his story...

    MARCION was born in a Greek colony on the Black Sea used as a trade route and port. Travellers in and out of Sinope, Turkey brought wonderous tales with them about a Great Teacher named Jesus who may have been the long awaited Jewish Messiah.

    This was a little over 50 years after the execution by the Romans of a wonder-worker whom some associates of his claimed might well be divine.

    Marcion's father was a wealthy ship owner and Bishop who filled young Marcion's ears with wonderful stories of god's benevolence, forgiveness and promises of a better life. These stories were a stark contrast to the tales of Jewish sailors and travellers to the port of Sinope, however.

    Jews would describe horrific deeds their God (Jehovah) had wrought upon mankind slaying the whole world of humanity in a flood and burning alive the citizens of Sodom and Gomorrah, commanding the slaughter of any who opposed Him.

    Marcion's logical greek mind began to work. On the one hand there was the Jesus who offered love and forgiveness and hope and on the other hand there was the violent and angry Jehovah spreading threats and doom. Something didn't fit right. There was something rotten in the dissonance Marcion had not worked out yet.

    When Marcion was still a young man, the letters of a Roman citizen and Jewish evangelist named Paul began to circulate through the churches.

    Marcion's father, the Bishop, undoubtedly shared these epistles and the exhortations to follow Christ and leave the old world behind.

    Marcion responded! He had a heart for service to this God and his son Jesus that would burn with enthusiasm for years to come! He became a Bishop himself, a brilliant leader and original thinker whose sermons and writings inspired thousands to action.

    Only one problem. It was a big problem, as it turned out--Marcion's sermons were ORIGINAL thoughts. Marcion had figured out something on his own and you weren't, it seems, allowed to think for yourself like that. His teachings didn't match the Jewish christian teachings which were becoming more and more authoritative and exclusionary.

    THE JEWS, who were Christians, demanded that any converts to Christianity had to be JEWISH first and Christian only additionally like a cherry on top of a sundae! This meant you had to believe in and worship the Old Testament Jehovah! You know, the ANGRY one! The slayer of millions!

    No way! Marcion wasn't having any of that!

    For Marcion it was Jesus and Paul only! Forget that Jewish Jehovah and his serial killer mentality!

    The best you could say about Jehovah was that He had created the world. But, obviously Jehovah had grown to hate mankind! As a kind of heavenly tyrant, Jehovah had tried to pass laws to hold man in check punishing him for evey infraction of his legalistic transgression.

    When man didn't turn out to be the unquestioning worshipper Jehovah had imagined--divine wrath began working misery and oppression and death on the populations of Earth.

    Marcion lived in a GREEK colony, remember? The Greeks had a different sensibility about the divine than the Jews. For Marcion, it was no stretch of the imagination to see there must be TWO competing deities: JEHOVAH vs THE HEAVENLY FATHER whose son became Jesus the Christ.

    JEHOVAH got possession of the Jews and the HEAVENLY FATHER sought to ransom by sacrfice the rest of mankind through Jesus paying their debt.

    Quite a radical contrast to either Judaism or the still very young Jewish-Christian proto-religion.

    MARCION's Christianity only needed PAUL's teachings (after all--Paul had actually encountered the living Jesus!) and the Jesus stories circulating like a modern day bestseller around the world.

    THERE WAS NO FIXED CANON! There was no "New Testament". There were no boundries. Christianity was whatever--by whomever--make-it-up-as-you-go. This was Marcion's world. He played by his own rules, thinking, logic and individuality. Take it or leave it.

    Tens of thousands of people ended up listening and AGREEING!

    Clearly, there was going to be a 3 way competition for believers!

    JUDAISM

    Christian-JUDAISM

    MARCION'S Pauline Christianity

    In any competition there is conflict. In any conflict there is a grappling, debate, accusations, framing of issues and power struggle. Somebody is winner-take-all and the other competitor's are yesterday's news.

    MARCION almost won!!

    With Marcion's version of things you did not have to learn Judaism, become circumcised, bring sacrifices to Jerusalem (which had been destroyed anyway), observe countless Jewish rituals--you only had to accept Jesus and believe! The only stories you had to accept were the letters from Paul and the miracle stories of Jesus helping people and teaching great things about his new Kingdom and benevolent Heavenly Father!

    Oh my! The backlash was intense. You better believe it was intense.

    Jewish-Christians were first JEWS and you didn't mess with their Torah! Marcion ignored the Torah and spoke slightingly of Jewish religion as horror stories of a raving maniac primitive God! They went berserk at these teachings.

    What? A merciful Heavenly Father who loves you and accepts you and will save you WITHOUT SACRIFICE AND RITUAL?? OBSCENE!!

    You can imagine the arguments.

    A very interesting thing happened next.

    Marcion took a look at all the stories that were circulating about Jesus and his Apostles and Paul's letters. Which ones were reliable and which ones were obvious fairytales?

    It was MARCION HIMSELF who developed the idea of a TRUE CANON of scripture! Like Thomas Jefferson after him and the modern day Jesus Seminar--Marcion ommitted anything that sounded ridiculous! That was his test. If it didn't make sense--GET RID OF IT!!

    Ironically, in the Protestant rebellion against the Catholic Church, young Martin Luther did the very same thing. He removed 7 of the books of the then canonical Bible and wanted to get rid of others as well!. (Luther made an attempt to remove the books of Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation from the canon.)

    Here is a brief snippet from Wikipedia (which you can verify by your own research, if you like):

    His canon included ten Pauline Epistles and one gospel [4] called the Gospel of Marcion, plus a rejection of the whole Hebrew Bible, and did not include the rest of the books later incorporated into the canonical New Testament. He propounded a Christianity free from Jewish doctrines with Paul as the reliable source of authentic doctrine. Paul was, according to Marcion, the only apostle who had rightly understood the new message of salvation as delivered by Christ. [5]

    Lions and Tigers and Bears, Oh my!!

    You might well wonder how the (what later became an entrenched Catholic) church might deal with such an original thinker.

    Ask yourself how the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses might deal with such a person! Here you have the equivalent of a RAYMOND FRANZ publishing radical revisions of everything you are saying is God's channel of communication and this upstart is contradicting you!!

    And remember--Marcion was a wealthy shipowner living in a center of trade! He was rich! But--Marcion had no ill will toward the other Jewish-Christian brotherhood at all. How do we know he wasn't simply an evil slave, an Agnostic Hellion? In the year 144 Marcion contributed 200,000 Sesterces to the Church of Rome! (A sesterce was a gold-copper coin.)

    The Church was so embarrassed by his act of charity (and angry at his large following) they immediately sent back the money and disfellowshipped him (EXCOMMUNICATION!)

    Marcion's biggest mistake (looking back) was moving to Rome itself where his followers and teachings and version of a canonical scripture would be right in the faces of the Jewish-Christian leadership. It would be like moving across the street from the Watchtower Building and setting up shop!

    The official Church started copying Marcion's idea of creating a canon of true scripture by insisting on their own "approved" stories and excluding the ones they didn't like.

    Since the Roman army had destroyed the Jewish center of worship in Jerusalem in 70 A.D. it seemed MARCION's rejection of JUDAISM had been proved correct in terms of God's own view of things. Marcion had gained ground, stature and converts in a world and time where there was safety in numbers. There was no room on the landscape for TWO christianities!

    Official Authoritarian pronouncements against Marcion and his ideas began to be circulated, published and made official by the Church. He became the very first person accused of HERESY. A new charge and a new "crime" as it were. This man set the stage for the rest of us throughout history to be marginalized and shut off from a fair hearing by official pronouncement of doom from ecclesiastical authority.

    Further, Marcion, by being EXCOMMUNICATED could not be viewed as a christian any longer. Insults were heaped upon him by the brotherhood that only days earlier were given a lavish donation by the same "brother". He was now referred to by the words: FIRSTBORN OF SATAN.

    If not the first Apostate, surely the Greatest to ever challenge the authority of others in the church.

    Ahhh, Christianity!

    Marcion's writings were at first banned, then seized, then burned by the Church which could not tolerate a competing testimony.

    Nothing remained by way of physical evidence he had ever existed. Had the Church won? Not exactly.....

    For years and years to come, various prominent Christian writers (who mysteriously seemed to have access to Marcion's banned writings) continued to "DEBATE" him in their own apologetic works. By quoting his teachings they inadvertently PRESERVED A RECORD OF THEM!

    It is because of Marcion's enemies not being able to let go--that we know anything at all about him today. We know of the insults, ad hominem attacks and reputation damage wrought by his fellow christians in trying to make him a curse to others,

    Why should we care?

    What is our interest today in the story of the first heretic and Apostate?

    Personally, I think we can say the following:

    1. Marcion organized his own community opposite the established church and continued to speak what he thought was truth. His was a model of the Anti-Watchtower work done on Discussion Group here on the internet such as jehovahs-witness.net

    2. Marcion divided the existing stories circulating into two groups: Logical, believable and true and bullshit. He wasn't afraid to think for himself. Today we divide the Watchtower writings from critical-historical-textual writings and emphasized the difference to demonstrate false teachings.

    3. Marcion's teachings were viral. They almost won the competition for hearing ears to decide what is true. His teachings were banned and destroyed and yet we are discussing them today in 2010 in this Topic!

    Marcion is our brother, in a way. He took the heat before it was cool! :)

    LONG LIVE his model of APOSTACY.

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    Meet the biggest APOSTATE in history---he started it all: MARCION!!

    Not really. Simon Magus came before him. Marcion got a lot of his ideas from Simon Magus.

    Regarding Marcion, Polycarp the student of the Apostle John, and a martyr as well:

    But Polycarp also was not only instructed by apostles, and conversed with many who had seen Christ, but was also, by apostles in Asia, appointed bishop of the Church in Smyrna, whom I also saw in my early youth, for he tarried [on earth] a very long time, and, when a very old man, gloriously and most nobly suffering martyrdom, departed this life, having always taught the things which he had learned from the apostles, and which the Church has handed down, and which alone are true. To these things all the Asiatic Churches testify, as do also those men who have succeeded Polycarp down to the present time -- a man who was of much greater weight, and a more stedfast witness of truth, than Valentinus, and Marcion, and the rest of the heretics. He it was who, coming to Rome in the time of Anicetus caused many to turn away from the aforesaid heretics to the Church of God, proclaiming that he had received this one and sole truth from the apostles -- that, namely, which is handed down by the Church. There are also those who heard from him that John, the disciple of the Lord, going to bathe at Ephesus, and perceiving Cerinthus within, rushed out of the bath-house without bathing, exclaiming, "Let us fly, lest even the bath-house fall down, because Cerinthus, the enemy of the truth, is within." And Polycarp himself replied to Marcion, who met him on one occasion, and said, "Dost thou know me?" "I do know thee, the first-born of Satan."

    So the Polycarp had a pretty strong opinion regarding Marcion.

    It was MARCION HIMSELF who developed the idea of a TRUE CANON of scripture!

    Marcion collected books according to his own personal opinion. I could do the same if I wished. That's not a canon. The Apostles could claim their authority came from their appointment by Jesus to lead the new church. Marcion taught against what the Apostles taught, while the last of these same Apostles may still have been living and breathing. Polycarp above received what John had taught him under the authority given to him directly by Jesus. Marcion wasn't an Apostle appointed by Jesus. He had no authority beyond his own personal opinion. That he carried away a number of disciples was something that the Apostles had already seen happen and had foreseen would continue.

    Marcion's sermons were ORIGINAL thoughts.

    As compared to what unoriginal thoughts? Apostolic Christianity was radically original at that time. Jesus had never rejected the Scriptures, and neither had Paul, who's letters themselves made up part of Marcion's compendium. Paul himself extensively used the Hebrew Scriptures in his own letters, and said that Scripture was useful for Christians. That isn't original, unless you want to call it original illogicity.

    BTS

  • Terry
    Terry

    Polycarp the student of the Apostle John

    We don't know who JOHN was. Some people want to ASSUME it was the Apostle. As though there was only one John in the world!

    Marcion wasn't an Apostle appointed by Jesus

    And we KNOW others were for sure? How? THEY say so? Gee, that's great proof! What about people who see Elvis?

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips

    So how do you know who Marcion was? You are basing your thesis on his being the original APOSTATE. You admit all you've got of his philosophy are scraps written by those writing against him, and you quote Iraneaus regarding his being the Son of Satan.

    Besides, Marcion wasn't terribly original. A lot of his ideas regarding the God of the OT and the relationship with Jesus came from Simon Magus.

    BTS

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    His canon included ten Pauline Epistles and one gospel called the Gospel of Marcion, plus a rejection of the whole Hebrew Bible, and did not include the rest of the books later incorporated into the canonical New Testament. He propounded a Christianity free from Jewish doctrines with Paul as the reliable source of authentic doctrine. Paul was, according to Marcion, the only apostle who had rightly understood the new message of salvation as delivered by Christ.

    Meh.

    Seems like he was an anti-Semitic upstart.

    Christianity can never be free from its Jewish roots.

    The Messiah is a Jew; the 12 original apostles are Jews; when the Savior arrives, His Feet are going to touch down upon Jewish soil.

    Sylvia

  • Terry
    Terry

    Mr. Grumpy (Burn the ships)

    So how do you know who Marcion was? You are basing your thesis on his being the original APOSTATE. You admit all you've got of his philosophy are scraps written by those writing against him, and you quote Iraneaus regarding his being the Son of Satan.

    Besides, Marcion wasn't terribly original. A lot of his ideas regarding the God of the OT and the relationship with Jesus came from Simon Magus.

    As if that matters!

    His story is interesting whether or not he was the first he was the GREATEST apostate until Martin Luther!

    Radical critics have an interesting alternative view of Simon Magus:

    According to radical critic Hermann Detering, Simon Magus may be a proxy for Paul of Tarsus, [16] with Paul originally been detested by the church, and the name changed when Paul was rehabilitated by virtue of forged Epistlescorrecting the genuine ones

  • Sam Whiskey
    Sam Whiskey

    1. The Jews (as a nation) were not Christians, they (the Jews) rejected Christ as God's son. On the other hand, there were Jews that became Christians as followers of Christ.

    2. On every occasion where Jehovah pronounced a death sentence, it was justified. Gotta have rules or chaos ensues.

    Why are people so consumed with finding alternative answers to the truth about the way Jehovah is?

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    His story is interesting whether or not ....

    Well, sure, it's interesting. But I don't consider myself an apostate from Christianity, just from an apostate offshoot of Christianity.

    It's an interesting subject for discussion, I'm not wanting to quell it. I'm just pointing out where I think your post is off, that's all.

    Radical critics have an interesting alternative view of Simon Magus:

    That's an interesting speculation.

    I'll go be grumpy on another thread if you want Terry. Still love ya though. Nice to have you back on the board.

    BTS

  • Terry
    Terry

    Snowbird offers the following:

    Seems like he was an anti-Semitic upstart.

    Christianity can never be free from its Jewish roots.

    The Messiah is a Jew; the 12 original apostles are Jews; when the Savior arrives, His Feet are going to touch down upon Jewish soil.

    Sylvia

    Marcion was anti-Jehovah and considered Judaism superflous to Christianity. He lived in a time in which Judaism seemed to have been all but extinguished. Remember, Marcion was born about a decade and a half after the center of Jewish worship and sacrifice in Jerusalem was utterly wiped out!

    If the Watchtower buildings had gone down on 9-11 it could not be more devastating for Jehovah's Witnesses could it? Same thing.

    It wouldn't mean much to say Marcion was an Anti-Semite because Paul was a Semite and so was Jesus. It would be a logical absurdity!

    Marcion was logical He was against the old testament god Jehovah and not the nationality or genetic makeup of practioners. Why would, say, a KKK leader give 200,000 to the United Jewish Appeal as a parallel? No, official Christianity was still Jewish enough when Marcion donated the money. No anti-semite at all in my opinion.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Maricon's "mistake" was to think that there were "two gods", Jehovah and The Father.

    he didn't understand that Jesus, the personification of all the God is, came to us to explain that the OT and Old covenant was WRONG, it was obsolete, it had been fullfied ( the prohetic parts that is) in Jesus.

    Maricon didn't understand Paul's message the the Jews were incorrect in theri worhsip of God, he is NOT Jehovah, his is, as Jesus said, Our Father.

    Many of his views I agree with, as would most christians, he issue was "denying" what was there, the Jewish background and interpretaing it to be different than even what Paul stated.

    Too bad he didn't read John's Gospel, it would have made him understand Jesus and his message better.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit