Yes, for good reason appellation Father is dominant in the NT over Jehovah

by QC 48 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  NoStonecutters

  Phizzy said:

  "The point of particular note is that the NWT inserts "Jehovah" with little warrant in the cases were writers quote from the Septuagint, and no warrant whatsoever elsewhere, if they actually believed they would have been too fearful to put it 11 times in Revelation, with Rev.containing explicit instruction not to add to it !

  Why does the NWT do this ? it is to hide and obfuscate the obvious references to the divinity of Christ."

  Exactly, Phizzy. And not only that, even if you discard the Septuagint, the Masoretic text is unreliable. The Masoretes were Talmudists. If the insertion of the Kabbalist tetragrammaton was unwarranted, so it was when they attempted to pervert the prophecy of a virgin conceiving. Additionally, the Septuagint predates the Masoretes.

  Consider this: the tetragrammaton is central to Masonic rites; whereas, the name of Jesus is forbidden to be uttered in Masonic lodges.
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  designs

  Phizzy- I agree. The Society use to sell many Translations, and to some extent the public had access to works they never would have known about- I have my Byington, Smith-Goodspeed and Moffatt thanks to the Society. When the early American Standard stopped being printed or was replaced with modern version the Society may have felt the public was underserved and lacked a translation that used Jehovah liberally. Fred definitely had his wish list for a Translation that would make or break him in the academic community. His little green opus sure got around.
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  QC

  @prologos

  The little flock was the small nr. of disciples in Jesus' day ,

  Hmmmmmm… interesting points. I’ll take a closer look…

  @yadda

  Very interesting QC,

  “If you know that he is righteous, you gain the knowledge that EVERYONE who practices righteousness has been born from him [God].” 1Jn 2:29 NWT “His own did not receive him... Yet ALL who receive him... believe in his name, he gave the right 2 to become children (sons AV ) of God.” Jn 1:11-13 NIV

  2 exousia G1849 : privilege, capacity, freedom, mastery, control; from exesti G1832 —in the sense of ability;

  i.e. God extends to each offspring of Adam the ability to CHOOSE to be “born anew” into the family of Jesus;

  Adam descendants can accept or reject this life reprieve from Adamic death.

  @Phizzy

  obvious references to the divinity of Christ.

  Of course divinity is not to be confused with equality with the Father.

  “Us…you may become participants of the divine nature.” 2Pe 1:4
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  Pterist

  Prologos ...**** QC great bottom line. really, ALL CHRISTIANS ARE THE "ISRAEL OF GOD" THE TWELVE SPIRITUAL TRIBES OF REV 7 (MINUS DAN &EPHRAIM) The little flock was the small nr. of disciples in Jesus' day, who at the time still had an earthly hope. The "other sheep" are the gentiles that were not of the FOLD of old ISRAEL.****

  Concur.....just like those baptized into Moses, not all were priests only the few....the majority were NOT priests, however ALL had the same baptism into Moses ...And also today....All are baptized into Christ, one baptism, one Spirit, one faith......a kingdom of 1. Priests AND 2. A Holy NATION of all non priests.

  Shalom
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  QC

  @prologos

  @Pterist

  There is therefore no real distinction between the makeup of the three entities of Rev.7, a) the 12 tribes of the Israel of God, the Christian congregation, b) the 144 000 that are sealed from among them, destined for heaven and c) the great crowd. The distinctive feature of the great crowd is its disorganized state after having come out of the great tribulation.

  So, both of you believe: a, b, c, are essentially the same, destined for heaven?
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  Bobcat

  Marked.
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  prologos

  SEARCHER: 11 or 12 Yes, point well taken; It matters not wether 11 or 12 ( +or- Judas) partook of the wine and bread.

  Jesus died for all, even Judas, that he,- AFTER (perhaps) partaking did the deed of betrayal, was his big undoing. (he would not be the last one to be replaced, see the past - 1935 "replacements only" wt flip-flop debacle).

  Good point that you differentiated between the New Covenant (the emblems) for forgiveness and the later that night and earlier proposed KINGDOM rule covenant !!!

  PTERIST: The whole old nation of Israel was " a kingdom of priests" in the sense that it was the distinct national business to mediate, or provide a venue between mankind and God (as the story goes). like:

  "The business of America is BUSINESS" quote. so would it not be the same, for the whole Christian Congregation?

  Qc: I am not sure whether or not all will ultimately end up in heaven. In what relative position in heaven?

  If there is any, clearer, more profound truth behind the unbelievable bible fables,

  could the material (earthly) resurrection perhaps really be UNIVERSE-wide?

  when the universe cools, expands, peters out -- (peter's prediction of a new heavens and earth notwithstanding), will all significant creatures have a heavenly, spiritual transformation into heaven? .

  So, for me: The jury is out on that one. on all counts.

  love this forum and its contributors.
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  Bobcat

  Prologos:

  PTERIST: The whole old nation of Israel was " a kingdom of priests" in the sense that it was the distinct national business to mediate, or provide a venue between mankind and God (as the story goes). like:

  I posted some research on this subject here (my post 653). Linked for interest sake.

  Take Care
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  prologos

  "Jesus died for Judas too"? what I meant is, at the time of pronouncing John Chapter 6 and the passing of the emblems, (and Judas perhaps partaking), the ransom was carte-blanche offered for all. Judas betrayal as the "son of destruction" took place BEFORE the giving and presenting of the ransom, so for two reasons, it did finally not benefit him. But while with Jesus at the meal, it was legitimate to partake. Jesus did not stop him.
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  designs

  Some of the earliest Church Fathers (Origen, Clement, John Chrysostum and about 20 others) taught Apokatastasis (Universal Salvation) a idea taught by the Pharisees and other Jewish groups for 100s of years prior to Jesus. It is popular again in the modern Catholic Church. In this idea Jesus is to present the human family to the Father 'God of Love' whole and intact. Judaism, without a son of god doctrine, felt similarly that all with be redeemed by the one Father of all.