I don't see how hope and faith are related. I hope I'll win the lottery, but I know there's a very small chance that it'll happen.
Is it possible to define faith in a simple, logical, unambiguous way?
by losthobbit 67 Replies latest watchtower bible
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Ding
Faith could be defined as trusting in something or someone.
Every time you drive you have faith that your steering wheel and brakes will work, that other drivers won't try to kill you, etc.
Sometimes such faith is well-placed, sometimes not.
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losthobbit
There's a interesting looking google advert when I look at this page:
Clear Scientific Facts Say Yes! Read this Free Booklet for Proof.
Of course, if there is proof, then we don't need faith, right?
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losthobbit
Ding, your definition could be scientific, e.g.
Hypothesis: If I test move steering wheel, wheels turn.
Theory tested 1000 times in the past, each time test passed.
I can therefore conclude that there is 100% chance (proof) that steering wheel turns wheels.
Now you have proof... but therefore no faith, right?
Alternatively
If you conclude that there is approximately a 99.9% chance, you then know that there is only a 99.9% that it will work, however you decide to risk it anyway... is that faith, even though you aren't 100% sure it will work?
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tec
By "delusion", I meant that the person is deluded that the certainty is 100%, when in fact the certainty is less than 100%... I'm not referring to whether the object of faith is actually true or not.
Ah... in other words... 'deluding oneself into believing that their faith is 100%'?
If so, then that is a belief about faith, but not the definition of faith itself.
I get the sense that it is faith itself that you do not understand, and not the definition of faith. Perhaps I'm wrong. But the definitions seem very clear to me.
Tammy
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Lily Pie
In the Christian religious context FAITH is best described by the single word TRUST.
LilyPie
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losthobbit
Tammy, I don't believe you can understand something if you can't define it.
In other words, I see understanding and defining as being the same thing.
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losthobbit
Perhaps I should explain why it's so important to me that this word is well defined...
I once asked religious people a question like this:
If the most open minded, and intelligent people in the world spent their lives researching all the world's religions, evaluating all the evidence for and against each religion, and used statistics to determine the most likely true religion, do you think you would join the religion that they chose, or would you stick to what your own mind tells you?
The most common answer was something like "Religion is a personal choice, and I would stay in my religion, because of my faith."
Of course the problem with this answer is that it does not matter how much evidence you show these people that they're in the wrong religion, they're in their religion because of their "faith". No amount of rational thinking, logic, or evidence will change their mind, and it's pointless trying to debate with them.
If they're able to define what faith means, I could attempt to debate whether or not their faith is accurate.
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Terry
Faith is a word you say when you really don't have anything to say that makes any sense.
Faith is the equivalent to "WHATEVER!"
FAITH is word fluff. Stuffing.
FAITH is like that styrofoam "peanut" packing material that keeps whatever you are shipping from breaking during handling.
With FAITH you are shipping something very delicate and breakable...
In Mary Poppins there was a word you use when you don't know what to say--but--you want to sound like you are knowledgeable.
SUPERCALIFRAGILISTICEXPIALADOCIOUS
Therefore, ladies and gentlemen, FAITH is that which we claim to explain something so inexcusably baseless we don't really have a way
to explain it.
Q: "Sir, what makes you believe an invisible Jesus returned to earth in 1914 and, five years later, selected your silly religion as THE ONE AND ONLY one for him to use to spread his message?"
A: "Ummm, uh...duhhh....homma homma...I know, I know---I HAVE IT! FAITH!!"
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wyorobert
I had to define faith for myself and once I did, I left all religions behind. I made up this saying, which I thought was original at the time, but who knows.
"Faith is the absolute belief in something that may or may not exist"
Once I started saying that, I could no longer accept anything on faith. It also goes along with "Perception is Reality".
I also think faith and naivity go hand in hand. You have to have a certain level of naivity to have faith. Faith is also the putty religions use to fill in the gaps of the things which can't possibly be explained. I think for many there is a certain spiritual calm to having faith, but for me it was only a way to lie to myself.