5 Reasons Why the DEAF Masturbation Video is different than anything before...

by BluePill2 241 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  cedars

  Broken Promises - lol, you'll have to ask King Solomon whether those are the sorts of cuffs he would use to perform a citizen's arrest on me!!

  Cedars
• 

  Juan Viejo2

  Just in case anyone has doubts that the video is legitimate and its source is JW.org, here is the link one more time...

  http://www.jw.org/apps/index.html?option=QrYQFVTrlBBX&selLang=ASL&selPub=732 (it's #22)

  JV
• 

  Juan Viejo2

  Another interesting, yet shorter version. I'm ready to rock - how about you?

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5G-ni6Yk0o

  JV
• 

  Scott77

  lol
• 

  King Solomon

  Jack said:

  King Solomon, I just wanted to say that I appreciate your posts and viewpoint here. Thanks for being a voice of reason.

  Thanks, Jack.

  Cedars said:

  King Solomon - no need to get so hung up about cuffs, I was having a joke.

  Using more emoticons might help, as there's truly no telling with you: you seem unaware of the basics of copyright law (like not knowing the difference btwn civil and criminal CI: that's not uncommon for the general population).

  I dare say it's hardly breaking news to you that you've earned a rep for being blinded by WT hatred such that you get blinded by little technicalities like law, or even considering the way others perceive your crusades, and how you'd bite the hand of those who dare to disagree or help. Hey, that's your right: we're all big boys here. Horses, water. Beds made, slept in. Heck, maybe this is your way of expressing an unconscious "DF wish". Who knows...

  If the Watch Tower Society wants to move heaven and earth to come after little 'ol me - they're welcome to try.

  You said you didn't want to fight WT's YT takedown in order to protect your anonymity; surprisingly, myself and others took that as your reason, and accepted it: no one judged you for it, or doubted your reasons. Heck, getting a take-down notice is stressful for those who haven't mentally prepared for the possibility, and that panicky reaction is exactly WHAT IP owners want: caving out of fear. But you said you weren't concerned with being forced to show "fair use" in a DMCA CI case, as much as you valued protecting your anonymity. Those are separate issues. I dunno your family situation, status with JWs, fading, etc, but we all know it is a complicated time-consuming process, and you valued anonymity over the legal threat.

  So I, in good faith, accepted your reason and then tried to warn you and others (ex Billy) that you're jeopardizing being rooted out by posting on JWN because it's MUCH EASIER to out you here, NOT so as to sue for CI under DMCA, but simply to get privacy information WITHOUT your enjoying privacy protections under the US system (as found in YT/US due process). You HAVE an 'escape hatch' via YT to protect your privacy; no such privacy protections exist if they go after you via UK Court order.

  I outlined the simple legal steps WT UK would use, in a step-by-step manner, such that anyone who understands even the basics of Int'l IP law could see it's valid and how trivial it would be. Believe me, WT lawyers knows this: it's not news to any IP lawyer. Apparently YOU didn't.

  UK's IP law (Digital Economy Act) is quite different from US law: UK uses a "notice and notice" method, where DMCA is a "notice and takedown" regime. UK hosts understand that DMCA has no jurisdiction in their country (which doesn't mean they are free to blow off a DMCA takedown from the US: the content holder would seek a judgment in the US against the UK host, and then sues in the UK: they do NOT want that to happen....). As I've explained, all the WT need do is transfer the matter to WT UK, and they get your contact info which is much easier than can be done for a DMCA takedown in the U.S.

  But instead of thanking me, you attacked with ad hominems, etc. From what I've seen, that's par for the course with you: no one can tell you anything when you're on a one-track mind-set. I was instantly reminded of the Anon thread from this Summer, with the encrypted-file hacking, where you showed no concern for the privacy of those names in the files (no due process), or worries about contaminating (tainted) any evidence which was something you hadn't thought about, etc. I've looked into the legal complexities of illegally-obtained evidence via hacking being used subsequently as evidence (the Anon hack on HB Gary highlighted the issue a few years ago, and was discussed extensively on tech legal blogs, etc).

  Remember, if you were dealing with a content provider like NBC Univ, I'd say the legal threat is much lower. It's not worth their time to go after unauthorized use of such a silly little clip (esp if it were encased within a defensible 'fair use' wrapper), etc.

  But you're NOT: cults like WTBTS and Scientology don't see this as a BUSINESS matter, per se (the video is free, not sold for revenue), but as a matter of maintaining CONTROL; losing control of their current and prospective JW members WILL effect their long-term business model. NBC has no control over your family, and can't cause you to be shunned.

  But if you think JWN isn't on their radar (esp after that Anon hacking incident, with you in the middle of that thread), I'd say YOU are under-estimating the threat, since they're fueled by religious conviction and would put much more resources into tracking down "apostates" who make waves (esp those still lurking in the cong, for their own reasons) vs an ordinary content owner who uses the normal "DMCA" abuse process.

  If the Watch Tower Society wants to move heaven and earth to come after little 'ol me - they're welcome to try.

  Don't flatter yourself: you're no Julian Assange, and they don't have to moce "heaven and Earth". Outing you would cost WTBTS no more than probably a few hundred in legal fees, sending a few e-mails/FAXes between branches, and a few hours of writing a complaint and filing with a court. Done and done. You wouldn't even know.

  Now as far as this:

  Listen, I understand you're just trying to bring some rationalism to the board, but I disagree with you on two key issues:

  • This "masturbation" debacle is NOT about making fun of deaf people or sign language - those are apologist arguments. This is about making fun of the Society's ridiculous and deeply invasive laws and the serious lapse in judgment that led to two interpreters demonstrating what Jehovah's Witnesses SHOULDN'T be doing in such a needlessly graphic way (including the facial expressions).

  Then you need to find a better way of honing in and hitting your target, but don't use the deaf or hearing-impaired.

  You can deny it all you want, but you are refusing to understand that ASL is composed NOT just of the hand signs, but the FACIAL EXPRESSIONS as well, which are often over-stated and exaggerated to facilitate communication amongst the deaf (much as actors in the theatre will over-do THEIR expressions). It's NOT "needlessly graphic, including facial expressions" although I know you wish it WERE. Those facial expressions that amuse you so much ARE part of the ASL language, and it's considered part of "adaptive language". Your shock value here reflects your OWN ignorance of ASL.

  You DO realize those translators in the video actually ARE deaf, right? You want to tell them how to speak their own language, telling them that they should "tone it down, as it's gratuitious", since it offends you, a hearing person? Do you realize how absolutely condescending that is, and how offensive YOU are?

  Further, ANYONE who understands the basics of the Americans with Disabilities Act will tell you that you're barking up a wrong tree here, as you're howling and giggling at the odd appearance of a protected group who are simply using adaptive measures to engage in daily activities of life (communication being the most basic).

  Even if you don't see that, realize you are NOT going to win any points in the hearts and minds of anyone who possesses even an ounce of empathy in their heart, as you seem quite willing to throw those struggling to get by and throw them under the bus to exploit their language to for your own agenda.... What you're doing IS analogous to exploiting the funny appearance of someone who stutters, or has a cleft palate, etc, relying on the shock value to make a point unrelated and not limited to the deaf only (as EE has shouted from the roofs, this is NOT a deaf-only issue, but a WT policy that applies to ALL JWs).

  Again, you can't learn about compassion or empathy by reading about it, but maybe a visual aid would help? At least learn something about the condition you wish to exploit it:

  http://www.pbs.org/weta/throughdeafeyes/

  http://www.pbs.org/wnet/soundandfury/culture/index.html

  (I'm sure the actual shows are available on-line, but you'll have to find it.)

  • You have been here for two months and you already feel it is your duty to enforce the posting guidelines and tell people what they should or shouldn't be including in their posts. I personally find this more than a little presumptuous, and I would appreciate hearing some of your background before taking any lectures from you.

  I'm not "enforcing" anything here: it's up to users to self-police their own posts, and understand the policy. Try again...

  (I do a fair amount of posting of others content, but the difference is I'm not posting material of those who are likely to care, and I'm willing to consider the copyright implications first, and not trying to hide.)

  In the case of your lectures toward me, it appears as though you are trying to intimidate me for some reason, and I do NOT appreciate that from anyone, let alone some guy who's been here for 2 months.

  Sorry, I wasn't aware that truth operated on a seniority system.

  In my World, at least, all that matters is evidence-based facts: BS and seniority walks. That seniority crap and "earned privileges" is JW talk. As I said, I tried to warn: let no good deed go unrewarded, huh?

  I also think your essay-like replies are WAY too long. If you're so right over such simple issues, then surely a man of your obvious intelligence can express yourself more succinctly.

  Yeah, well I like to be comprehensive, but that's a style matter, isn't it? Ironic, as once again, YOU are deeming to tell others how THEY should communicate, just like the deaf? Ironic, no?

  Fortunately, if you check the posting policy you'll see there is NO RULE that you have to read every word of every post. I don't, and often skim posts before deciding which I actually care to read (and like everyone else, I do pay attention to some posters more than others, eg it's fun to read post where I can learn, eg Leolaia's comprehensive posts, or NCs well-thought-out offerings; there are plenty of others, as well).
• 

  cedars

  King Solomon

  Well,using more emoticons then, as there's truly no telling with you

  Not content to tell me what material I can or can't put in a post, you're now ordering me to use more emoticons?

  you've earned a rep for being blinded by WT hatred

  With who exactly? You're the very first person to ever accuse me of being "blinded by WT hatred". Mind you, an opinion carries more weight when you have a fictional army of supporters who agree with you.

  I do enjoy being lectured like this by a newbie. Carry on...

  even bite the hand of those who dare to disagree with you

  So now I'm biting people's hands? At least you're not using over-dramatic generalizations to try and stigmatize me. Oh wait, you are!! Probably you're referring to one of the many heated discussion in which I've been involved over the past year - usually with slimboyfat. He, like you, accuses me of malice when I put forward my opinion. Being forthright is clearly something only you are privileged to.

  Heck, maybe this is your way of expressing an unconscious "DF wish".

  Now you're pretending you know all about me and psycho-analyzing me?

  If the Watch Tower Society wants to move heaven and earth to come after little 'ol me - they're welcome to try.

  Don't flatter yourself: you're no Julian Assange. Outing you would cost WTBTS no more than probably a few hundred in legal fees, a few e-mails, and a few hours of writing a complaint. Done and done....

  I'm not flattering myself. I'm using sarcasm to highlight your ridiculous scenario on the previous page, in which you tried to intimidate me by claiming it was easy for the Society to find out who I am. Well guess what, I KNOW THAT! If they really wanted my ass, they could hire investigators and piece things together in a heartbeat. They would also need to show this as the basis of my judicial committee, and admit to going to these lengths to "out" me. So that alone would be "newsworthy" among our community and put them in a bad light - that they can go to such extreme lengths to "out" their members. I've been through this scenario with those I work with, and we agreed that the scandal of the Society pursuing me in this fashion likely isn't worth their while from a PR perspective. You're not giving me any new information - only totally unexpected intimidation from nowhere.

  I certainly don't claim to be any Julian Assange. Apparently the sarcasm was only lost on you because you take everything so seriously. If anyone is "flattering me" with unwarranted hype over possible outing, it is you. You brought all this up, completely out of the blue I might add.

  So I, in good faith, accepted your reason, so then tried to warn you and others (ex Billy) that you're jeopardizing being rooted out by posting on JWN because it's MUCH EASIER to out you here

  That was my reason and still is. Just because I would be resigned to the fact if they moved heaven and earth to find me doesn't make my stance any different. In any case, I don't need to give an account to you for my actions, for you to graciously accept my explanation "in good faith". Who do you think you are?

  What a wacko...

  Cedars
• 

  King Solomon

  OK, you get the final word....

  Cedars said:

  What a wacko...
• 

  cedars

  lol, more hate filled ranting from Professor Newbie...

  Even if you don't see that, realize you are NOT going to win any points in the hearts and minds of anyone who possesses even an ounce of empathy in their heart, as you seem quite willing to throw those struggling to get by and throw them under the bus to exploit their language to for your own agenda....

  Now I'm throwing people under buses to further my agenda?

  Why is King Solomon going for my throat like this all of a sudden? I don't get it. I really don't.

  Cedars
• 

  mrsjones5

  No I get the last word....wanker.
• 

  Theocratic Sedition

  lol did you enjoy that mrs.jones?