Moshe thinks anything less than pepper spray is being a doormat. News flash. Some of us still have family in that we're not only trying to maintain a relationship with, but that we're trying to get out. I'm glad that attacking the WT with guns blazing works for you. It doesn't work for everybody.
Faders are indeed a very large doormat
by moshe 132 Replies latest jw friends
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Mickey mouse
I am a fader and I have to say that I see moshe's point. I think it's borne out of frustration at the lack of will most ex JWs have for hitting back at their abuser. I suspect many of us suffer from a form of Stockholm syndrome when it comes to the WBTS.
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Wasanelder Once
Moshe, what army? You think I owe you or any other exjw anything? Go to hell. I am not your "pal" or member of any holy "army" doing warfare against the WT corporation. Do I expose the WT? Yes. I publish videos on youtube. Do I care what you think? Hell no. I do it for individuals. No one will "take down the WT Society, it will implode if it comes down. Your marches and pamphlets have been diffused by the WT prejudice against "apostate" ideas. Your newspaper articles are preaching to the choir of nonwitnesses who could give a crap about them to begin with. It is the subtle appeal to individual minds that has the effect. Yes, orgs like Silent Lambs are doing good work, but it is for individuals. The result is an exposure of an organization. So, I fade... therefore I am.... who I want ...not what you expect. I gave up living for the expectations of people, Gods and Corporations. Drop dead. W.Once
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undercover
Well, I guess I'll comment on this since I kinda started the whole thing...
I have always respected people who stood up and said, "Enough! I quit!" and walk away. For some that is the best way to deal with it.
I also respect those that fade.
I understand the sentiment that has been expressed that some aren't so much faders as they are afraid to stand up for what's right. There may be some people who do come here and bitch and moan but yet keep going to meetings and pretending to be JWs.
Someone pretending to do all that may not fit the exact description of 'fader' but yet they can, in their own way find freedom from the clutches of the WT Cult. They may be there physically but mentally, they're with us.
I won't judge anyone based on how they personally deal with the situation. It's up to each person to do what's right for them. I won't even judge someone who chooses to remain a believing JW. If they face the facts and they want to be a JW, that's their right.
I hate the WT Society, but I don't hate the victims that have fallen prey to them. They're are some assholes in the elder body, but there are some good guys as well. There are pedophiles in the congregations, but that problem is permitted by the leadership, not by the followers. The vast majority of followers, everyday publishers are just people, not evil, not bad, just mis-lead.
I am a fader. I've faded over several years and the only meetings I have been to in the last 6 years have been 4 memorials. Everyone that knows me knows that I am as out as I can be without being announced as DFd/DAd. But for the sake of trying to help my wife escape the cult, I refrain from exposing myself as an 'apostate', though that's what I am. If I can work to help her see and become as free as me, then the day would come when I would gladly DA myself.
What I am not is a doormat. I have expressed my opinions. I have exposed scandals. I have stood up to elders...I have kicked elders out of my house. I have fought with family. I have been shunned, even when I have not been DFd/DAd. I have learned the hard way when to speak and when to keep my mouth shut. Discretion IS the better part of valor at times.
Until someone lives in my shoes and deals with what I deal with...things that I have never bitched about on this board, they have no concept of just how hard it is to go through what I have gone through...what I am going through.
So let's keep the insults to ourselves and focus on the important thing: how to escape the cult or help others to escape the cult.
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rockmehardplace
you handle your business your way, i will handle mine my way. if you dont like it, too bad. if i want to sit back and fade and never say a word to anyone, that is my business. if i want to come hear and complain and not do anything about it, dont read my posts. maybe some of us "faders" with no "backbone" think that going around screaming and yelling about all that was done to us is nothing more than someone being an attention whore and not moving on with their lives.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Amen Undercover. Unfortunately many ex-JWs have the same judgmental, black-or-white thinking that JWs have. Fact of the matter is that it's just not that simple.
Some think that unless you're picketing out in front of District Conventions, you're "selling out" or being a coward. That's just moronic. For one thing, those idiots that picket conventions do more harm than good, in my opinion. They simply reinforce the JWs' persecution complex.
In my limited experience, simply walking away and living a quiet, fulfilling life makes a bigger impression on those still in. It rocks their world. They've been taught that those who stop believing become either (1) wild-eyed, holy-rolling, assembly-picketing apostates; (2) drug-using, wife-swapping, deadbeat hedonists; or (3) "prodigal sons/daughters" who realize the error of their ways and come back to the K. Hall.
So, when you simply live a good life and don't fit their cookie-cutter idea of an ex-JW, it causes cognitive dissonance. Sometimes it even causes them to ask questions. This is a good thing.
And, for the record, plenty of us "faders" have made it abundantly clear to our JW loved ones that we do not believe it anymore. But some of us don't feel the need to be obnoxious about it. In fact, some of us like the idea of simply moving on with our lives. As some have put it, one day I'd like to be an ex-ex-JW.
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rockmehardplace
i must clarify, not all who do things are "attention whores" just as all who are faders "have no back bone".
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superpunk
You either leave the JWs MY way, or not at all!
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willyloman
It is rather surprising to look through the members list here and see how many guard their identities ...the majority of anonymous here are hiding from the WTB&TS.
This statement is another example of why the "large doormat" theory is false. The majority are not "hiding from the WTS" but are simply protecting their reputations. In my case, I have built a professional career and have no interest in jeopardizing my present or future job prospects by associating my name with JWs.
No matter how many years you were a dub, it's never going to look good on your resume. If I used my real name on this forum, a few months from now you could Google my name and the first 50 hits would all be dub-related. Employers and professional colleagues often Google you to learn more about who you are. I am not a JW and there is simply no economic or social currency to be gained by associating myself with this fringe cult.
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JeffT
Looking back our decision to DA ourselves was enabled by the fact that we had moved across the state and had minimal contact with friends still in, my wife only had a couple of relatives still in (death and DF had taken the others) and none of my family were ever witnesses.
We all have to live by our own decisions. I find no fault with those that feel they must stay quiet to preserve important relationships. Or for any other reason for that matter.