I find it very hard to believe in a god (page 2)

Qcmbr

Hi New. please do not ever, ever follow this advice:

... but I think anyone can take a leap of faith....

You are fortunate to live in a world where mystical quests and magic thinking have been utterly supplanted by knowledge and wisdom. There is no longer any excuse to believe in any form of god - as espoused by the religious salespeople - since you have at your hands actual, testable, verifiable factual information that no 'leaper' can ever provide for you (if they could we'd all believe!)

Tammy has faith - she also is fooled on a daily basis by her senses as her brain tries to order a sensory deluge of information , as we all are- faith is one of the brain's (and culture's) short cuts to dealing with this information. We all have these evolutionary results that we dress up in words that do not fully describe the emotional, chemical and electrical firings of our bodies - we use words such as love, hope, imagination, consciousness, ecstasy etc. to describe things that can be measured and partially explained in the lab and when experienced can be incredible. Faith is no different but in order to maintain the mental heuristic faith requires continual learned ignorance. You could explain a torch to an Amazonian tribesman and they may refuse to accept it as anything other than magic.

This world is too beautiful, too special and full of amazing people and experiences to allow the followers of the immoral , baby killing, hell preparing, tyrannical slaver god to take even a moment (or a penny) of your time and effort.

yay

life is to short

That is a huge struggle that I am having too. I have prayed and prayed and PRAYED for God to show me who he is what he wants I get nothing.

I remember being seven years old, going to the KH and begging Jehovah to help me with my abusive mom. NOTHING! Then I would watch the older ones in the hall make over some other child, I would watch the elders set up pioneers to study with children who did not have strong parents, my older sister was offered a Bible study. I got nothing. I begged and begged God for help like that and I got nothing.

Still I threw myself into the JW's telling myself that even though God did not seem to care about me he still wanted me.

Even with all of that, pioneering, being married to an elder, going to Bethel, being in a hall that needed help, all that I did while I was in the "truth" I still deep down did not believe that there was a God who cared.

Now that I am out, I want to believe really bad I would love to be like Tammy, I have even joined a Bible study class, I listen to non JW's tell their story of how God has helped them in their lives and I still at times try to pray and I still get nothing.

I do not know maybe God really hates me, if he has it has been since I was a small child. I remember praying at the age of five and I got no answers. So what did I do to make God hate me? I do not know. What did I do as a child to make God so mad at me?

So I struggle with the thought that either I am a very evil person though I have or never would hurt anyone and it breaks my heart over all the abuse of children in the world, especially sexual abuse of children, thus the reason I am no longer a JW because of the child molesters that are in my hall.

I do not know what I have done to tick God off. I see people who have murdered, who steal, who lie and harm people, who abuse the elderly, who have raped, raped children, like the pedophile in my hall who raped an eight year old child and God loves him God loves them all. All these people say they prayed to God for help and he was there for them. Not so for me.

I will try not even kill a spider yet God hates me. So I find it very hard to believe in God though I would love too.

LITS

designs

T-Duality, Strings, Quantum Mechanics- its a brave new world and new ways of thinking about time and space and energy.

Big Tex

Maybe it's the journey, not the destination that matters.

Maybe there is a reason that the answer is not there with absolute certainty in this life. Maybe we have to discover for ourselves what that reason is, and then make it okay within ourselves. And maybe, in the end, the question of who or if or even why isn't nearly as important as how. How did we choose to live our life? We have control only over ourselves, how we treat others and how we validate our inner person.

The fun thing about escaping from the Witnesses is allowing yourself the freedom to think about what you want for a change. It is your life after all. So do you want to believe in a god, or a buddha or even the Great Pumpkin? Or nothing at all?

Be well,

Chris

" For what it's worth: it's never too late or, in my case, too early to be whoever you want to be. There's no time limit, stop whenever you want. You can change or stay the same, there are no rules to this thing. We can make the best or the worst of it. I hope you make the best of it. And I hope you see things that startle you. I hope you feel things you never felt before. I hope you meet people with a different point of view. I hope you live a life you're proud of. If you find that you're not, I hope you have the strength to start all over again"

Qcmbr

LITS - with out knowing you beyond your post - if you spend the same mental desire and effort on finding true friends and maintaining those relationships you may fill that emotional hole and in a way that is so much more fulfilling than pleading into the pillow for some relationship with a supernatural, invisible thingy. Your relationships with real people will emotionally and 'spiritually' fulfil you in wonderful ways. You must of course give lots of people the chance to be your friends but be prepared to leave those who prove otherwise behind. The world is full of great people (and lots of dross as well!)

Lion Cask

Lion Cask's British English - American English translation service: torch = flashlight, dross = waste.

Faith is comforting. To be able to fill your heart with love and hope and speak to God (especially in the quiet stillness of 3 in the morning, when all those heavy thoughts and fears just won't let you sleep) calms the emotions. It feels good to have faith, and that is why people have faith. But that doesn't mean that faith and truth are synonymous. On the contrary, faith is a spectrum. It is multi-coloured and inequal, in other words, not the same. This means that faith either has a whole lot of different "truths", some of which directly contradict one another, or faith is an illusion. Is there a very, very narrow band within that spectrum that is the true light of faith? That is what the Watchtower claims as their own, but most of us in this board have come to the conclusion from observing the Watchtower closely that it does not, in fact, represent that very narrow band of light.

One of the hardest things I had to give up when the last vestige of faith drained away from my psyche was prayer. Life is heavy and at times it is traumatic and being able to reach out for some spiritual comfort was, well, comforting. But it is also an illusion, and to pray to a god, of whatever name you give it, is escapism. When you at last learn to face up to reality, however cruel it may sometimes be, with courage, a sense of wonder and strength of character, you will find you no longer need the comfort of faith and you will be emancipated.

cofty

Hi Newborn, there is no hurry, enjoy the journey.

Evolution is a massive subject and you could spend many lifetimes learning it. I find it to be a constant source of amazement.

Dawkin's "The Blind Watchmaker" is a good place to start. Sadly there are tons of frightened religious folk who publish impressive sounding psuedo-science all over the internet. Do yourself a favour and avoid them like the plague they are until you haave had time to enjoy some real science.

There is a summary of Dawkin's newest book "The Greatest Show On Earth" here.

designs

Mediatation and contemplation should have there place in daily life. Helps with assessing events and setting goals. Facebook is good also- get in touch with old friends and family and make new connections.

Practical stuff.

I quit!

You don't have to make a choice to believe in God or evolution. It is ok to believe in both or neither if that is where you are at. I think the belief that evolution and creation are mutually exclusive is something that has been pushed mostly here in the US and I guess it is spreading. One of the things that confuses matter is how some of the terms are used here. The term creationism has come to mean someone who takes the Bibical account literally and doesn't believe in evolution where as it should refer to a belief that a creator did have a hand in it. I think people that take the so called creationist view are turning a blind eye to both science and the Bible. The Genesis accounts of creation to me seem pretty obvious to be neither history or science.

It isn't possible to force yourself to believe in God just as it isn't possible to force yourself not to believe in God so all you can do is believe what you believe and if what you believe changes over time as I'm sure it will so be it. That is what life is all about.

poppers

Perhaps "God" is not the personal entity that most religions claim, and is instead of an impersonal nature. God, by definition, is unknowable, so claims by "holy books" that describe what God speaks/wants/demands/expects are pure speculation. Evolution, on the other hand, has at its basis facts that can be verified or refuted through the scientific method.

I find it very hard to believe in a god

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