BTW, anybody know what the latest on Warwick/Brooklyn is?
Challenges Facing the Watchtower Org
by eric356 96 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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eric356
@Nobleheart
Thanks for providing some "inside" info from the CO and the DC regarding technology and waiting for dates. I don't go to any JW meetings or events, so I have to rely on others for that type of insight. It makes sense for them to move to digital distribution, it's the absolute cheapest way to go. Even individuals can electronically publish, so the Org will have enough money to continue doing this basically indefinitely. The problem I see is distribution. I doubt they will put their podcasts on iTunes or any of the other popular locations that people look for listening or reading material. And I don't see the point of going to someone's house to tell them to go somewhere and download a magazine. The JW walking around is superfluous. But how else can they do it? I guess they could act like email spammers (since door to door is basically real life spamming) and send links to vast groups of people. But that is probably even less effective than their current method. How will they get the message out?
Also, I don't really know how to interpret the "don't worry about the dates" resolution. I don't know if that idea is really new or not. They've always said that JWs should be aiming for a specific time (even while suggesting a specific time) because "no one knows the hour" and because the religion is supposed to be about loving Jehovah, not getting oneself to paradise. If they really start talking about Armageddon as being just "some time in the future" that would be a big change. However, at least from what I've heard from family and by seeing their DC headline scriptures, they seem to be just as urgent as always.
@agonus The WT hasn't even started hemorrhaging yet. According to their numbers, and those from third party polling organizations, their growth in the USA is still considerable. If they get negative growth in the future, that will be momentous. Per memory, I think the only time they've shrunk is just after 1975, and it was only for a few years.
A black swan event is possible, but I don't bother worrying about that because it would be impossible to predict. I think they will just continue cutting costs and people, aided by digital distribution. The congregations will get poorer and dumber. They will not mainstream (if they know what's good for them.) I think they will have to deal with the ever growing numbers of partakers.
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potleg
The challenge is getting the dubs to really listen and obey.
The rank and file have to stay busy, they cannot be left with time on their hands. Look at what's happened, assemblies are shorter, meetings have been whittled down, some publishers can be active with just 30 minutes of field service and the hour requirements for pioneers are easy compared to those of 30 years ago.
Now look at the results, stagnation and shrinkage in most of the territories that once were so productive. Easing up on the publishers has caused weakness within the congregations. Members enjoy more of what the world has to offer and are less inclined to blindly follow. In other words, they ain't as gung ho as they used to be and they sure don't make the sacrifices that were made years ago. The widdows mite has been reduced to leftovers.
Growth in numbers was always used as an indicator of jehovah's blessing, so if it's easier and less demanding to be a witness then maybe growth will continue. Well maybe, but at what cost? Today, giving away magazines full of pretty pictures has replaced hauling around a gramaphone or taking part in an information march. Enthusiasm is low. Now break times are the most enjoyable part of field service. Scrapping the bookstudy and saying that time should be spent in personal study is a joke to all but the most devoted.
Making the dubs theocratic life easier is like taking an athlete off the treadmill and sitting him on a couch with a bag of chips and the TV remote.
Many witnesses today are soft, they don't listen, they don't know their Bibles and they love much of what the world has to offer.
Obedience comes through sacrifice.
You can have a large group of so-so followers or a small band of zealots. Both groups existing together in the same organization won't work very well. I think this is where the JWs are right now.
The zealots think the so-so ones are weak, half hearted and maybe even a threat due to their misplaced priorities and lack of appreciation. The band of so-so jws think the zealots are too extreme, dogmatic even cold. There's no way they would want to be like them. Clique vs Clique.
The WT is a high control group who believe they are speaking for god. You wouldn't question god so you mustn't question them.
Here's the way I see it...
Watch out for a charismatic leader emerging, someone fairly young with the ability to electrify and galvanize an audience. Sure he'll deny at first that he's the leader but behind the scenes he'll push his agenda through and surround himself with people who are street smart, savy and know the machinations of the organization. These also enjoy the feeling of power that the leader bestows upon them. He'll be quite ruthless and tolerate no equals because he really believes that he has been chosen and raised up given the task of cleaning the organization.
The days of cloistered old men ruling by committee are over.
There will be a purge.
New hard line policies will emerge such as a total and complete ban on blood and it's associated byproducts, bye bye fractions. An absolute zero tolerance for apostates and those showing weakness or questioning. Limiting internet exposure. However the WT will have sites for instruction featuring the best of the best teachers with great high tec visuals. Viewing their top notch presentations will be both compelling and manditory. Also if you don't have their JW filter installed on your computer you must be up to no good, and you can forget about social networks. There will be no cover up of pedophiles, they are the lowest of the low. They will be exposed and wear a figurative scarlet P for thre rest of their lives. (So it's not all bad) Committees will always remain secret, punishment will be harsh for the sake of the brotherhood and lawyers will find ways of exposing "sinners" without incuring liability.
Everything in life, even recreation and fun activities will be oriented towards the organization. Outside interests and associations will not be discouaged they will be forbidden for the faithfull. The congregation MUST be kept clean at all costs.
It will become harder to lead the double life. The so-so JWs will either turn away in disgust or get the boot.
The zealous will become more zealous and callolus. Even little sister humble will turn her back on those who don't give 100%. It may break her heart that we're not with her but she must follow the organization no matter what the cost.
So the numbers shrink... but that's a good thing..."the love of the greater number is cooling off" Scripture fulfilled. Solid evidence that jehovah is with the WT and smiles upon it's leader.
Remaining Dubs will still be kept very busy. Tactics to get face time with people may become more extreme, think of an updated version of Judge Rubberfarts sound cars or WBBR. As strategies for spreading the truth become more annoying, worldly folks will offer up more resistance, how well this plays into their inflated persecution complex!
Magazines will be scaled way back. Instead a phone or some other hand held device could be used to get people instantly on line and experience the dynamic and captivating message of the latter-day moses and crew. (Those at the top really believe that they have the divine right to lead)
Meetings and assemblies will be longer but not as boring. Technology will bring wonderful presentations of the new world, the resurrection, life everlasting along with the images of the men in charge, their booming voices spewing persuasive rhetoric. Sister Humble will melt, brother Wannabe will covet the power.
There will always be people who want to be led, to be told what to do and reassured that they will be rewarded. There will also be followers who want power over other followers.
There will also emerge a "Big Dog", the alpha - Il Duce, the Boss.
He's coming, maybe he's already here. And the followers? They'll always be around as long as he keeps telling them what to do. Where else would they go?
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metatron
Think about it: so, the Governing Body makes it easier for people to be publishers and for men to be elders. Where does this deepening trend end up? It ends up with a huge, growing lump of people who tell themselves and others that they are Jehovah's Witnesses, very similar to what Catholics now do.
You end up with an organization that is broke and a joke.
metatron
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clarity
Wow, Potleg impressive. My mind just kept agreeing with most of what you wrote!
The charasmatic leader is probably 'in plain sight' as we speak.
Although on a funny side, except for his age .... Donald Trump, Donald Trump kept ringing thru my head! lol
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baltar447
Potleg, interesting scenario you lay out there, but I totally disagree. There's no way the GB would let go of their authority to someone else. Plus, JWs have always prided themselves on the fact that they don't follow a "leader" only God (I know, the GB is taking that role as we speak). I think gone are the days when a charismatic leader COULD seize power.
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Dogpatch
Hi Eric,
I think that is a very good intellectual assessment of what you believe may happen with the Watchtower; well thought-out and logical. It could have been written about Christian Scientists 20 years ago.
IMO you left out the MOST important thing.... there is no longer any visceral appeal to belonging to this organization.
It will surely continue, but who will be attracted to it? And who would bother to go to any meetings, or go door to door?
Who would gain any warmth or passion or healing from it?
Who would be proud of it, or die for it?
Who would be physically or financially helped by it?
These are the needs that WON'T be met by the Watchtower.
People are more than what circulates in their head.
It has already died.
It just may take another 20 years to bury the corpse.
Dogpatch
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wasblind
" Who would be physically or financially helped by it?
These are the needs that WON'T be met by the Watchtower."
You can say that again Randy, that religion didn't do nothin' but run my blood pressure up higher than it already was,
and besides, all that runnin' around in field service nobody paid for the up keep of my vehicle, when ever I was in need of somethin'( Not that I ever aked them for anything personally) they would always say "wait on Jehovah"
and when it came time to go to the conventions , it seemed like the elders wives would always point the single sisters with a bushel of kids my way.
they would even try to push their own damn unruly relatives off on me, but I wasn't havin' it. Then one Elders wife ask , if me and my daughter could share a room with someone I never met, and that she would contribute whatever she could,.
you mean to tell me to get a double room , me and my daughter share one bed and the stranger have a bed all to herself and contribute whatever she can ?
that mean she could have given me $25 dollars and had a whole bed to herself Oh hell no. again I wasn't havin' it, call me selfish that's ok, I'll own it
ok I'm through venting BTTT
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Mickey mouse
You can have a large group of so-so followers or a small band of zealots. Both groups existing together in the same organization won't work very well. I think this is where the JWs are right now.
The zealots think the so-so ones are weak, half hearted and maybe even a threat due to their misplaced priorities and lack of appreciation. The band of so-so jws think the zealots are too extreme, dogmatic even cold. There's no way they would want to be like them. Clique vs Clique.
This is a very accurate assessment of what I see in the org just now.
So the numbers shrink... but that's a good thing..."the love of the greater number is cooling off" Scripture fulfilled. Solid evidence that jehovah is with the WT and smiles upon it's leader.
I 100% agree with this; you just know they have this scripture on reserve for such an occasion.
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metatron
My God, Randy hits it again! Exactly!
The fire has gone out of this cult and it's in a defensive mode. The whole thing is flying on autopilot or running on inertia.
Keep in mind what killed off Communism after so many fanatical decades. They ran out of money, belief and zeal. The people became passive-agressive and the governments couldn't move them anymore.
metatron