"Do not become unevenly yoked"--weird comment at meeting

by sd-7 32 Replies latest jw friends

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    All this is stupid. What they want is to prevent anyone from introducing the concept that there might be other viewpoints that are as valid as theirs. And, the ones that are "strongest" in the cancer shut out those that are just regular publishers or that sometimes pio-sneer. If the hounders start initiating the rules that only the strongest are allowed to marry, that will create a situation where any children are even more likely to be totally deprived of any fun instead of those who are allowed at least a measure of fun.

    Taken correctly, the scripture does have some validity. But, "bad associations" should be taken to mean those who insist that everything you do is something they tell you to. Different belief systems do present a challenge, just as interracial, intercultural, and inter-age group marriages do (that is, those where one person is a different race or culture, or is significantly older or younger than the other). But, that should not be an absolute barrier. Differences in these areas can be resolved. It's when one belief system is so flimsy that it needs drastic measures to preserve intact, along with a tyrannical system to impose such beliefs, that the problems become severe enough that any inter-marriage should be taken with extreme caution.

    True bad associations would include political and corporate leaders that like to force or defraud people into believing something that is harmful, religious leaders that exert force or extreme pressure to get people to comply, and those members that are in it for the power. Such people are not generally pleasant to be around for extended periods anyways, and most regular people would not be attracted to such bad associations anyway.

  • SirNose586
    SirNose586
    I heard a really bizarre comment at one of the recent meetings. Someone, in quoting this scripture, of course went with the usual doctrine of not marrying/dating someone who is not a JW. But one woman took it even further, by saying that this applied even to people INSIDE the congregation who 'weren't spiritual enough' or didn't have some magnificent spiritual goals in life. But the scripture says UNBELIEVERS, so how can you apply it to BELIEVERS because they don't happen to want to pioneer or something?
    Of course. Like everything else, it applies "in principle". Using that logic, you really could justify anything. Just another example of why I see no need to just go along with this religion.
    --Christopher

    I'm going to play Idiot's Advocate here and say that this über-dub isn't entirely off base with her comment. She wanted to apply this scripture to believers too, which is not the best application. But I think the concept of "not being unevenly yoked" works itself out anyway. For example, I'm sure you all would tend to notice the cliques that would develop inside the hall: the über-dub pioneer weirdos, the ladder-climbing ass-kissers, the young people who were in it for the social aspect, etc. Do you think the social young people would look for the pioneer weirdos? It most certainly did not happen. There was a major social wall between us (in the brief time that I tried to become the cool dub kid instead of the ladder-climbing ass-kisser), and we were fine with it. What ends up happening is that all the cool kids look amongst the other cool kids for friendship and dating. Whenever I'd hear about a marriage or a proposal, I'd think, "Isn't that funny? That guy just went for his best friend's sister!" It was pretty funny to see how much they stuck rigidly within their social spheres, in defiance of Watchtower logic (namely, that only a "spiritually mature" pioneer weirdo person is worth looking at). But I would never see the pioneer weirdos crossing the aisle to look for a cool kid dub, or vice versa. You might see a pioneer weirdo hook up with a ladder-climber, but the ladder-climbers are smart enough to know when rules can be broken or ignored, which is slightly different from the adoring weirdos' outlook on dubbery.

    So really, what she's saying works out in the end. But she didn't need to proclaim this as if it were some sort of new sacred truth.

  • Quillsky
    Quillsky
    There was one of the ANOINTED in a congregation that I visited ... She was one of the 144,000 ... and she got the answer to one of the Watchtower questions wrong. How is that possible?!

    Closed-minded post, sacolton. If we're going to criticize this aspect of the organization let's do it on the basis of the bizarreness of the 144,000 teaching, not on the basis of one little old lady being a regular human.

  • nugget
    nugget

    The purpose of the organisation is control so this is another example of people within doing self examination to see if they measure up to ideals. According to teachings of the WTBTS the sister is not completely off base. We were often taught to judge others on the basis of their spirituality and make judgements as a result. That is why people who start to fade are treated warily by the rest of the congregation and there is a judgemental tone when talking to you. Potential partners can be rejected on the basis that they do not exhibit the right level of spirituality. After all spititual weakness is one step away from apostasy.

  • TheOldHippie
    TheOldHippie

    I never liked this "spiritually weak" - labelling, 'cause it was always followed by the appeal to at least to a certain extent "avoid" these people. Not invite, not hang out with, not spend time together with etc. But if there were people who OUGHT to be included, these "spiritually weak" ones should be the ones - in order to include them, strengtehn them, lift them up, make them strong. If you're weak and left alone - it just ain't much to do but to grow even weaker. But if someone spent time with you and tried to invest in you - chances are at least way better that you'd be stronger. So I always felt one ought to spend time with these ones, and then let the stronger ones be more alone - cause they'd probably manage to handle that way better than the poor weak ones ................

  • blondie
    blondie

    So OH are you labeled "spiritually weak" in your congregation?

  • Pistoff
    Pistoff

    The JW's are just taking to the max a proud tradition inside 'christian' fellowships: cliques.

    The rich, the poor, white, black; they are stratified in the congregation.

    Here is a poser: when was the last time you heard 30, 60, 100 fold? A long time ago, I think. In the current JW world, not doing enough will get you labeled as 'spiritually weak'.

    I just found out that my brother, a mass of cognitive dissonance, considers me NOT a spiritual person because I don't go to meetings.

    In the last 10 years, I have reconnected with recovery through 12 step groups.

    Here is a list of what I have read in the last 2 years:

    The Gnostic Gospels

    The Origin of Satan

    Misquoting Jesus

    The Writings of Paul

    Who Wrote The Bible?

    Jesus, a Mediterranean Peasant

    The Lost Gospel

    Adam, Eve and the Serpent

    Oxford History of the Bible

    The Bible Unearthed

    3 online courses:

    Introduction to the OT, Christina Hayes, Yale

    Introduction to the NT, Yale

    The Historical Jesus, Thomas Sheehan, Princeton

    And the one that really broke it for me:

    The Hero with a Thousand Faces, Joseph Campbell

    But, since I don't throw on the tie and listen to the latest stab in the dark about the generation, I am not spiritual.

    His/their view of spiritual is so narrow it excludes the gracious charity of other churches, even when witnesses are the beneficiary.

    Frustrating.

    P

  • MissingLink
    MissingLink

    As a teenager it was always put to me that I should only associate with people who were "spiritually stronger than myself". And that this was a rule that everyone should keep in mind.

    It seemed to be the exact opposite of what Jesus was supposed to have been like.

    But more importantly - to my logical mind this made absolutely no sense. If everyone applied this rule, then the ones "stronger" than me that I'm supposed to be sucking up to would not lower themselves to associate with me in order to not be corrupted by MY weakness. It would continue all the way from the bottom to the top - everyone rejecting everyone "below" them, and being rejected by everyone "above" them.

    Seems like a recipe to associate (or marry) with nobody. Which was probably the real goal anyway. Friends and romance can be a major distraction from door-knocking time.

  • Terry
    Terry

    But one woman took it even further, by saying that this applied even to people INSIDE the congregation who 'weren't spiritual enough' or didn't have some magnificent spiritual goals in life.

    I'd probably say: "Um humm, I'm not personally that confident I can judge another person as accurately as you do. I'd be afraid I was deluding myself that I was more righteous than they were. You know--like those Pharisees in Jesus' day who would pray: "Thank god I'm not like these other people..."

    "Practising righteousness before men so as to be seen is the issue rather than the secret person of the heart which only Jehovah can judge. Don't you agree?"

    (If you say it with an earnest smile they might even get the point.)

  • snowbird
    snowbird
    (If you say it with an earnest smile they might even get the point.)

    Yep.

    "Hope springs eternal in the human breast."

    Sylvia

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