So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault? (page 13)

BurnTheShips

I don't. It's as natural as grass or taking a crap in the woods.

BTS

PSacramento

I don't. It's as natural as grass or taking a crap in the woods.

I don't see many people hanging the crap they took in the woods above the fireplace.

;)

Lore

-- "I don't. It's as natural as grass or taking a crap in the woods."

I don't see many people hanging the crap they took in the woods above the fireplace

;)

I didn't used to have anything against hunting or using dead animals as trophies. But that's an epic response so I'm on your side now!

james_woods where do you get the idea that we do not like your political and legal system? we certainly in The UK do not understand your love affair of guns, and how it can possibly make you feel safer, anymore than you can understand how we feel and are safer without them ( the vast majority of law officers included), that should not be conflated as meaning we do not like other aspects of your system.

David

TD

It seems to me that the cultural difference goes far beyond just a love or aversion to firearms. Maybe I'm wrong, but to me, British law seems to be designed to eliminate any device that would put a smaller, older, weaker person on a more equal footing with a larger, younger, stronger person. Perhaps that reflects an entirely different philosophy behind the moralilty or maybe even the right of self defense?

james_woods

james_woods where do you get the idea that we do not like your political and legal system? we certainly in The UK do not understand your love affair of guns, and how it can possibly make you feel safer, anymore than you can understand how we feel and are safer without them ( the vast majority of law officers included), that should not be conflated as meaning we do not like other aspects of your system.

I didn't mean to say everybody in the U.K. - but the original poster here often criticizes just about everything to do with the U.S. - including (but not limited to) who we elect for president, the constitution, free speech, gun laws, our foreign policy, etc. The word STUPID is often used, as in this thread.

I was just commenting that one root cause may be a resentment against the U.S. for being the point of creation of the Watchtower and the J.W. religion.

Which I can actually understand, in a way.

Terry

We all live in some sort of society.

If I don't know what you are thinking I can't be offended by your thoughts.

If I find out you are thinking harmful thoughts about me and my family I might begin treating you differently and taking steps of a "preventive" nature.

And thus begins the fundamental problem of SOCIETY itself: human thought FIRST followed by human ACTIONs.

Only ACTIONS can actually harm; thoughts themselves are invisible and powerless until and unless implemented.

If we focus on the POSSIBLE and varied implements which create a "technology" for harm we are already down a rabbit hole.

My crazy neighbor can pick up a rock and bash my daughter's head in. Should I call the cops and have all the rocks removed from the neighborhood? Certainly not! That automatically sounds crazy.

But, if my neighbor owns a .22 pistol and can shoot one of my kids (or myself) I might strongly protest his right to possess that weapon.

See how subtle the obvious becomes by shifting slightly from THOUGHTS to IMPLEMENTS?

How did humankind kill, maim and destroy BEFORE handguns, rifles and machine guns?

On the other hand....

In the Old West in Dodge City Marshall Wyatt Earp made it illegal to bear arms WHILE IN TOWN. You had the right to own your weapon and retrieve it when you left town---but, you couldn't walk around with it.

More than anything else ever tried---that led to the taming of a hellish and lawless town.

How do we fit those two ends of the spectrum together?

Can you really prevent a CRAZY PERSON with HARMFUL THOUGHTS from hurting other people?

Not as long as they can reach for a toaster or a bookend and knock your brains out!

The problem can't be solved until we IDENTIFY the root and pluck it out by that root.

MAKE CRAZINESS illegal and legislate against HARMFUL THOUGHTS!

Terry

double post!

llbh

Hi james,

That maybe an exjw mindset, though I do not think so, most Brits are pro The US (myself included), we do not always get the rationale behind some of more right wing manifestations though. Simon's views whilst cogently argued are his own, and are not ( except for his views on guns) shared by everyone here

TD we feel much safer without guns, we feel that by and large it is the job of the police to protect our citizens. As for self defense, there is enshrined in law a right to self defense, however that defense must be proportional to the threat, ie if you feel your life is in danger, you can kill your attacker justifiably, and the law will protect you. If however a person steals from you that does not in and of itself give you the right to harm them per se.

David

TD

David,

Our laws here in America are based heavily on English common law. The laws governing self defense vs.defense of property, the need to retreat from a threat if at all possible and the proportional nature of the response are point for point what you have listed above. --Yet we're still miles apart.

In a public place, what are you allowed to defend yourself with?

So an 8 year old is killed by a machine-gun and it's no ones fault?

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