Maybe you talked to a sister about your feelings and gossip reached the elders and changed the talk?
This was my 'Sign'
by MsGrowingGirl20 67 Replies latest jw friends
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extractor
The Bible has accounts of people doing preaching work....
2 Peter 2 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them —bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. 3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with fabricated stories.
...but they were bringing the wrong message. Just because preaching work is being done, does that automatically make it "the truth"?
The message brought door to door by the Watchtower does not even closely match the message brought by the 1st century apostles.
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rip van winkle
MsGrowingGirl20, I read your post a few days ago and what you said weighed heavily on my mind, as I too was flooded with doubts. For you to have the added burden of worrying about your 12 year old cousin.
I wondered silently for some time. Prayed. Cried. Cried again. Still crying. Confused like you.
It is very scary and lonely to consider that what you have believed in for so long would turn out to be untrue. All I keep asking myself is"How can this be?" I am not a person believing every word. I was not naive.
And still, here I am, like you looking and searching. Why the doubts? Obviously things no longer feel right. That's why you came here. That's why I came here. Because something doesn't seem right or feel right anymore.
I've asked so many questions of myself in the last couple of months. MGG20, never thought I would ever post my thoughts online about thinking and concluding this may be a CULT.
There's too many inconsistencies with the WTS teachings. And even if there are errors, the fact that they have tried to rewrite and hide the true history is evidence of their own doubts about The Truth.
If they had stuck with the bible and they were representatives of the True God, there wouldn't have been all the crazy beliefs over the years.
We as a group have separated ourselves so much from doing good works. Yes, the preaching is part of good works but what about humanity towards our neighbours. Showing love and concern for others without trying to convert someone. Do the witnesses ever do that? We always say we're volunteers in our community. Have we really helped our communities?
And as Londo11 pointed out the 607 bce date. That's a sticking point for me. How happy it would make me to think all the world is wrong and the WTS has it right. Don't even want to get started on the ever changing blood issue.
Still, I haven't a clue as to what I'm planning to do. I know it's got to be a completely confusing time for you as it is for me. Decisions are best made when not under stress or going thru a time of change in their life, so please consider your steps before making any decisions.
The conclusion I am coming to terms with is: I have lost so much time believing in something that for the most part turns out to be a lucrative business with a tight reign of control over the "Free willed" followers. But I haven't made a decision how I'm going to handle this dilemma.
I want to say I owe you a Thank you MGG20. It was due to your post that enabled me to finally express my own misgivings in my post a few days ago. You gave me the courage to do the same. So, maybe you were the answer to my prayer.
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MsGrowingGirl20
rip van winkle----- i'm very happy that this has happened...i'm still going crazy myself.
I always enjoy all the feedback from all these wonderful people on this site.
I'm currently trying to understand the 607 thing but i have NO IDEA where to begin.
Thank you sooo much for your post and i wish you the best in your....errr...journey struggle exit you know.
WELCOME!!
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Leeca
This is just my personal opinion, but if you're in 'a mess', have serious doubts, then i believe Gods Holy Spirit is not there.
The last meeting i ever went to was thanks to the speaker, he berated the cong saying we weren't doing enough. That we should be doing more and if we weren't then we shouldn't be here. As i wasn't working i was attending meetings, going out in FS several times a week, raising two kids, but it wasn't enough. Then when i got a part time job i was actually berated for taking it.
I had felt as you did, taking years being in and out. But with that talk i stopped 'hanging' on and made a clean break, best thing i ever did. Also getting my kids out before the religion damaged them also.
I'm at peace now, still not sure where i stand with religion, but fully believe i will find where i'm supposed to be and when i do find it i will know.
Just take you time, use your God given gift of reason, you will eventually work it out.
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palmtree67
I'm currently trying to understand the 607 thing but i have NO IDEA where to begin.
Here is a good start:
And here:
Sorry, I can't make the links clickable. Just copy and paste them into your browser window.
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rip van winkle
MGG20, let the crazy begin! www.quotes-www.watchtower.co.uk and www.watchtowerlies.com
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notjustyet
Reverse engineer this thing, a talk about doubts would not be of any use, without people that were having doubts, right?
I think that there has to be a large percentage of the Jws that are having doubts more frequently as the years go on and nothing happens, the changes in the definition of the word "Generation" 607, NGO with the UN etc..
Yes, the talk is a outline from NY that has been assigned to be given all over the USA at least, and the reason that it is being given my friendis due to many having doubts, and rightfully so.
If they can keep the Jws from acting on their doubts, the talk has worked as planned. You were ready to toss all your doubts to the wind by just hearing a few words of the talk, this in itself shows that you are in a precarious position and we've all been there but you surely need to put your nose to the grindstone and research your doubts. Read up on 607, go to Jwfacts.com and look at some of the other things that are not right with the WTBTS of NY.
Think about the fact that the WTBTS wants you to not research your doubts. They really do not want you to research them, they may say to research them as they know that just the fact that they say to research them will make some feel relaxed and feel that they have nothing to worry about.
The REAL truth can stand up to scrutiny, right? The only way to know what is the real truth is to do your own research.
What ever you do, you need to continue to find out the facts about this organazation.
Keep up the good work, you are surely on your way to finding out the truth. The swirling of thoughts will start to subside as you take in more knowledge about topics such as 607 etc,..
Hang in there.
NJY
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tec
(clickable from Palm above)
It is my experience and understanding that God (or His Son) can answer prayers. But it is not my experience that God works in signs, per say... or at least I would not know how I would understand one if I were given one. How would I know what might be a sign, over what I want to see AS a sign, because of what I want?
I choose to follow Christ instead... His teachings and His example on love, on mercy, on forgiveness. His LIGHT yoke. Not man's heavy burdens. He teaches love and mercy above all these other 'rules'. He certainly did not expect anyone to be perfect... nor does He hold our weaknesses and mistakes against us... because love does not do this. Love covers over a multitude of sins. Love forgives, love shows mercy... to friend and to foe. Love does not fail.
The love of the WTS has failed. So many people. They do not know love, because they will turn away from love to follow the 'rules' (of the organization) instead. Yet, love is the first and last commandment. First in the commandments given to Moses and Israel... love God, and love neighbors as yourself... and then once again as a new command from Christ: to love one another as He loves us. (as, meaning in the same way)
You do not need an organization to know and to follow Him... nor do you need an organization to help your cousin (who you obviously love very much) do the same. You just need Him. You can ask God to send Christ to you. To allow you to hear and have faith in Him, in spirit, however he wishes. And keep asking Him.
Christ made a promise: If we love him then we will obey his teachings, and his father will love us and they will come and make their home with us. Their home with us... is the Spirit within us. Love Him more than the organization. Love Him... know Him... and you won't be so afraid. Afraid of preaching wrong; afraid of leaving or not doing the right thing. He knows we make mistakes. Just love. Don't follow someone else's voice over His voice. If another tells you to do something that does not come from love, from mercy, from forgiveness and compassion... then their's is the voice of a stranger. Run from them.
You do love.... or you would not be so concerned for your cousin. You are also starting to recognize that thiers (the wts) is the voice of a stranger. Or you would not be having these doubts.
Peace and love to you,
tammy
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diamondiiz
I would assume that for many of us who believed wts, coming to the conclusions that we had, didn't happen over night. Personally, I found out about wts involvement with UN probably three or four years prior to my DA. I believed they screwed up but still thought it was the truth. Then I found out about child abuse settlements and again wts covered it up but it still was the truth because we were the only ones preaching about Jehovah and paradise earth - right? But then I found Russell's book and after reading it I knew that this whole thing was a con but it took me another year of research to finally write a DA letter and still at that point I didn't want to call wts a cult but that it had cult like characteristics.
As you research more and compare actions of wts to that of other Christian cults, you will see a lot of similarities and as you step outside of the box you can clearly see how wts operates and that it in fact is a cult for which we've wasted our best years of our lives. It has taken away our opportunities, enjoyments of real life, it destroyed our marriages and for many it has destroyed entire family circles.
If you want a clearer understanding of dates and 607BC, start with Thy Kingdom Come. You'll understand what Russell actually taught and what wts taught regarding dates for over 50 years. If you don't have a problem reading xJW material as it appears you don't, you should read Carl Olof Jonnson's book, Gentiles Times Reconsidered. You'll be provided with enough secular material to see that 607BC is pure fiction but not only that, but wts knows it and are deceiving their own members regards to this date. Here's Jonnson's web site with his latest rebuttal to wts 607BC articles which you can read in pdf format at the bottom of his page. I strongly recommend reading Gentile Times Reconsidered.
Here's some info that you will discover when and if you do research on 607 myth.
From Russell's Thy Kingdom Come (Studies in the Scriptures Vol3)
1799 - Last Days began
1874 - 6000 years ended. Jesus returned invisibly. Most important date for WTS
1878 - Jesus was enthroned in heaven. Heavenly resurrection began.
1914 - end of gentile times, end of the worldly governments, restoration of Israel.Based on 536BC as date of Cyrus conquering Babylon. Where they assumed the 70 years applied to desolation of Jerusalem thus 606BC came about. (7 times prophesy)
- that was not the only support for 1914, but also 40 year harvest from 1874 to 1914 was corresponding to 40 years from JC baptism in 30AD to destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans
- there might have been another one or two supporting factors linking 1874 with 1914All of the above dates were linked together by God's stone witness - Pyramid of Giza!!!!! WTS didn't just think these dates we true, they were certain of them and taught and preached these for many years after 1914. In fact, 1874 was officially replaced with 1914 in 1943! But the reasons given for the change evolved to what is taught today.
They faulted KJ bible for 100 years and also that there was no 0 year between 1BC and 1AD.
Today, Cyrus conquest of Babylon in 539BC is a pivotal year! Remember, Russell believed it was 536 (3 year difference).But remember, 606/607BC had nothing to do with JC's return!!! It was the 6000 year calculation, so why didn't wts change 1874 to 1975 if the end of 6000 years had to do with the return of Christ?
Ya, 1914 was much more convenient to sell to the gullible public since WWI took place in that year! That is why we are told today that Russell pointed to 1914, some 40 years prior as if he had some foreknowledge. Today, no one at the door hears the real story behind 1914 and 1874, but the lie that the watchtower foreknown some 40 years prior to WWI. They are told that JC was to return invisibly and the householder is presented with "proof" how wts knew the war would take place. You show the householder some out of context BS that WTS pointed to 1914 and this impresses the householder as if wts was right! "The war did happen! JWs may know something, maybe I should listen to more what they have to say." Hell, as a kid I was impressed by this deception.