Ah, Sulla is back, I see, spreading the word, calling names, rarely making a point that can be defended with anything other than "You're an idiot" or "THE POPE!".
Atheist Book of Bible Stories
by crystlew123 76 Replies latest jw friends
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poopsiecakes
I read scripture like a Catholic.
Well, I think we've isolated the issue. Sulla, the issue is not that we see the bible with JW eyes - that's gone and it's why we see the bible for what it really is. You should try it sometime. :)
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Sulla
That's what you think is going on here, EP? Revealing.
Poops, I think you miss the point. Most people here read scripture ust like they used to as JWs, just without the belief that the JWs figured out the secret code. Exact same level of sophistication, though, sorry to say.
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poopsiecakes
Well ding dong stinky kong! We can agree that there is no secret code to figure out in the bible...I love it.
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still thinking
Heaven...Imagine what those people thought of that plane or helicopter that was flying above them.
ALIENS!!!! ?
THey had angered the gods?
Demons/wicked spirits?
The end of the world?
I'd love to know what belief system they actually have. Is there a link for them. I'm going to have a look on wiki.
[edit] here some video footage of there home in the amazon.
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Sapphy
Sulla, if your aim is to demonstrate the superiorty / relevence of the Catholic/Orthodox interpretation of scripture fine. But you're not showing Christlike patience.
All JWs are taught the bible is the inspired word of God, and that there are no contradictions that cannot be sucessfully interpreted away.
The first step for many is the realisation that the bible is not literally true, since there are irreconcilable differences in some of the stories. After that, there may be a rejection of Christianity as a whole, an exploration of other faiths or interpretations or a complete rejection of religion.
You say: " It is apparently a great and underappreciated advantage to know that the OT is not 21st century history. "
Cutting through the contempt you feel for others, what you mean is the OT in not literal or accurate history. Fine, most scholars agree, but this is a huge step for awakening JWs to realise.
You also say "Ok. I can see now that asking people on this board to approach the OT with even the smallest amount of sophistication simply won't work. I blame the JW bias against education, on display here."
I would appreciate you cutting out the snark.
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EntirelyPossible
Nah, I just thing you're a mouthy internet tough guy that falls back on (or starts with) insults because you are trying to defend the indefensible. Lame.
Insults are the last refuge of the incompetent.
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King Solomon
EP said:
Insults are the last refuge of the incompetent.
Well, in all fairness to Sulla, he seems to be insulting not just us, but also himself. For example, he self-inflicted this:
Sulla said: I read scripture like a Catholic.
That's actually a line that would make a pretty good come-back: "Oh, yeah? Well, you read scripture like a CATHOLIC!"
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NewChapter
The sophisticated way to approach the bible is the same as we approach any other ancient document. They are as close to primary source as we get. I see it as a story that was relevant to the culture that wrote it. It is how they understood themselves. It is a historical document, but accuracy isn't the highest priority. The highest priority was to give this group an origin and cohesion in an ever expanding world.
It's a lot like analyzing the Law Code of Hammurabi. While it is full of gods and godesses, it also tells us a great deal about the people and how they viewed themselves. Since there was a cost to rent oxen, and it was coins, we know that they had mastered metallurgy and agriculture. Other passages talk of irrigation systems. We also see the culture was stratified, as different penalties applied differently according to what class a person belonged to.
The Hebrews felt they had the mightiest god around, and so when they suffered defeat by people that worshipped other gods, it was not that their god was weaker, but they as a people had invited the mightiest god's disapproval. He's still the toughest on the block.
But as far as being a book of overwhelming wisdom or morals, it is not the only source. Human cultures have always developed moral codes and wisdom independent of this book, and often some people would consider some of their codes superior to this book's code. So there are things to learn from the bible, but not how to be a good person. We actually figure that out across the board. We also figure out how to be bad people, if we wish, but it will happen with or without this book.
Some morals are pretty universal. Take stealing. Depending on how you view it, this social contract was necessary for individuals and the group to prosper. Nobody is going to spend a lot of time on something if it is going to be stolen. For instance, when we look at the tools that primitive man made, we can discern when this social contract came into being. The tools became more advanced and intricate. Flint knapping is loud. So if a person thought the tool would just be taken anyway, they will not be spending a great deal of time making it, all the while announcing to the world that they are doing so.
Yet as most morals go, they apply more fully to those within a group than to those without. It is fine to invade a territory and steal everything from the outsiders, but would be theft if done within the group.
Yeah, there are different approaches to the bible, and it has its uses---spirituality is not one of them.
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Knowsnothing
I read scripture like a Catholic.
Can you elaborate a bit more? What do you choose to accept and reject as "truth"? Does the Bible hold any concrete meaning for you, or is it just a good moral framework, in your opinion?